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Old 09-24-2012, 07:28 AM
 
1,879 posts, read 1,855,336 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gcm7189 View Post
I'm sure that all of the infertile couples who were not able to conceive at all, even with fertility drugs, would be very happy to hear a statement such as this one. I have not experienced infertility. I have been blessed with the experience of being pregnant and giving birth twice. But I can view those who do experience infertility with compassion and make an attempt to put myself in their shoes. And I would imagine that this sort of comment might feel very hurtful to someone who is infertile to the point of not being able to have a child at all. While I understand that secondary infertility exists, if one has successfully brought a pregnancy to term and given birth, this is not the same as being infertile to the point that you cannot have a child at all. My adoptive parents quite literally could not have children at all due a medical condition. There were no fertility drugs available at the time and treatment options for the medical condition did not exist (They do exist now. My adoptive cousin inherited the same condition and was able to successfully give birth). All they wanted was to have their own children. They wanted to experience the "hardships" of pregnancy and birth. Adoption was not "easy" for them at all.

It is my feeling that if a person has been pregnant and given birth, that person cannot speak entirely for those who are infertile to the point that they cannot have a child at all (even with fertility drugs). Because that person does not really know what it is like to not be able to have a child of their own.
My parents were similar. My parents were never able to conceive and I am sure they would have loved to go through a pregnancy. I think they would have had nice looking children (although shorter ones than us lol). However, they never mentioned it that much. I do have compassion for them not being able to conceive naturally.

Getting pregnant and giving birth was WAAAAAY easier than adoption

For my bmom, getting pregnant and giving birth were probably amongst the hardest times of her life - since she lost one child to adoption and then years later, twins to stillbirth. A few more years later, she then had a second trimester pregnancy loss but then ran out of time to have any more when she died 2 years after that.
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Old 09-24-2012, 07:56 AM
 
1,190 posts, read 1,417,141 times
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"To flip your coin, winterbird, the existence of happy adoptees doesn't make the positions of those of us expressing ambiguity any less valid. Just as you ask us to accept that there are no rules, please do not pathologize adoptees who say things that might be difficult for you to hear, or that are different."

MirrenC: There is absolutely nothing in my posts that even remotely suggests that I have pathologized or had difficulty hearing or accepting what anyone has experienced. Please don't project those issues onto me. Thank you.
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Old 09-24-2012, 08:14 AM
 
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Best wishes to everyone on your journeys through the wonderful maze of life.
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Old 09-24-2012, 08:31 AM
 
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I can make a request of someone and have it be a reasonable request. It is not "projecting my problems" onto you. I didn't say that you had done any pathologizing. I am simply asking you not to do any pathologizing of adoptees who express alternative viewpoints, just as you asked us all not to forget that there are happy adoptees. I think that is fair.
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Old 09-24-2012, 12:14 PM
 
Location: The Hall of Justice
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Please get back to the topic: adoption as a choice for infertile couples. Thanks.
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Old 09-24-2012, 03:03 PM
 
116 posts, read 85,184 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gcm7189 View Post
I'm sure that all of the infertile couples who were not able to conceive at all, even with fertility drugs, would be very happy to hear a statement such as this one. I have not experienced infertility. I have been blessed with the experience of being pregnant and giving birth twice. But I can view those who do experience infertility with compassion and make an attempt to put myself in their shoes. And I would imagine that this sort of comment might feel very hurtful to someone who is infertile to the point of not being able to have a child at all. While I understand that secondary infertility exists, if one has successfully brought a pregnancy to term and given birth, this is not the same as being infertile to the point that you cannot have a child at all. My adoptive parents quite literally could not have children at all due a medical condition. There were no fertility drugs available at the time and treatment options for the medical condition did not exist (They do exist now. My adoptive cousin inherited the same condition and was able to successfully give birth). All they wanted was to have their own children. They wanted to experience the "hardships" of pregnancy and birth. Adoption was not "easy" for them at all.

It is my feeling that if a person has been pregnant and given birth, that person cannot speak entirely for those who are infertile to the point that they cannot have a child at all (even with fertility drugs). Because that person does not really know what it is like to not be able to have a child of their own.
I agree.

