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Old 01-05-2016, 10:58 AM
 
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Islam. It is an historical FACT that 90% of my ancestors during the Trans-Atlantic slave trade are indeed West African, but as time went on the Europeans started to take Africans from other portions of Africa. Actually what started out as revenge became financial endeavor and keep in mind slavery was a huge business for about 400 years. This is why most of the African slaves that came to America were Moslems when they got here because they were West Africans and for the most part West Africans were all Moslems (for the most part). The 1st documented arrival of Moslems in America occurred with the arrival of slaves from Africa. Once coming to America, all of the slaves mixed with each other for 400 years, so all men and women whose fathers and mothers came out of the Trans-Atlantic Slave Trade have "Moorish" blood running thru their veins.
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Old 01-05-2016, 12:54 PM
AFP AFP started this thread
 
6,898 posts, read 4,235,492 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperiorMegaman View Post
It would help if your opinion was informed by facts and not statistics, conjecture and hearsay. Like it or not, it is simply not your place to determine who is and is not African--the end. It is offensive and condescending.

Show me what statement you are referring to. That you find so offensive and condescending.
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Old 01-05-2016, 02:15 PM
 
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Originally Posted by caribny View Post
If some one who was born in the Caribbean, and who arrived as an adult, tells you that they think that they are black American, they are only fooling you.
Huh?!?

If a person Caribbean person of African descent moves to American and any point in their life and become either a permanent resident or a citizen of the United states do they lose their blackness? Are then not Americans? I think not.

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They are fully aware that many black Americans seem to think that they, and that they alone define what "blackness" is, and don't feel like an argument.
That is a personal problem for those black Americans.

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In fact it becomes amusing when an African American arrives in the UK and starts talking about African American, instead of black British.
If an African American is talking about being African American what difference does it make where they are when they are discussing the topic, or are claiming that African Americans are insisting on referring to black Brits as African Americans. If it the case of the latter then it would be amusing although I doubt that African Americans would make such a claim.

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Cooperating with black Americans, as we face the same problems, is a far cry from identifying as a black American.
Your post is so confusing. First you don't identify who you are in the grand scheme of things and secondly, I can't imagine an African American expecting a black person from Britain, France, Germany or anywhere else as identifying as an African American. In point of fact I think that most African Americans would resent such a self-identification because of the very different historical experiences. That doesn't mean that an African American would not find points of commonality with persons of color no matter what their nationality.

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Hell Jamaicans and Barbadians can barely tolerate each other, much less totally identifying with people whose history is different.
That is unfortunate and one of the issues that the concept of Pan-Africanism was designed to combat.
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Old 01-05-2016, 02:32 PM
 
7,328 posts, read 4,013,331 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caribny View Post
But imagine the black American who feels insulted by an African who glibly ignores the struggles that black Americans have had to wage, and in fact CONTINUE to wage.

See why Pan Africanism is delusional?
Only if you believe that education is delusional.
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Old 01-06-2016, 09:28 AM
AFP AFP started this thread
 
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Originally Posted by SuperiorMegaman View Post
AFP, you said you don't consider African Americans to be African. Like I said, African Americans aren't seen as Americans--not even fully human. I found that offensive.

No I don't, I consider African American culture to be an American sub-culture. If you take offense to that, oh well.

You seriously think a significant amount of people consider African Americans not fully human?(rhetorical question)?

Dude you need to get a grip of reality. I know you don't live in the sticks, your zip code isn't all that far from where it live open your eyes and look around there are plenty of people that see African Americans as fully human. LoL

Last edited by AFP; 01-06-2016 at 09:55 AM..
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Old 01-06-2016, 10:27 AM
AFP AFP started this thread
 
6,898 posts, read 4,235,492 times
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Originally Posted by SuperiorMegaman View Post
And I am telling you that your opinion that African Americans aren't African is not relevant. You're not African or Black American, so your opinions about us is going to come off as elitist, offensive, insulting and condescending.



