[TexasReb]

I just had a couple of questions I was wondering about for some of you Alabamans (by the way, is it "Alabamans" or "Alabamians"..?)

Anyway, here is a little background concerning the first one by way of an excerpt from an article on Texas speech that appeared in Texas Monthly magazine several years ago:

“The most basic explanation of aTexas accent is that it’s a Southern accent with a twist,” said Professor Bailey, who has determined that the twang is not only spreading but also changing. “It’s the twist that we’re interested in.” The preeminent scholar on Texas pronunciation, Bailey hails from southern Alabama; he has a soft lilting drawl that, for the sake of economy, will not be phonetically reproduced here but is substantially more genteel and less nasal than Bob Hinkle’s twang. The broadly defined “Texas accent” began to form, Bailey explained, when two populations merged here in the mid-nineteenth century. Settlers who migrated from Louisiana, Alabama, and Mississippi brought with them what would later become the Lower South Dialect (its drawl left an imprint on East Texas), while settlers from Tennessee and Kentucky brought with them the South Midland Dialect (its twang had a greater influence in West Texas). Added to the mix of Anglo settlers from the Deep South and Appalachia who began talking to each other was an established Spanish-speaking population and an influx of Mexican, German, and Czech immigrants. “What distinguishes a Texas accent the most is the confluence of its influences,” said Bailey.

Anyway, what people usually think of as the "typical" Texas accent is the variety spoken in rural west Texas, and I read somewhere that it is very akin, lingquistically, to that heard in eastern Tennessee and parts of northern Alabama. Have any of y'all who have been to Texas and are also familiar with North Alabama noticed such a thing? I can't really say, having never been to the latter. However, I DO have a distant cousin who originally came from north Alabama (and now lives in Mississippi) and her dialect seems to indicate some of this. In fact, she told me that, shortly after moving to Mississippi, a woman asked her where she was from, and that her guess would be "either north Alabama or Texas!" LOL

The other question is, what is "Alabama white sauce"? LOL I was going thru an article one time on the "Southern BBQ belt" and in covering the various aspects from one part to another, from pork in the southeast to "beef" in Texas and the different type sauces (mustard based, tomato, etc), a mention was made of "white sauce" being popular in parts of Alabama!

[Keeper]

White sauce is mayo, vinegar and pepper. Really good on chicken.
Tomatoe bbq sauce in N. Al is more vinegary than in S. AL.

Can't tell you about the accents as I have never really been to Texas other than to drive through it.

[harry chickpea]

What a lot of folks don't realize about accents is that many of them are the way the language was spoken in the past, and that they are truer to the original language that the newspeak of today. You are correct that migration patterns (and isolation) are major sources of regionalisms. Other influences can be religious, unique plant life or agriculture/maritime practices, and influences from other cultures. Cajun relates to English a little like Creole relates to French, and the tight "oi" sound of New Englanders and the Appalachian hill dwellers relates directly to the King's English as spoken by the original european settlers.

There are a couple of very good books on dialects and regionalisms that you might be interested in. I'd cite a name, but I don't remember them off the top of my head, and mine are in storage right now. IIRC, the influences in some Alabama speech is English, Scottish, Irish, and some French. To me, the Texas drawl is more pronounced than a normal Alabama drawl.

(A bit of Texas trivia that I learned recently. Because of the diversity of the different regions in Texas, when it entered the Union, it was allowed to carve itself up into a bunch of different states. It never did so, but had it done this, the representation of the area in the U.S. senate might have been significant to some laws that passed by a slim majority, and the influence of the south might have been greater in comparison to the northeast.)

Southlander has the recipie for white sauce. Think of a mayonaise base instead of a tomato or other base.

[TexasReb]

Originally Posted by harry chickpea

What a lot of folks don't realize about accents is that many of them are the way the language was spoken in the past, and that they are truer to the original language that the newspeak of today. You are correct that migration patterns (and isolation) are major sources of regionalisms. Other influences can be religious, unique plant life or agriculture/maritime practices, and influences from other cultures. Cajun relates to English a little like Creole relates to French, and the tight "oi" sound of New Englanders and the Appalachian hill dwellers relates directly to the King's English as spoken by the original european settlers.

