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Old 05-22-2017, 05:39 PM
 
610 posts, read 467,970 times
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Originally Posted by caribny View Post

The bougie "Jack and Jill" type of AA are often "racist" towards black immigrants, so even if there is contact the black immigrant will stay away. This AA elite often want to establish how "American" they are as they seek to establish their own ties with the mainstream.

Recent immigrants measure their success by comparing themselves to the group that is at the bottom. Their need to succeed and to learn how to survive leads them to believe the narratives of those who they will need to be connected to in order to succeed. Invariably these will be white employers.

Whites also play a divide and rule game by telling them that they are "better" than AAs. Newly arrived immigrants tend to be less confrontational as they are still in their honeymoon stage of believing the "American Dream". So whites often feel comfortable with them.

Over time with missed promotions (due to implicit bias in the job market) and as their US born kids encounter issues these views evolve. While they will still distinguish themselves from AAs, and deplore the poorer segment, they begin to see themselves as blacks, even though with a highly defined pan ethnic identity. They will more likely confront situations where they see race being an issue, and will seek like minded AAs as allies.

They also begin to develop a network of professional AAs so understand that the issue of race isn't as simple as they initially thought. In addition their US born kids grow, and confront racism. These kids are less sheltered in the ethnic enclave, so interact more often with Americans, and also see themselves as Americans, therefore no less deserving of rewards.

Unlike their parents, who have the psychic security of returning home if the USA doesn't live up to its promise these kids feel that they must fight for change. Its no accident that some of the more militant actors in the Civil Rights movement had immigrant origins.


This post is mostly accurate but the first paragraph is seriously off the mark.

It has been my observation and personal experience that upper-middle and upper class African-Americans generally have a very good relationship with highly educated professional Africans and African immigrants.

In fact i would say that upper-middle & upper end black Americans and their african counterparts probably have the best relationship vs all of the other segments of the two communities.
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Old 05-22-2017, 11:03 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheArchitect View Post
.In fact i would say that upper-middle & upper end black Americans and their african counterparts probably have the best relationship vs all of the other segments of the two communities.
Educated AAs do but NOT the pretentious types in the Jack and Jill. Different type of Negro. Some of them still know where the infamous paper bag is even if too embarrassed to use it these days.
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Old 05-22-2017, 11:09 PM
 
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Originally Posted by lilgreenSDL View Post
.our communities look like crap...
Arguing with you on another forum. 18% of recent marriages involving blacks were interracial. This compares with 27% for Hispanics and 29% for Asians. Asian women outmarry at a 36% rate. Black women out marry at 12%. Clearly blacks outmarry LESS than do other minority groups. And in fact you can virtually argue that black women don't, because 12% is a very low number for a group which is only 13% of the female population.

Also are you implying that the Dominican and Puerto Rican communities in the Bronx look better than the black American/black Caribbean communities in South East Queens.

I will forgive you because you are young, but learn to research before you make your points, because then the good points that you might be making get lost. On that other forum some one is asking you why you think that Dominicans should be a role model that black Caribbean people should follow.
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Old 05-22-2017, 11:15 PM
 
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Originally Posted by AFP View Post
I'm not black but have don't some research on this topic. Several African countries are open to Black people from the America's moving there particularly if you have money to invest. I doubt you will be viewed as coming back by the locals you much more likely will be viewed as a rich foreigner with big money bags which everyone will want a piece of. In some cases if you are a black person with lighter skin pigmentation you will not even be viewed as a black person.
In Ghana they call black Americans the same word that they use for white Americans, and in fact laugh at Transatlantic blacks who think that they are "returning home". In fact a black American got into an argument with a Ghanaian taxi driver when he told her that she was lucky that her ancestors were dragged off as slaves, because now she lives in the USA. He having to figure out how to get a visa to get there, and as a taxi driver the prospects are remote.

AAs are indeed welcomed, if they arrive with resources, skills, connections and a pragmatic attitude. Skin color conversations bore, as if one is from a country where every one is black, yet serious divisions exist the notion of an automatic collaboration based on skin color will be seen as being bizarre.

It is perfectly understandable that a North American or European black will bond around race as they are minority groups which face exclusion from economic opportunity. But in Senegal they don't understand that. They just know that they don't trust those "pesky" Mauritanians, who most Americans will consider to be black, even if light skinned.