Yes, I do. When a 12 year old boy with a water gun can be shot and killed and people actually try to justify it, When Black men are thrown in jail and black women as young as 12 are over sexuallized, when a man can rape 13 women (probably more) and nobody really cares, when White men can take over a federal building and not be shot up and killed, or even arrested, when a 54 year old man who has actually killed a cop can be taken alive, and a white girl drug dealer is seen as adorable and not as threatening as the aforementioned 12 year old, yes, I think that a lot of people don't see blacks as fully human.




I think you're the one who needs to get a grip. Where I live (the inland empire of Southern California), I walk home from work to the bus station by a house with a large confederate flag. People patrol shopping centers, mosques and neighborhoods with assault weapons and they hold KKK rallies. I think I am fairly clear on how they see us. Its no longer even safe to walk to the gym or go running anymore...

Ok so you are exercising your free speech rights just like I am. So now are you the spokesperson for all African Americans Puleeez. African Americans are about as African culturally as European Americans are culturally European, not much overall probablly even less so.

Ok so you have a belief that black people aren't seen as fully human in the USA and you have cherry picked some examples to support your belief(ideology) you are free to believe and take a leap of faith.

You are farily clear how the KKK sees you okay, the KKK is a bunch of ignorant hicks how does that represent the average white person in the USA.
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Old 01-06-2016, 11:24 AM
AFP AFP started this thread
 
6,898 posts, read 4,235,492 times
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Originally Posted by SuperiorMegaman View Post
And how did you come to this conclusion? Like I keep telling you, most people of color are not seen as American, no matter how much they assimilate. In the case of Black folks, its much worse, which is why the concept of Pan-Africanism exists. Some of the most important leaders in Africa were pan-Africanists who encouraged black Americans to return home...

I am not the spokesperson for Black Americans, I have eyes, ears and a brain, AFP. Not only that, I have my own personal experiences to fall back on. Keep talking to your doctors and PRs, though. You're entitled to your opinion--no matter how misinformed, irrelevant, clueless, and out of place it may be.



I could have gone on and on, but that would take hours. Those are just a few examples. When this country came into existence, we were counted as 3/5 of a person. In some southern states, black people outnumbered white people, but we were still at the bottom rung of society. After slavery ended, they employed terrorism to keep us in line. Today, we are locking up and killing folks.




I am clear that we haven't changed as much as you seem to think. Segregation is worse now than it was in the 50s, and people are being killed in the streets.

How did I come to what conclusion narrow down your question?

Provide evidence supporting your statement that most people of color are seen as American. Anyone can make a baseless claim supporting evidence would help you plead your case.

What do you have against African doctors and PA's I've worked with some of these people 10 years they're good people. I have interacted with many African Americans as well from various educational and social backgrounds over my lifetime don't flatter yourself you aren't the first black person I've come across.

Don't bother going on and on it doesn't relate to Pan-Africanism. It doesn't support your claim that African Americans aren't seen as fully human. That is believed by a fringe group of ignorant Americans not hard to find people to believe in crazy theories without evidence.
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Old 01-07-2016, 10:13 PM
 
25 posts, read 17,735 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Perpetual darkness View Post
You do know that muslims pioneered the Arab slave trade for 1500 years which was the precursor to the TransAtlantic slave trade. Ill never get why Afrocentric African Americans become muslim when it was Islamiicised tribes who sold millions of Africans to slave markets in North Africa and Yemen
Brother that is false propaganda, and you're giving me half way truth! Afrocentrics also point out how much Moslems got to do with the Trans-Atlantic when in reality Moors have very little to do with the Trans-Atlantic compared to everyone else! The slave trade was a business that everyone got their hands dirty with especially non-Islamic Africans, and to point out black Moslems as a threat to Africa is very hypocritical because non-Islamic Africans sold more slaves and benefited more from the Trans-Atlantic slave trade than Al Islam. The Afrocentric perspective of Islam is the same as Eurocentric perspective on history and reality. Al Islam is an indigenous African religion! Your comment sounds very uneducated because many of the Africans who were sold an enslaved were Moslems and the 1st Moslems to every step foot on this country were Africans who were sold into slavery during the Trans-Atlantic. Many of the Africans who did the enslaving were Christian Africans who had converted to the faith after relinquishing their own tribalistic spirituality.

