Talk to me about Cape Town, South Africa (crime, country, tourist)
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I would love to hear from and start a dialogue with people living in South Africa currently, or people who have been there recently. What is the racial situation like in Cape Town these days? I have read some information online, and am quite aware of the Shantytowns and the continuing racial disparities, but what is every day life like?
If I were to visit Cape Town today, would I see people of all colors mingling? Is there any interracial dating, or is that still a big taboo? Are neighborhoods integrated at all? If I went shopping would I see people of color only working service jobs (waitperson, clerk, cabdriver, etc) or working in all types of businesses? How would I, as a (not rich) white American woman tourist be received? How different would it be if I were black American tourist?
I ask these questions because in the US usually all we hear about SA is all the crime and how the whites are being punished and discriminated against as a backlash against all the years of apartheid, plus Oprah's school. It's hard to get a realistic picture. Thanks to everyone who responds!
I go back about every 18 months. My last visit was earlier this year, but I did not go to CT.
Some answers...
You will see people of all colors on the streets, except in the townships. However, I would not say that adults mingle so much. The most mingling I saw was among the school kids. Interracial dating is not popular. Taboo? Not sure, but probably would get some looks. I don't think neighborhoods are integrated that much. Then again, are they really that integrated here in the states? In both our countries, you can live wherever you want, but it's still a matter of economics.
Yes, there is black empowerment/affirmative action/racism going on. People who are not qualified are getting opportunities over those who are. IMO, I don't think it's good for the country, but then again I've also never been deprived of citizenship, forced to live somewhere, told when and where I can or can't be, and basically treated like an animal. Wait a minute... I think I just mostly defined the first 18 years of my life...
Can't answer your 'not rich, white woman' and black American questions.
In regards to what we hear about in the news, please remember that it's news. You get the extremes of everything. SA is a wonderful and beautiful place. Crime is a huge negative there. It seems to be completely random - no pattern. When I visit, I don't feel any less/more safe than when I am in parts of NY, NJ, Wash DC, Detroit, Chicago, SF, LA, (list any major city). I think you get my point. Keep your head about you, don't do anything to draw attention, don't walk around by yourself, or late at night, don't carry lots of money or flaunt fancy possessions.
I'm a black South African woman, born & bred.... 36yrs.... Hon degree, professional & am quite beautiful ( I've been told).... Moved to CT from Jhb 6 months ago.... I am attracted to white men.
The reality is, it usually the white foriegn men that don't have a problem with being seen with a black lady.
I have dated a white South African, but his family still couldn't accept me as his choice, which caused strain in the relationship till we ended it after 6 years.
In Jhb you're likely to see more mixing amongst races.... but I'm afraid Cape town is still very divided....
The country as a whole does have some serious issues (crime being by far the biggest) but as others have said, what place doesnt? At least in some way or form (besides a select few, but those places are usually pretty boring to live in IMO). As always, the media make a big noise about everything, and while a fair amount will be true, I think you need to experience the place first hand before believing all of what is said and how "terrible" it is.
If you ask me, SA with low crime would truly be the best place on this planet to live. Because I have grown up with it, Im used to it so I guess it's still the best for me anyway.. :-)
Personally, I believe that things are changing slowly but as with everything, it takes time. Think how long attitudes took to change between blacks and whites in the US, the system was so similar in many ways with everything seperate and segregated - still these issues persist more in some places than others..
What ever you do, try to visit - I guarantee you will enjoy yourself and Im sure will want to return.
Good luck.
Andy.
Last edited by Cornerguy1; 01-14-2010 at 07:30 PM..
Reason: links to other forums not permitted
The country as a whole does have some serious issues (crime being by far the biggest) but as others have said, what place doesnt? At least in some way or form (besides a select few, but those places are usually pretty boring to live in IMO). As always, the media make a big noise about everything, and while a fair amount will be true, I think you need to experience the place first hand before believing all of what is said and how "terrible" it is.
If you ask me, SA with low crime would truly be the best place on this planet to live. Because I have grown up with it, Im used to it so I guess it's still the best for me anyway.. :-)
Personally, I believe that things are changing slowly but as with everything, it takes time. Think how long attitudes took to change between blacks and whites in the US, the system was so similar in many ways with everything seperate and segregated - still these issues persist more in some places than others..
What ever you do, try to visit - I guarantee you will enjoy yourself and Im sure will want to return.
Good luck.
Andy.
I'm sorry for reviving this very old and dead thread, but I have to respond. Comparing issues and the history of South Africa to the United States is astounding to me.
1. South Africa's issues with government integrity and crime, as well as poor educational and economic indicators are incomparable to any other country in the G 20.
2. Apartheid in South Africa was a lot worse than inequality in the Jim Crow South. Disparities in education and income are far greater in South Africa now than they were during the American Civil Rights Movement. Present day indicators in South Africa would point back to the end of slavery for any kind of legitimate comparison. African-Americans were able to achieve, or at least make attempts at economic empowerment and quality education, long before civil rights legislation. Much discrimination in the United States was social and institutional as opposed to government mandated as in the case of Apartheid South Africa. In the United States African-Americans were always citizens and had most rights depending on what state they were in at a given time (laws and regulations frequently changed). Unlike South Africa the United States never experienced international sanctions or condemnation for its racist practices. The United States was always built as a melting pot nation, and had many years to adjust to and provide for equality for African-Americans. South Africa was intended to be an Anglo-Saxon wealth creating nation. South Africa on the other hand was also forced into a position, that I believe could have been a lot better had condemnation been more gentle. South Africa wouldn't have the problems it has today with its fairly new majority government.
I hate to say it but I think South Africa as a country as actually regressed quite a bit over the last decade or so.
I went to Cape Town and throughout the country back in 1999 and then again in 2009 and it was a much nicer and safer place a decade ago IMO. It seemed like there was some real hope for the country a decade ago. The people were generally positive and excitable about their direction.
Last year, sadly, it seemed the complete opposite. Many angry people, a lot of the anger directed towards the wrong people, etc...You can tell there is a serious lack of education among the population. It seemed to be in a sad state of affairs in my opinion. I came away with the impression that a lot of the people thought all their needs were going to be taken care of by the "new government" of the last decade and a half and they were sorely mistaken.
I hate to say it but I think South Africa as a country as actually regressed quite a bit over the last decade or so.
I went to Cape Town and throughout the country back in 1999 and then again in 2009 and it was a much nicer and safer place a decade ago IMO. It seemed like there was some real hope for the country a decade ago. The people were generally positive and excitable about their direction.
Last year, sadly, it seemed the complete opposite. Many angry people, a lot of the anger directed towards the wrong people, etc...You can tell there is a serious lack of education among the population. It seemed to be in a sad state of affairs in my opinion. I came away with the impression that a lot of the people thought all their needs were going to be taken care of by the "new government" of the last decade and a half and they were sorely mistaken.
I'd take the south africa of today over the recently apartheid ended south africa any day of the week.
The anger was about 100X as strong back then as it is today.
I'd take the south africa of today over the recently apartheid ended south africa any day of the week.
The anger was about 100X as strong back then as it is today.
Again, I dont live there and I've only visited there twice. From my experience South Africa seemed a much better place in 1999 compared to 2009. It seemed to have regressed in many aspects to me during that time.
Hello, Just wondering has anyone been to Cape Town, South Africa lately? If so, how did you find the climate, psychology, and atmosphere? What are the Waterfront, Muzenbeirg beach and City Bowl Neighborhoods like? How Safe is Cape Town to visit? In what ways are White South Africans similar to and different from Australians in culture and psychology?
Thanks
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Anyone been to Cape Town, South Africa lately
