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Old 11-14-2015, 04:39 PM
 
16 posts, read 8,613 times
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Quote:
Those Northern Europeans consisted of different ethnic groups/tribes that had their own language, religious systems and customs before the Romans wiped it out. These people had little of anything to do with the foundations of Greek and Roman scientific, religious and philosophical concepts
They had little to do with the foundation but right now they are the continuation, Europe is small in size and doesnt have wide racial diversity as huge continents like Asia and Africa has, Europeans mingle together easily, they were all chrstians at some point in time, they adhered to same religion and values

Quote:
I posted a vast array of information that one could argue that Ancient Egypt had more in common with the rest of Africa than it did with the Middle East or Europe before Greek/Roman/Arab conquests.
you are talking culture wise, that is something i dont argue much about since it cant be determined easily, probably Egypt had influenced and got influenced by all these places surrounding it, but my problem here is racial wise and thats what we are debating about, to claim modern Egyptians are half breeds or foreign invaders while stealing our heritage and history from us is the point of argument
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Old 11-14-2015, 07:43 PM
 
3,513 posts, read 2,516,206 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkc2j View Post
What you're describing is cultural assimilation. Those Northern Europeans consisted of different ethnic groups/tribes that had their own language, religious systems and customs before the Romans wiped it out. These people had little of anything to do with the foundations of Greek and Roman scientific, religious and philosophical concepts, .
But these people helped to build and maintain the ampire and went on to utilze and exapnd on that knoweldge. It isn't at all hard to understand.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jkc2j View Post
which I would argue was borrowed from the Ancient Egyptians.
This is absoulte nonense. I have read Black Athena and there is not a shred of evidence presented. I can easily refute any point given just as I did the blackness of the Egyptians and the quotes of the ancients. People beleived this garbage before hieroglyphics were decifered, but there is now no way to amintain this fantasy.


The same applies to native peoples in the western hemisphere whom were conquered and forced to convert to Christianity, that didn't make those people magically become European. Same for Africans whom were stolen from Africa and dropped in the western hemisphere. Though these people adopted some of the customs and language of the European didn't make them European. There are several examples of customs from different ethnic/tribal groups from west and central Africa that were retained through music, food, religious/spiritual systems and dance, ie Voudon, Santeria, jazz, hip hop, reggae, funk, r&b, merengue, samba, and much more. This talk about black people in the western hemisphere some how being so culturally distant from native Africans in my opinion is not a good argument. If you read my previous posts from another similar thread I posted a vast array of information that one could argue that Ancient Egypt had more in common with the rest of Africa than it did with the Middle East or Europe before Greek/Roman/Arab conquests.[/quote]

These peopel have more in common with Greece and Rome than they do Egypt. They live in Republics, they speak Romantic languages, they live under western concepts of human rights, they have benefited from western science.
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Old 11-14-2015, 11:38 PM
 
329 posts, read 244,595 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WWlll View Post
They had little to do with the foundation but right now they are the continuation, Europe is small in size and doesnt have wide racial diversity as huge continents like Asia and Africa has, Europeans mingle together easily, they were all chrstians at some point in time, they adhered to same religion and values


you are talking culture wise, that is something i dont argue much about since it cant be determined easily, probably Egypt had influenced and got influenced by all these places surrounding it, but my problem here is racial wise and thats what we are debating about, to claim modern Egyptians are half breeds or foreign invaders while stealing our heritage and history from us is the point of argument

So what are you saying? That the Ancient Egyptians were white/Arabic? If that's the case all you'd have to do is look at the Nubians and Sudanese. Not sure how these people could be considered white or Arabic though being Arab is not considered a race. Are you saying these people are different racially to other blacks in sub sub-Saharan Africa? If that's the case then I'm not sure I can take any other arguments you have to say seriously. Those old tired racial stereotypes of what Africans are supposed to look like have no basis in scientific fact. Yes, there are different ethnic groups in Africa, racially speaking I don't agree with the notion that certain features are some sort of measuring tool to tell how African one is. Whose stealing Egyptian heritage? My argument from previous posts on another thread similar to this was that Ancient Egypt had more in common with the rest of Africa that most scholars care to acknowledge. In my opinion I don't see anything wrong with Africans in the diaspora seeking commonalities and even celebrating different African cultures seeing as how many of us are a make up of many different cultural and ethnic groups.