So yes an African might sooner bond with a black American than a white one, but if the black American only has "brother talk" they soon lose interest.
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Old 05-22-2017, 11:24 PM
 
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Originally Posted by jgn2013 View Post
Agreed.

.I'm curious to see how this plays out. My friend's cousin never really went through any kind of socialization with black kids and his wife (a very caring and sweet woman) attended all-white schools and had never dated a man that wasn't white prior to meeting her husband. The kids will have a strong sense of self regarding their white and African heritage...which is good. However, I don't know who'll be there to help them navigate the world as 'black' people. My friend's cousin has a pronounced accent and name that leaves no doubt where he's likely from. In some ways it seems to make him less threatening despite him actually being a physically intimidating guy. People that are uncomfortable around me will gladly invite him to their house lol!
In fact Obama went through this and had to "learn" how to be a black man in America.

The one thing that might happen is that they might find a narrow circle of liberal whites who will accept them. The world is now more open to diversity and their peer group will be more open minded than older people.

They will have a problem not only with US blacks (blacks who live in the USA despite their ethnic origin) but also Africans. Its a fact that mothers transfer most culture to kids, so lacking an African mother they will not be as African as they think.

The problem that they will have though is the encounter with a white person who doesn't know or care what their background is and only sees them as "black". As their accent is US they wouldn't enjoy their father's safety blanket as they wouldn't be "exotic".

I only hope that their father isn't filling their heads with nonsense about American blacks, implying that they are all "ghetto".
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Old 05-23-2017, 09:49 AM
 
Location: West of Louisiana, East of New Mexico
2,536 posts, read 2,033,357 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caribny View Post
In fact Obama went through this and had to "learn" how to be a black man in America.

The one thing that might happen is that they might find a narrow circle of liberal whites who will accept them. The world is now more open to diversity and their peer group will be more open minded than older people.

They will have a problem not only with US blacks (blacks who live in the USA despite their ethnic origin) but also Africans. Its a fact that mothers transfer most culture to kids, so lacking an African mother they will not be as African as they think.

The problem that they will have though is the encounter with a white person who doesn't know or care what their background is and only sees them as "black". As their accent is US they wouldn't enjoy their father's safety blanket as they wouldn't be "exotic".

I only hope that their father isn't filling their heads with nonsense about American blacks, implying that they are all "ghetto".

I don't think he'll say anything negative about blacks, but being around mostly privileged white kids will create the same result.

It's tough being bi-racial black American/white American. Being part African can be trickier if the African parent lacks any strong bonds with black Americans. The child can grow up in a world where they can't fully relate to anyone around them...no different than being the only black American kid at an all white boarding school or something. Obama learning how to be black is (interestingly enough) what helped him win the White House. Without that time on the South Side of Chicago, I'm not sure he'd have gone beyond being a high-end university law professor or elite attorney.
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Old 05-23-2017, 10:16 AM
 
Location: Historic West End
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One of the most powerful messages about blacks from the beloved Myles Munroe.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1h7JyCzYqVo&t=164s
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Old 05-23-2017, 10:24 AM
 
7,437 posts, read 5,947,563 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jgn2013 View Post
them...no different than being the only black American kid at an all white boarding school or something. Obama learning how to be black is (interestingly enough) what helped him win the White House. Without that time on the South Side of Chicago, I'm not sure he'd have gone beyond being a high-end university law professor or elite attorney.
A cousin of mine saw him walk onto the stage when he was feature speaker at the Dem convention. Her first thought was whether he was married to a "sister" or a white woman. Given that most black politicians win their first office in black communities I do think that his marriage to Michelle was instrumental. If he didn't win in that early race he would never have become president.

Having said that, being raised by whites gave him knowledge of how whites think, and I mean REALLY think, that most blacks aren't privy to. Most of us have to guess, because we don't know what happens when we aren't around. Clearly raised by whites, and isolated from blacks Obama got exposure to them to a far higher degree than most of us do. So he knows how to communicate with most of them, and to make them think that he is one of them. And to reassure them that they don't have to worry about him.

I maintain that we still haven't had our first "black" president, if by that we mean a man born and raised within the black community. We still have to see whether white America can accept a man who was born into and raised within a black cultural setting.

