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Should Michigan and Florida delegates be seated?
If so, should they rehale a primary or should the DNC take the delegates as they are...?
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Obama believe that Hillary Clinton win of Michigan and Florida was more of a beauty contest. He said if Michigan and Florida delegates ( or people voices heard ) ares to be seated... these two states should rehale a primary.
My opinion: I dont know if the two states should rehale a primary... on the other hand it will be good due to the the state of Michigan would get more attention from the public. Although if Obama wasnting trying to go over heads and hills... taking his name off the the Michigan ballot ( he didnt do so with Florida, and Florida broke the same rule ) it would be alot easier in deciding what delegate goes where. So now he just may find himself in a hole from a leap he took trying to please Iowa and New Hampshire. ( I hear some say if he didnt take his name off the Michigan ballot, he would have not won Iowa, and his votes in New Hampshire wouldnt have been that great. Leading to him dropping out of the race.)
At the moment I dont know if Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama should win the Democratic race.
If they allow these delegates to be counted (as they should, the Dems are always saying "every vote must count... unless you live in FL or MIchigan"), Hillary would win and the radical wing of the DEms (who is behind Obama) would go wild and riot.
There is no way they'd re-do the election in these states. They will keep their votes from being counted so Obama can win.
Federico Pena, an Obama national co-chair just said that Hillary chose to "break the DNC rules" by staying on that ballot in Michigan. WTF? Are these people smoking crack?
The DNC rules only stated that campaigning was forbidden. Fundraisers were approved. There was nothing in the rules that even suggested that Obama make the critical mistake of removing his name from the ballots. The rules also didn't stop Obama from lobbying HARD to get people tovote "uncommited" in Michigan. Nr did it stop him from running a campaign ad in Florida in CLEAR violation of the DNC rules .
Congratulations to the NAACP. It's nice to see at least one respectable African American organization not assuming the travesties of this election cycle are race-based. I just heard him speaking. He stated that and I am paraphrasing, "I was elected as head of the NAACP to protect and fight for individual rights and to address any wrongs being committed against them wherever they may occur. " Hudos to you Mr. Bond. Finally, a voice of reason in the midst of the insanity.
NAACP National Chair says count Florida & Michigan
Former Georgia state Representative and current Chairman of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People (NAACP) Julian Bond penned a letter to Howard Dean in which he wrote, "we are deeply concerned that not finding a solution to this dilemma that recognizes the will and intent of Florida and Michigan voters could cast troubling aspirations on the democratic process of selecting candidates in a fully and equally inclusive manner."
Well, maybe ol' Julian was not talking for the NAACP. Why should we count the numbers now when during the contest the DNC siad the numbers wouldn't count? Doesn't make sense.
Well, maybe ol' Julian was not talking for the NAACP. Why should we count the numbers now when during the contest the DNC siad the numbers wouldn't count? Doesn't make sense.
Perhaps it's this part: "As Chairman of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People, I am writing to discuss..."
It makes perfect sense in the context of voter disenfranchisement. We can argue various points and spin things to favor either Hillary or Obama, but, in the end, it all comes back to silencing the votes and voices of 2.2 million Americans. Are you prepared to take that step and set such a slippery-slope precedent in order to advance a particular candidates nomination?
That's why I get confused when Obama talks about changing the "Politics of the past". That is the very definition of the "politics of the past".
The NAACP has now stepped forward and said that voter disenranchisement anywhere and for any reason cannot be, should not be, and will not be tolerated. Women fought for suffrage; Blacks sure as hell fought and died for suffrage. (After fighting and dying to be viewed as whole people, as opposed to 3/5's of a person.) How can Barack Obama honestly stand up and say, especially given his African American heritage, that ANY voters voice should be silenced?
How can Barack Obama honestly stand up and say, especially given his African American heritage, that ANY voters voice should be silenced?
Oh, give it a rest! Wrapping the primary scheduling into voter franchisement? That's not it. No one was silenced.
Let folks vote in the general election. There was no one to vote for in MI or FL because they did not hold a Democratic primary or caucus. Anyone who wanted to could vote for any other party so all had the right to vote.
I already wrote a long post on this subject and started a thread last week, but I will say this in response to your comment.
Over a million residents in FL voted for Hillary Clinton. More than 1.5M votes went to the polls and many voted early or
with absentee ballots. How can you possibly write that people didn't vote because they thought their vote didn't count when a very important tax amendment was on the ballot? It was a record turnout!