Last edited by jkc2j; 11-15-2015 at 12:15 AM..
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Old 11-14-2015, 11:56 PM
 
329 posts, read 244,595 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cachibatches View Post
But these people helped to build and maintain the ampire and went on to utilze and exapnd on that knoweldge. It isn't at all hard to understand.



This is absoulte nonense. I have read Black Athena and there is not a shred of evidence presented. I can easily refute any point given just as I did the blackness of the Egyptians and the quotes of the ancients. People beleived this garbage before hieroglyphics were decifered, but there is now no way to amintain this fantasy.


The same applies to native peoples in the western hemisphere whom were conquered and forced to convert to Christianity, that didn't make those people magically become European. Same for Africans whom were stolen from Africa and dropped in the western hemisphere. Though these people adopted some of the customs and language of the European didn't make them European. There are several examples of customs from different ethnic/tribal groups from west and central Africa that were retained through music, food, religious/spiritual systems and dance, ie Voudon, Santeria, jazz, hip hop, reggae, funk, r&b, merengue, samba, and much more. This talk about black people in the western hemisphere some how being so culturally distant from native Africans in my opinion is not a good argument. If you read my previous posts from another similar thread I posted a vast array of information that one could argue that Ancient Egypt had more in common with the rest of Africa than it did with the Middle East or Europe before Greek/Roman/Arab conquests.


So Natives and African/Black Americans have more in common with Greece and Rome? So we're going to just forgot about the thousands of years of history that natives had in the Americas before Europeans even knew there was land with people in the western hemisphere. Mind you the Americas have only been permanently settled by Europeans some 300-400 years. As I said before that Native and African/Black Americans have adopted many aspects of European culture but are not completely assimilated even after 300-400 years. We've still managed to keep quite a bit of semblances of our culture that remain in our music, food, dance, spiritual/religious systems etc.

So you've read Black Athena? What evidence presented did you not agree with? If it's easily refutable wouldn't you provide examples? Black Athena is only one book of many.

Try these:

Black Man on the Nile and his Family-Dr. Yosef Ben Jochannan

A History of Ancient Egypt: From the First Farmers to the Great Pyramid-John Romer

The Cultural Unity of Black Africa: The Domains of Matriarchy and of Patriarchy in Classical Antiquity-Cheikh Anta Diop

Last edited by jkc2j; 11-15-2015 at 12:16 AM..
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Old 11-15-2015, 12:42 AM
 
3,513 posts, read 2,516,206 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkc2j View Post
So Natives and African/Black Americans have more in common with Greece and Rome? So we're going to just forgot about the thousands of years of history that natives had in the Americas before Europeans even knew there was land with people in the western hemisphere. Mind you the Americas have only been permanently settled by Europeans some 300-400 years. As I said before that Native and African/Black Americans have adopted many aspects of European culture but are not completely assimilated even after 300-400 years. We've still managed to keep quite a bit of semblances of our culture that remain in our music, food, dance, spiritual/religious systems etc.

So you've read Black Athena? What evidence presented did you not agree with? If it's easily refutable wouldn't you provide examples? Black Athena is only one book of many.

Try these:

Black Man on the Nile and his Family-Dr. Yosef Ben Jochannan

A History of Ancient Egypt: From the First Farmers to the Great Pyramid-John Romer

The Cultural Unity of Black Africa: The Domains of Matriarchy and of Patriarchy in Classical Antiquity-Cheikh Anta Diop
There isn't any evidence presented in Black Athena or any other Afrocentric text. None whatsoever. Bernal cites Herodotus, a fifth century Greek who niether spoke nor wrote Egyptian and likely never vistied Egypt, The Golden Ass and The Heremes Trismogestos writings, both common era, and the quaint myths of free masons.