So I will say that by being born into a white family, but then marrying a black woman who taught him how to operate within black circles is what gave Obama an edge.
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Old 05-25-2017, 07:47 PM
 
Location: Harlem
21 posts, read 13,214 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caribny View Post
Arguing with you on another forum. 18% of recent marriages involving blacks were interracial. This compares with 27% for Hispanics and 29% for Asians. Asian women outmarry at a 36% rate. Black women out marry at 12%. Clearly blacks outmarry LESS than do other minority groups. And in fact you can virtually argue that black women don't, because 12% is a very low number for a group which is only 13% of the female population.

Also are you implying that the Dominican and Puerto Rican communities in the Bronx look better than the black American/black Caribbean communities in South East Queens.

I will forgive you because you are young, but learn to research before you make your points, because then the good points that you might be making get lost. On that other forum some one is asking you why you think that Dominicans should be a role model that black Caribbean people should follow.
Yes I am, not not from a condescending point of view. I'm talking about on a cultural level not a statistical one. I already pointed out before that black Americas GDP is 15th hightst in the world (look it up). And theyve been in america since the founding of it. So southeast queens, southeast bk and central harlem should be miles better then kingsbridge, marble hill, mott haven, inwood but its not. I was on merrick at my friends house not long ago, near merrick and liberty, like 108th ave or something like that. That hood has nothing good to eat, beauty shop, chinese food, bodega, dominos, 99cent store. smh its 2017, the bottom line is that black communites should be doing better. Alot of hispanic communities look like that too in terms of buying options, but the point im making is that the people seem happier in those communities and those communities are in fact growing. 15th highest gdp. its about blacks working together instead of competing against each other. Thats how institutions are built.
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Old 05-29-2017, 12:51 PM
 
4,434 posts, read 4,426,995 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caribny View Post
In Ghana they call black Americans the same word that they use for white Americans, and in fact laugh at Transatlantic blacks who think that they are "returning home". In fact a black American got into an argument with a Ghanaian taxi driver when he told her that she was lucky that her ancestors were dragged off as slaves, because now she lives in the USA. He having to figure out how to get a visa to get there, and as a taxi driver the prospects are remote.

AAs are indeed welcomed, if they arrive with resources, skills, connections and a pragmatic attitude. Skin color conversations bore, as if one is from a country where every one is black, yet serious divisions exist the notion of an automatic collaboration based on skin color will be seen as being bizarre.

It is perfectly understandable that a North American or European black will bond around race as they are minority groups which face exclusion from economic opportunity. But in Senegal they don't understand that. They just know that they don't trust those "pesky" Mauritanians, who most Americans will consider to be black, even if light skinned.

So yes an African might sooner bond with a black American than a white one, but if the black American only has "brother talk" they soon lose interest.
Again there both ignorance coming African Americans and Africans

The most hostile towards Africans comes from the lower class African Americans what they know about Africa is Tarzan.... so say they derogatory terms like African blank stretcher and etc ignorant hateful stuff. So they stay distant from Black Americans cause they this this what's doing to happen.

With Africans it's the same thing they don't know much about the history of slavery in the Americas, the jim crow era, and how blacks were treated as second class citizens until a few decades ago. They ignorantly believe Black Americans had a silver spoon in their mouths. So the Africans who call Blacks Americans "returning home" white people and laugh at them and etc is an example of ignorance.


Ignorance on both side leads each side to say something a white racist would to that group

Thinking Africa has no history, nothing sophisticated, nothing going for them self, savages..... this is stuff you aspect a white supremacy to think not another black group

Thinking black Americans are lazy, never accomplish anything, criminals...... this stuff again you aspect a white supremacy to think not another black group

Basically what happen is blacks overcame the slave or colonial minset to towards them own group. But kept the ignorance that came racism towards the other.

For dozen time it's not skin color it's ancestry, If Black Americans were identifying with skin color they would be identifying with People native to the south pacific, Aboriginal, Papuans and etc as well as some Indians have Dark skin. That's not what happening Black Americans are identifying with West and central Africa because that were there ancestors came from, they want to know about tribes and etc. Africa was colonized by European making Africa just as conscious of race as black Americans. They knew the natives were black and colonizers where white. If some in Africa identify with their ethnic group it's the same thing as saying black cause that's what black means.

Otherwise the Africans who are derogatory towards blacks Americans going to Africa are just as ignorant as the black Americans who are derogatory towards Africans when they come to America. The more educated Africans would understand and be more welcoming to Blacks Americans. The same with Africans coming to the US.
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