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jasper may I try to answer that? At least for our situation?
Our son is our birth son and our daughter is adopted. From the moment of birth son was in a constant struggle with me. I wanted him to be born on or near his due date. He wanted to come 6 weeks early. I wanted him to nurse. He wanted a bottle and on and on it went until he was about 21 when he stopped fighting me and we became great friends. The daughter was little Miss Compliance. Did everything expected of her and more. At 20 and with her first serious boyfriend she became a Royal PITA. We got past that stage and things are on a even keel now at age 28.
I used to say "It's a good thing son is not the adopted one cause it would be so easy to blame our problems on his being adopted." Some kids are just more of a challenge than others.
This is just so true! I could so easily project the strange and foreign traits of my son, on to adoption. Only I can't. Because I gave birth to that kid.
Conversely, my daughter and I share many traits and quirks. From foods we really like, colors, and a general outlook on life. It would be easy to say "You can tell C is a (insert maiden name) she such a good student and loves gymnastics and cheer- We have a third generation cheerleader here!"
And I made a triptych photo display of that. My mom in the early 50s me in the late 70s and my daughter now.
Except the first two girls in the triptych have fair skin and green eyes. One is auburn haired with a smattering of freckles on her nose wearing a long circle cut skirt and a bulky sweater, the next is a blond with long strait 70s style hair, and the third a ravishing Asian brunette with a tumble of hot ironed curls.
The funny thing is that we are standing in the same position!
We attribute traits to our kids - adopted or not adopted that reaflect our selves. And doing so is a very human thing.
Our families are walid, real, and natural. They just came about in another way.
I have no doubt that a number of adoptions are short of ideal. In fact, some adoptions have been to abusive and neglectful parents. You can read occasional stories in the newspaper about it.
Nevertheless, one can't lose sight of all the hoops that prospective adoptive parents must jump through to get where we get. In the case of my wife and I (who adopted thirteen years ago) it included detailed financial information, numerous interviews with social workers, medical information to show we were in good health, employment references, criminal background check, and written answers by us to numerous questions. It also included going to workshops on things like babycare and first aid. On the days when I was frustrated with the process, I sometimes compared it to a "congressional investigation".
Don't get me wrong. I think this is a good process and if society is going to allow adoption than something like this is essential. I'm all for it. We were able to jump all the hoops. I know many people could not because of financial, marital, or medical problems.
However, having done all that I don't think its fair to compare the average single parent with us. People don't have to pass any test, or exam to give birth to a biological child. Its just the way it is.
So, when someone sits there and suggests that as a group that adoptive parents are no better than biological parents, I start to wonder what they base that assumption on. The only possible criteria could be some notion that "biological parenting is always superior to adoptive parenting". That's a notion that I don't share and that I don't think most of the people out there share. BTW, it isn't a question of "entitlement" on my part because as a purely philosophical question I don't really believe anyone is "entitled" to anything.
The bottom line is if you take 100 people in a group that is tested with the lower scorers excluded and than train that group the people in it are generally going to perform better at any task than 100 people in a group chosen totally at random. That's true of going to graduate school, getting a job, or raising a child. People who won't acknowledge this as a general rule are simply in denial.
Finally, I have never suggested to my children once that they should be grateful that they were adopted. If they get that idea from somewhere else in society there isn't much we can do about it other than explain that we adoptive parents are the ones who are grateful. That's how I feel.
I don't see anyone saying "biological parenting is always superior to adoptive parenting". However, neither is it true that "adoptive parenting is always superior to biological parenting".
In regards to being adopted, the one thing we ALL have in common is that ALL adoptees are born into one family and raised in another.
In effect,their identity is erased from their first family and they are "as if born to" the second family.
Society considers the "ideal adoptee" to be someone who says things along the lines of "My adoptive family is my only family, I want nothing to do with biological family". If you ask that "ideal adoptee" whether they would rather have been born into and raised in their adoptive family, they will often say yes. Thus, in effect, they would rather that adoption had never been part of their life at all.
So in effect, the "ideal adoptee" is one who wishes adoption wasn't in their lives.
I am not an "ideal adoptee" because I believe both sets of parents are important to making "what makes me me" - I never realised how true that was until I did meet my biological family and get to know about my bmother. I now understand myself better than I did before.