I'm very familiar of what the Arabs did and I hate their ancestors just as much as I hate the European ancestors for doing what they did to my people, but you're talking as if I.S.L.A.M belongs to the Arabs! When it does not. The Jews were cutting deals with non-Islamic and Islamic tribes so dont "one side" information and blame it on one group when everybody was getting their hands filthy during this time! Actually the non-Islamic Africans got more richer off the slave trade than anybody besides the white man, which is why African leaders are coming out and publicly apologizing to African-Americans for selling us!
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Old 01-07-2016, 10:15 PM
 
25 posts, read 17,735 times
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By the time slavery had started in the 1400s, the Arabs had become significantly weakened as a military force by the time of the Western Crusades (1095-1250s) and the Eastern Crusades, namely the Christian-backed Mongol invasion that culminated in the sacking of Baghdad in 1258. Their military response to these successive invasions can best be described as pathetic. The Arabs were 'saved' only by the intervention of non-Arab Muslims e.g. Sala udin Ayubi - from Kurdistan, the Mamelukes (Muslim kinsmen to the non-Muslim Mongols and Tartars) and then the Ottomans who took over the Caliphate. The Arabs were in no position to enslave other people after suffering such bruising attacks from Central Asia.
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Old 01-10-2016, 08:21 PM
AFP AFP started this thread
 
6,898 posts, read 4,235,492 times
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Originally Posted by SuperiorMegaman View Post
Quote:

The bottom line is that the Moors were not white Europeans--no matter what you actually believe. Some Moors were Arabs, but some were also black and west African. Most importantly, they were all AFRICAN.

And, Europeans did trade goods for slaves, which is why they were able to control it and play tribes against one another.


This was the only time in history where one man controlled the value of gold. I haven't seen any information on whether Mansa Musa is or was hated by the people of Mali. Care to provide a link?
I don't think that the Moors were European but the Moors in Al Andalus were heavily mixed due to Muslim men taking Iberian women and Saqaliba(Slavic women) as wives and concubines.The Moors certainly after seven centuries and by the peak of Al Andalus were heavily European. They took on European women as wives and concubines. Look at the ancestry of Abd-ar-Rahman III for an example.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abd-ar-Rahman_III

Al Andalus also had a large population of Arabized Iberians that converted to Islam and over time married Arabs and Berbers. The black Moors were few and were mixed(Berber men/Sub-Saharan women) mostly descendants of the Sanhaja. As I have already posted there are no paternal lineages in Portugal and Spain with origins in sub-Saharan Africa however there are small amounts of maternal lineages of sub-Saharan origin however the majority are thought to be as a result of Atlantic slave trade. I have no issue with the black admixture I carry a small amount.

North Africans populations have five distinct ancestries.

*Maghrebi(diverged from Near Eastern and European(Mediterranean) >12,000YBP estimated)
*Near Eastern
*European
*western sub-Saharan African
*eastern sub-Saharan African

The indigenous genomic component of North Africa ancestry referred to as Maghrebi is the result of back-to-Africa migration from the middle east that is estimated to have occurred >12,000 years ago it it most frequently found in indigenous Berber populations. The Near Eastern component part of which was introduced during the neolithic(7,000-8,000YBP) and some is more recent(during the Arab expansion) 1,400 YBP. The sub-Saharan African component is recent it is estimated to have been introduced into southern Morocco 1,200 YBP(approx. 40 generations ago). The time period of the European component was not determined in this paper although the author mentions it could have been introduced via maritime migrations from the Mediterranean. Seven north African populations were included in the paper.

PLOS Genetics: Genomic Ancestry of North Africans Supports Back-to-Africa Migrations
I haven't disputed that that Europeans traded manufactured goods for slaves.

Regarding Mansa Musa being disliked in Mali I viewed it on a documentary can't find it now don't remember the title. When I come across it again I will post it.
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