My a-Mom told me that she and my a-Dad could not have children at all. There were no treatments at the time.

Juts a few years before her death, when Maine's adoptee access (to sealed birth certificates) was in the news (2007) and Senator Paula Benoit was on TV, my a-Mom (in her 90s) said, "I didn't get the chance to give birth. I missed all of that. You are right...your birth certificate says I gave birth, but I know I didn't. The legal records should reflect the truth."

I know I'm combining topics here. But the point I'm trying to make is that my a-Mom regretted very much that she could not get pregnant. At all. She did not miscarry. She did not have a still birth. Shw was incapable of getting pregnant. And it was not all due to her medical issues. My a-Dad had problems, too, so both combined made it so they could not get pregnant.

My a-Dad never once told me how he felt. It probably hurt him as he loved children. He didn't live long enough to see his grandchildren, but my a-Mom did. It hurt her to see me pregnant.

So I think this is very tragic - to not be able to have a child together.

But if someone already has had the experience of being pregnant and giving birth, this should be celebrated. Not being able to have another child is sad, but not to the same degree as not having that first child by conception and birth at all.

And yes, after I got my divorce, and I was with someone for a few years, we wanted children together. I was not able to as I was too old. We were not married and he was 9 years younger. I made the decision to break up with him so he could find someone who was his age. He was married 2 years later and they had a girl. I'm happy for them, and sad that I lost out. But I already had two children and he would not have any in the way he wanted if he had stayed with me.
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Old 09-24-2012, 04:30 PM
 
1,879 posts, read 1,855,336 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustJulia View Post
Please get back to the topic: adoption as a choice for infertile couples. Thanks.
In summary, my views are:

As a SOCIETAL reason, adoption should only be about "finding a home for child that needs one".

As a PERSONAL reason for choosing adoption, infertility is a perfectly valid reason and I don't think anyone one on here is saying it isn't.

As a reason for choosing international adoption over domestic adoption, I personally consider "not wanting anything to do with biological families" to be a selfish reason and I am entitled to that view as an adoptee because that reason is one that could affect a child.

Nothing I've said above can possibly be interpreted to mean that I think those suffering infertility should never be allowed to be parents and I am surprised there are those who still keep coming to that conclusion.

Last edited by susankate; 09-24-2012 at 04:39 PM..
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Old 09-24-2012, 04:47 PM
 
10,452 posts, read 10,593,664 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheena12 View Post
I do not down platy it one bit! When I married my natural expectation was that after a year or so we'd have a child.

Didn't happen. Was it plan B ? Only because it was easier and expected. No money needed. No one judged us. It was what was normal and expected.

I decided to stop fooling around with infertility drugs right away after my first child was born.

I didn't make this plan. God did. We are able to love people - children who are not flsh and blood as our own.

Are we possessive of our children? Yup sure. Of the one who grew beneath my heart anf the one who grew inside of my heart.

I think that if I were Gay or I knew in my teens that I would have had trouble becoming pregnant I would have adopted right away.

Getting pregnant and giving birth was WAAAAAY easier than adoption.
I didn't have you in mind when I made that post.

The fact you made this thread shows you are not one of the parents I was talking about.
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Old 09-25-2012, 12:38 AM
 
Location: The New England part of Ohio
18,586 posts, read 23,117,825 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by winterbird View Post
"To flip your coin, winterbird, the existence of happy adoptees doesn't make the positions of those of us expressing ambiguity any less valid. Just as you ask us to accept that there are no rules, please do not pathologize adoptees who say things that might be difficult for you to hear, or that are different."

MirrenC: There is absolutely nothing in my posts that even remotely suggests that I have pathologized or had difficulty hearing or accepting what anyone has experienced. Please don't project those issues onto me. Thank you.
This whole thing is one gigantic projection!
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Old 09-25-2012, 12:41 AM
 
Location: The New England part of Ohio
18,586 posts, read 23,117,825 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by winterbird View Post
Best wishes to everyone on your journeys through the wonderful maze of life.
Thanks and to you Winterbird! We are both going through a very exciting time right now.
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