Many adoptees are happy going through life without ever knowing their nature side and I may well have said beforehand I was one of them. However, I now could never go back to not knowing.
Btw I am very much like biological family and fit in there in a way that I don't in my afamily. Before you say "Oh, I'm sorry you had a bad experience", I didn't have a bad upbringing at all, I love my afamily very much - it is just that we are different personalities. I do enjoy my amom's company (well, most of the time lol) but am very different to her.
I am also completely in awe of the power of a PLANNED and LONGED FOR FAMILY!
When thinking of the parents that some - many - adoptive children are born of, one must certainly be impressed with the low percentage of maladaptive adoptive children.
I'm glad you don't underestimate genetics. I am sure that the reason your daughter is so wonderful is a mixture of good genetics and good nurturing.
I am sure you will agree that your daughter's genetics is in no way inferior to your own.
Having met my biological family, I know that I come from good genetic stock. Many of us in the 50s, 60s and 70s did.
My biological genes are in no way inferior to my adoptive parents genes.
Our families are walid, real, and natural. They just came about in another way.
No one is saying afamilies aren't real or valid, that seems like an insecurity. Obviously both my families are very real & very valid. I do think the word natural is an odd way to describe losing one family to be raised by another, though.
There are some things that will be caused by adoption issues, some things that are caused by nurture & socialization, & some things caused by nature. Many things will be a mix of all the above & all of them are equally important. To downplay one is to downplay a huge part of what makes someone who they are.
No one is saying afamilies aren't real or valid, that seems like an insecurity. Obviously both my families are very real & very valid. I do think the word natural is an odd way to describe losing one family to be raised by another, though.
There are some things that will be caused by adoption issues, some things that are caused by nurture & socialization, & some things caused by nature. Many things will be a mix of all the above & all of them are equally important. To downplay one is to downplay a huge part of what makes someone who they are.
This is just so true! I could so easily project the strange and foreign traits of my son, on to adoption. Only I can't. Because I gave birth to that kid.
Conversely, my daughter and I share many traits and quirks. From foods we really like, colors, and a general outlook on life. It would be easy to say "You can tell C is a (insert maiden name) she such a good student and loves gymnastics and cheer- We have a third generation cheerleader here!"
And I made a triptych photo display of that. My mom in the early 50s me in the late 70s and my daughter now.
Except the first two girls in the triptych have fair skin and green eyes. One is auburn haired with a smattering of freckles on her nose wearing a long circle cut skirt and a bulky sweater, the next is a blond with long strait 70s style hair, and the third a ravishing Asian brunette with a tumble of hot ironed curls.
The funny thing is that we are standing in the same position!
We attribute traits to our kids - adopted or not adopted that reaflect our selves. And doing so is a very human thing.
Our families are walid, real, and natural. They just came about in another way.
Often an adoptee will end up being more "like" their AP than their APs biological children while growing up because they are trying to fit in and thus deliberately take on certain traits so they can feel like they are more "like" their parents. The biological child feels more secure so they feel more able to "rebel" against their parents. Adoptees who "rebel" against their parents can often have their rebelliousness blamed on "bad genes". I'm not saying that is your situation but it is for many adoptees.
When growing up, my amom said we 2 girls were very much similar to her but that we are now very different as adults, more our natural selves. (I also have 2 abros).
Just with this:
We attribute traits to our kids - adopted or not adopted that reaflect our selves. And doing so is a very human thing.
I hope you also appreciate your daughter's differences as well.
In terms of words such as "real parents" "real children" and "natural child." I find all of these terms to be offensive.
Both of my children are real and natural. I am their real and natural mother, and my husband is their real and natural father/
I do not in any way feel that my daughter is trying to morph her self into a mini me OR that my son feels more free to do his own thing because I gave birth to him.
I was pointing out that people often reconstruct events so that they make seance.
To say that adoptive children are under some special pressure to conform is offensive and ludicrous.
That very sentiment brings to light your your innate hostility towards adoption. All children , adopted or not want to be like theor parents and different from them. I thinbk the developmental stages aree more similar to those of biological children than they are different.
In terms of words such as "real parents" "real children" and "natural child." I find all of these terms to be offensive.