There are no actual ancient Egyptian text that equate Greek learning. None. There is no case to be made.

I am not going to continue on endlessly arguing about the shared cultural history of Europeans It is a real thing and you simply need to study history. If you think Reggae music and voodoo make you an Egyptian, then whatever.
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Old 11-15-2015, 12:51 AM
 
16 posts, read 8,613 times
Reputation: 29
originally posted by jkc2j
Quote:
That the Ancient Egyptians were white/Arabic? If that's the case all you'd have to do is look at the Nubians and Sudanese
lol nice try
u are obviously in denial
why would i look at Nubians or sudanese when i am talking about EGYPTIANS, Cachibaches posted numerous dna studies that prove modern Egyptians to be the only descendants of the ancient Egyptians and yet u divert the discussion to talk about a whole different people like Nubians or Sudanese, old lame afrocentric tactic that proves u people are only choosing to believe what makes u feel better rather than what is real.
u still call us Arabs althought we said many times we aren't from Arabia, we are refered to as Copts althought that term didnt exist during ancient times, we remain the same Copts but most of us just converted to Islam and speak arabic, even chritian Egyptians nowadays speak arabic and non of them knows how to speak coptic, only christiam priests still speak Coptic and fyi Hieroglyphs were translated using coptic, not nubian or any other language from Sub Saharan Africa or east AFrica

originally posted by jkc2j
Quote:
though being Arab is not considered a race
yepp
well said, being Arab comes from speaking Arabic, modern Nubians are same as ancient Nubians, the fact that they speak arabic nowadays doesnt make them different people
same goes for modern Egyptians, we speak Arabic but that doesnt make us any different people from the ancient Egyptians

originally posted by jkc2j
Quote:
Nubians and Sudanese. Not sure how these people could be considered white or Arabic though being Arab is not considered a race. Are you saying these people are different racially to other blacks in sub sub-Saharan Africa
many nubians consider themselves different from Sub Saharans and they complain about Bantus trying to steal their history too, i have seen that many times online, but many of Nubians and Sub saharans share the goal of attributing the ancient Egyptian history to themselves, poor people
u make me feel privilveged being Egyptian althought Egypt nowadays is a mess lol

originally posted by jkc2j
Quote:
I don't agree with the notion that certain features are some sort of measuring tool to tell how African one is
tell that to ur fellow afrocenters who keep claiming that we modern Egyptians and white people broke statue noses to hide their african features, obviously many of them admit their is certain African features when they see statues with wide and broken noses, but when they see a statue with pointy nose they resort to the "no certain features or some sort of measuring tool to tell how African one is"

originally posted by jkc2j
Quote:
My argument from previous posts on another thread similar to this was that Ancient Egypt had more in common with the rest of Africa that most scholars care to acknowledge
you by telling us to look at the Nubians and sudanese if we wanna see how ancient Egyptians looked like u are stealing Egypt's history and attributing it to another group of people who are different racially and culture wise (we had alot of culture influence on Nubia tho, got influenced by them too but we were always the dominant side most of the time culturly and politically)

originally posted by jkc2j
Quote:
In my opinion I don't see anything wrong with Africans in the diaspora seeking commonalities and even celebrating different African cultures seeing as how many of us are a make up of many different cultural and ethnic groups.
not at all, if u see it this way then that is great, we will always be welcoming for such attempts of unity and learning about each other, but u cant deny that this isn't how afrocentrics see it.
i have seen dizillions of afrocentrics telling me get out of Africa and leave Egypt calling me an invader from Arabia that stole their land and claimed their history whereas they can never prove those outragous claims.
Afrocentrism turned into a black KKK based on mythology and it is getting enemies day by day and if Black people think they are on the right track this way then they better think again since at some point too much people will stand united against this racist agenda

Last edited by WWlll; 11-15-2015 at 01:01 AM..
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Old 11-15-2015, 02:22 AM
 