The people who didn't vote were either not registered voters or aren't people who would vote in a primary anyway. IMHO anyone who is responsible votes when given the opportunity. Saying "it doesn't count" is a lame excuse.
I still would really like someone to explain to me why the (Republican) Florida legislature, run by the (Republican) Florida governor voted to move the date only one week ahead when they knew the delegates would be unseated.
This make no sense whatsoever. So are you saying that all the votes in Iowa, New Hampshire and the other states where people voted early don't mean anything? Are you saying that had we voted just one week later in the primary (when it would have counted) we wouldn't have actually voted for the right candidate? Or is it that people should always watch the news, listen to the media and vote for the frontrunner? Obama spent millions (think it was $12 million) on TV advertising in Florida during the weeks before the Jan 29 primary. Explain to me why he now says the votes don't count.
I can't explain to you why HE says the votes don't count. You will have to ask HIM. I'm speculating (as only we all can do) that had he known that the delegates in Florida counted, he might've done more than TV advertising. If a candidate knows that that delegates in a state will not be counted, why would he spend a lot of time and money there? His strategy would be different had the delegates counted, get it?
What people should do, I can't speak to. What they ARE doing is overwhelmingly favoring Obama. Recognize that.
I didn't say that "all the votes in Iowa, New Hampshire and the other states where people voted early don't mean anything", you said that.
The bottom line is that:
1) Pompous, arrogant Hillary Clinton thought she had this nomination in the bag. She pranced around smiling, doing nothing but giving sound bites and a hollow message, thinking that even the DMC has structured the states in a manner to maximize her winning.
2) Enter Barack Obama. Dynamic, brilliant, charismatic, substantive, exudes character, depth, and class. Supremely educated. He's a black man who overcame the type of excessive adversity that only black men are forced to confront every single day of their lives. He's a survivor. Adversity has revealed the character within and standing next to Hillary, she looks like Yosemite Samantha and he looks like God. She sounds like a flea market jug saleswoman, he sounds like a wealthy, dignified General, born and bred to assume the role of the leader of the most powerful nation on the planet. She appears like a used Ford Escort. He looks like a Royse Royce. Her message is more suitable for selling discounted merchandise at Walmart. His message is meant to run the country, which brings me to 3.
3) The more people hear Obama, the more he is preferred. This has been happening at an alarming rate. Alarming!
4) More states are favoring him and the gap for each state is INCREASING. Hillary, unaccustomed to being opposed or dealing with adversity because she never had to deal with such moving under the radar all of her protected life, is in a FREE-FALL. She's desperate. Not even her husband, the "popular" 2-term president can help her. Hillary is desperate.
5) She voted for the war and can't shake this.
6) Barack is outearning her.
7) She had to contribute money to her own campaign. Did I say that she is DESPERATE?
8) Her campaign managers had been fired and you can bet that they are glad to bail out of this sinking ship.
9) Hillary is DESPERATE.
10) I wholeheartedly (like many of my well-educated colleagues) continue to support Obama's campaign and we give generously. I also take great personal pleasure in reading about the many Obama haters, who are laughable in their senseless condemnation of a man who is making history and will be the next President of the US. Barack Obama.
Had Michigan and Florida held their primaries this weekend, instead of violating DNC mandates and pushing them ahead of SuperTuesday, both these states would have recieved far more campaign interest than just about any state outside of New Hampshire and Iowa.
10) I wholeheartedly (like many of my well-educated colleagues) continue to support Obama's campaign and we give generously. I also take great personal pleasure in reading about the many Obama haters, who are laughable in their senseless condemnation of a man who is making history and will be the next President of the US. Barack Obama.
I will enjoy the personal pleasure of pointing out every single failed promise Obama breaks. I'm also 100% certain that he will do little to combat terrorism or the economic problems we face. Fluff doesn't cut it.
Michigan and Florida delegates have the right to be counted, whether a primary is reheld or not. Many say Obama choose not to put his name on Michigan ballot not to break the rules. I seen it as getting more favortism from the early states to vote before Michigan ( not winning those states: like Iowa, he may have dropped out earlier in the race, because many would believe he just dont have a chance.) Well I guess Obama decided to break a rule when he seen Clinton do so, because he placed his name on the Florida ballot. So what on earth was he thinking not placing it on Michigan, but so to Florida?
I could go on and on.... on many mistakes Obama made in the race... and also Hillary. Overall I'm almost clueless on who should win the race at the moment.
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