Both of my children are real and natural. I am their real and natural mother, and my husband is their real and natural father/
I consider my adoptive mother and father and my biological mother and father to be my "real" mothers and fathers. This does not diminish either set of parents. I am a mixture of nature and nurture.
I do not in any way feel that my daughter is trying to morph her self into a mini me OR that my son feels more free to do his own thing because I gave birth to him.
I am not saying that is the case with your child at all but pointing out that it does happen because quite a few adoptees have stated that they feel that way.
I was pointing out that people often reconstruct events so that they make seance.
Of course one can't blame everything on being adopted but at the same time it is not necessarily true to say that being adopted, i.e. separated from one family and raised by another, is without any compromise at all for a child. What often happens is that one adoptee might say that one tiny thing in their life might have its origins in being relinquished/adopted and they are jumped on and told "how dare you blame everything in your life on being adopted" when often all the poor person is trying to do is just say that after a lot of thought, they have decided that one small thing might have to do with being adopted (I've seen that happen so often online, it's not funny). No-one who knows me IRL will ever hear me blame anything at all on adoption because it is hardly worth the bother to do so.
To say that adoptive children are under some special pressure to conform is offensive and ludicrous.
Again, many do - I did not say all. This is where it is important for the APs to be objective and honest when telling the child about their bparents.
That very sentiment brings to light your your innate hostility towards adoption. All children , adopted or not want to be like theor parents and different from them. I thinbk the developmental stages aree more similar to those of biological children than they are different.
I am hostile towards the Adoption Industry, both US domestic and International. The fact that adoption is an industry is an abomination in itself. I am not hostile towards biblical or the traditional informal adoptions as practised in some other cultures (eg Polynesian).
You are looking for problems when there are none.
No I was pointing out that there are in fact adoptees out there who feel those things I was talking about.
Many adoptions have been to abusive & neglectful parents. Let's not minimize this actual fact, as it is very triggering for abused adoptees who have to fight the tide of people who do not believe this is a real problem or happens frequently enough to matter.
Child abuse everywhere is a problem. It is present in all cultures, all races, and all economic groups. The reason I suspect there is less of it among adoptive parents is because of the homestudy requirements I've mentioned.
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Are you suggesting that abusers of all kinds cannot pass the home studies & other tests that are given, or be a well respected person in society? Because anyone who believes that is the one in denial.
Of course not. But you clipped out the most important part of my post. I said that if you took two groups of people--one that had been forced to meet a series of requirements before becoming parents--and compared it to one that had not, as a general rule there would be more abuse committed by the group which did not have to meet any requirements. Further, if home study requirements had no affect whatsoever in weeding out poor candidates to be parents than they wouldn't be in place. It would be an enormous waste of everyone's time.
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No, it is the notion that adoptive parents are no less likely to abuse than biological parents. Choosing to adopt & passing home studies does not automatically make someone superior, either, like you assume. Again, all one needs to do is consult the many adopted people who have been abused by the hands of their afamily to see that this is true. Domestic violence/sexual abuse is found across all classes/status/ethnic backgrounds, adoptive families are not magically removed from these statistics.
See above. I'm trying to understand if your argument is that "adoptive parents commit abuse and neglect at the same rate that birth parents do and so there is no point in having adoption"? Is that your point, or is it something else?
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I'm glad you've never suggested that to your children, but that doesn't mean they will not struggle to reconcile the idea at some point in their life. No, you can't help that... I am just trying to point out that there are many things adopted children have to come to terms with that non-adoptees never do. & no matter how loving, compassionate your adoptive family is... no matter how you try to explain things in a positive light, it can still impact us in varying degrees & at different stages in life. & that does help explain why teen & adult adoptees are overrepresented in mental health.
Many people have many challenges in life. Physical and mental diseases and disorders affect tens of millions of people in this country. I don't suggest that "coming to terms with adoption" is not a problem for some adoptees. However, it needs to be put in perspective. Being raised by an impoverished single parent presents a series of challenges of its own. Virtually all such pregnancies are unplanned and sometimes the parent actually bears animosity towards the child.
In terms of words such as "real parents" "real children" and "natural child." I find all of these terms to be offensive.
Both of my children are real and natural. I am their real and natural mother, and my husband is their real and natural father.
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