There are a couple of very good books on dialects and regionalisms that you might be interested in. I'd cite a name, but I don't remember them off the top of my head, and mine are in storage right now. IIRC, the influences in some Alabama speech is English, Scottish, Irish, and some French. To me, the Texas drawl is more pronounced than a normal Alabama drawl.

(A bit of Texas trivia that I learned recently. Because of the diversity of the different regions in Texas, when it entered the Union, it was allowed to carve itself up into a bunch of different states. It never did so, but had it done this, the representation of the area in the U.S. senate might have been significant to some laws that passed by a slim majority, and the influence of the south might have been greater in comparison to the northeast.)

Southlander has the recipie for white sauce. Think of a mayonaise base instead of a tomato or other base.

This is good and interesting stuff, sir. And thanks to the both of you for explaining what "Alabama White Sauce" is. I will have to try it and make it, myself.

You are right about Texas having the right to divide itself...although some argue (even assuming it would ever be done anyway, which is none to nill) that should it ever be tried that, as a result of the War, it wouldn't stand up in court. BUT..had it been done, I think East Texas would have become a typical Deep South state. North and Central Texas would be Southern, but not Deep South Southern. West Texas? A sort of blend of South and Southwest. FAR west Texas and south Texas? Part of either the desert SW..or Mexico! LOL

Anyway, you are right. There are many things that go into what bonds a state with a region. Texas is essentially Southern, but has at least enough influences to make it something in and of itself, as well....!

[Bravo35223]

I have lived in both Texas and Alabama (San Antonio and Birmingham)....I have more relatives living in Texas than any other state by a large margin....with quite a few living in both Dallas and Houston. Many of these however grew up in Louisiana and Arkansas.

The Alabama and Texas accents are extremely close...you have to be a linguist to describe the differences IMHO. I go hunting annually with a group from Houston....(we hunt in Hondo, Texas) and the people of the area think I am from Houston.

BTW - the "white sauce" is associated with North Carolina - not Alabama. Alabama's BBQ sauce is virtually identical to Texas'. The big difference in BBQ being that in Alabama its pork and in Texas its beef. When I lived in San Antonio, I couldn't find pork spare ribs so I decided to cook some for Memorial Day. HEB didn't sell pork spare ribs so I had to go to a mercado on the Southside where the Latinos sell it.

I took the standard Texas BBQ sauxe for sale at HEB and cooked the ribs in it and served it to my neighbors...they went wild and wanted me to cook for all special occasions (Labor Day, July 4th etc)....

[TexasReb]

Originally Posted by Bravo35223

I have lived in both Texas and Alabama (San Antonio and Birmingham)....I have more relatives living in Texas than any other state by a large margin....with quite a few living in both Dallas and Houston. Many of these however grew up in Louisiana and Arkansas.

The Alabama and Texas accents are extremely close...you have to be a linguist to describe the differences IMHO. I go hunting annually with a group from Houston....(we hunt in Hondo, Texas) and the people of the area think I am from Houston.

BTW - the "white sauce" is associated with North Carolina - not Alabama. Alabama's BBQ sauce is virtually identical to Texas'. The big difference in BBQ being that in Alabama its pork and in Texas its beef. When I lived in San Antonio, I couldn't find pork spare ribs so I decided to cook some for Memorial Day. HEB didn't sell pork spare ribs so I had to go to a mercado on the Southside where the Latinos sell it.

I took the standard Texas BBQ sauxe for sale at HEB and cooked the ribs in it and served it to my neighbors...they went wild and wanted me to cook for all special occasions (Labor Day, July 4th etc)....

This might cost me my native Texas membership, but I PREFER pork! LOL And that vinegar mustard based sauce rather than the sweet thick spicy stuff associated with Texas.

I know something else too. Had the yankees wanted to end the War quickly, they would have planted leaflets all over the South (depending what part as to exactly how worded) saying something like "Texans? Mississippi folks think y'all don't know BBQ from Adam". Or..."North Carolina TarHeels? South Carolina thinks your sauce ain't worth a dad burn..." "Tennessee? Arkansas thinks y'alls ribs dont stack up a damn..."