931 posts, read 614,073 times
Reputation: 1488
Quote:
Originally Posted by WWlll View Post
originally posted by jkc2j

lol nice try
u are obviously in denial
why would i look at Nubians or sudanese when i am talking about EGYPTIANS, Cachibaches posted numerous dna studies that prove modern Egyptians to be the only descendants of the ancient Egyptians and yet u divert the discussion to talk about a whole different people like Nubians or Sudanese, old lame afrocentric tactic that proves u people are only choosing to believe what makes u feel better rather than what is real.
u still call us Arabs althought we said many times we aren't from Arabia, we are refered to as Copts althought that term didnt exist during ancient times, we remain the same Copts but most of us just converted to Islam and speak arabic, even chritian Egyptians nowadays speak arabic and non of them knows how to speak coptic, only christiam priests still speak Coptic and fyi Hieroglyphs were translated using coptic, not nubian or any other language from Sub Saharan Africa or east AFrica

originally posted by jkc2j

yepp
well said, being Arab comes from speaking Arabic, modern Nubians are same as ancient Nubians, the fact that they speak arabic nowadays doesnt make them different people
same goes for modern Egyptians, we speak Arabic but that doesnt make us any different people from the ancient Egyptians

originally posted by jkc2j

many nubians consider themselves different from Sub Saharans and they complain about Bantus trying to steal their history too, i have seen that many times online, but many of Nubians and Sub saharans share the goal of attributing the ancient Egyptian history to themselves, poor people
u make me feel privilveged being Egyptian althought Egypt nowadays is a mess lol

originally posted by jkc2j

tell that to ur fellow afrocenters who keep claiming that we modern Egyptians and white people broke statue noses to hide their african features, obviously many of them admit their is certain African features when they see statues with wide and broken noses, but when they see a statue with pointy nose they resort to the "no certain features or some sort of measuring tool to tell how African one is"

originally posted by jkc2j

you by telling us to look at the Nubians and sudanese if we wanna see how ancient Egyptians looked like u are stealing Egypt's history and attributing it to another group of people who are different racially and culture wise (we had alot of culture influence on Nubia tho, got influenced by them too but we were always the dominant side most of the time culturly and politically)

originally posted by jkc2j

not at all, if u see it this way then that is great, we will always be welcoming for such attempts of unity and learning about each other, but u cant deny that this isn't how afrocentrics see it.
i have seen dizillions of afrocentrics telling me get out of Africa and leave Egypt calling me an invader from Arabia that stole their land and claimed their history whereas they can never prove those outragous claims.
Afrocentrism turned into a black KKK based on mythology and it is getting enemies day by day and if Black people think they are on the right track this way then they better think again since at some point too much people will stand united against this racist agenda
You are wasting your time, many blacks suffer from a severe inferiority complex. They need to cling on to supposed past accomplishments to feel better about themselves.
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Old 11-15-2015, 09:36 AM
 
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littlemissrock
Quote:
You are wasting your time, many blacks suffer from a severe inferiority complex. They need to cling on to supposed past accomplishments to feel better about themselves
atleast we have made a great progress in this thread, they changed from claiming to be the egyptians to only embracing ancient Egyptian culture then to highlighting what could be similarities between Egypt and Sub Saharan Africa cultures
neverthless i know they will still go on youtube claiming to be da original egyptins tho
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Old 11-15-2015, 09:56 AM
 
Location: Vineland, NJ
8,483 posts, read 10,469,138 times
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Originally Posted by littlemissrock View Post
You are wasting your time, many blacks suffer from a severe inferiority complex. They need to cling on to supposed past accomplishments to feel better about themselves.
Yes because we're jealous of White people and wish we were Europeans. That's it.
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Old 11-15-2015, 10:46 AM
AFP
 
6,898 posts, read 4,238,493 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwillyfromphilly View Post
Yes because we're jealous of White people and wish we were Europeans. That's it.
Some people yes, there are people that really are that ****ed up!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5BjfxpF0_c
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