We'da been fightin' amongst ourselves so quick we'da lost by default...

OR...better yet, get us to arguing about how to pronounce "Pecan." My own observation is that Alabama and into Texas, it is pronounced "PUH-Kahn" (slight accent on second syllable). East into the coastal South states it tends to be "Pee-Can"

Or am I wrong...?

Thanks y'all...for you all welcoming a Texan to this Alabama forum!

[Southlander]

White sauce is mayonnaise based and, in Alabama, originated at Big Bob Gibson's BBQ in Decatur. Our BBQ tends to be related more closely to North Carolina than the rest of Alabama. PM, er, DM me and I'll send you the recipe. I think you and Harry are right about the accents. North Alabamians tend to have migrated via Western North Carolina and east Tennessee, and a lot of Texans descend from Alabamians who went on to Texas. Note the hard "r", so different from coastal Southern accents - I believe that comes from our Scottish forbears.

[PeggyM]

Originally Posted by TexasReb

I just had a couple of questions I was wondering about for some of you Alabamans (by the way, is it "Alabamans" or "Alabamians"..?)

Anyway, here is a little background concerning the first one by way of an excerpt from an article on Texas speech that appeared in Texas Monthly magazine several years ago:

“The most basic explanation of aTexas accent is that it’s a Southern accent with a twist,” said Professor Bailey, who has determined that the twang is not only spreading but also changing. “It’s the twist that we’re interested in.” The preeminent scholar on Texas pronunciation, Bailey hails from southern Alabama; he has a soft lilting drawl that, for the sake of economy, will not be phonetically reproduced here but is substantially more genteel and less nasal than Bob Hinkle’s twang. The broadly defined “Texas accent” began to form, Bailey explained, when two populations merged here in the mid-nineteenth century. Settlers who migrated from Louisiana, Alabama, and Mississippi brought with them what would later become the Lower South Dialect (its drawl left an imprint on East Texas), while settlers from Tennessee and Kentucky brought with them the South Midland Dialect (its twang had a greater influence in West Texas). Added to the mix of Anglo settlers from the Deep South and Appalachia who began talking to each other was an established Spanish-speaking population and an influx of Mexican, German, and Czech immigrants. “What distinguishes a Texas accent the most is the confluence of its influences,” said Bailey.

Anyway, what people usually think of as the "typical" Texas accent is the variety spoken in rural west Texas, and I read somewhere that it is very akin, lingquistically, to that heard in eastern Tennessee and parts of northern Alabama. Have any of y'all who have been to Texas and are also familiar with North Alabama noticed such a thing? I can't really say, having never been to the latter. However, I DO have a distant cousin who originally came from north Alabama (and now lives in Mississippi) and her dialect seems to indicate some of this. In fact, she told me that, shortly after moving to Mississippi, a woman asked her where she was from, and that her guess would be "either north Alabama or Texas!" LOL

The other question is, what is "Alabama white sauce"? LOL I was going thru an article one time on the "Southern BBQ belt" and in covering the various aspects from one part to another, from pork in the southeast to "beef" in Texas and the different type sauces (mustard based, tomato, etc), a mention was made of "white sauce" being popular in parts of Alabama!

Hi Tex, Alabamans are called just that. I lived in Houston for 6 yrs and definitely noted there was a similar accent to N AL. Their accent is pretty extreme and flat, and has multi syllables for a one syllable word. But "HI (doesn't have an 'e' sound at the end of the word) It's strictly an 'I' sound. E'ALL" is pronounced exactly as you read it - Y'all. There you go, you've got the sound.

Lots of Alabamans moved to TX in the middle 1800s, including some of my family. whats you think TEX? Let me know.

[Southlander]

I've always heard "Alabamians." Our good friends on the other side of the state call us University of Alabama fans "Bammers." And we retaliate by calling our Auburn University friends "Barners."

[harry chickpea]

This got me to wondering about the source of the name "Alabama." If the reference is correct, then perhaps residents should be referred to in the plural as "Alabamos" or "Alibamos."

ADAH: State Name

Thicket clearer. Vegitation gatherer. I do that.