[harry chickpea]

There are some startling articles available on the web about the ammonia stench of some broiler house operations, especially in the spring when the manure is spread out on the nearby fields. I also have found a correlation in land and home prices to the nearness of some of these operations.

A quick check of terraserver and the aerial photos there shows that broiler houses cover much of northeast AL. I'm used to cow manure smells in the country, and know enough to stay clear of piggeries, but I'd appreciate some advice on how far to stay away from these chicken condos. Anyone have any personal experiences?

[jetjockey75]

I can't tell you how far to stay away but if you want to live in rural AL, even if you buy a place where there are no chicken houses nearby, realize that a neighbor can change that in an instant. As our population (and demand for poultry) grows, a lot of rural landowners will be tempted to enter the market. It is my understanding that the major poultry producers (Tyson, etc.) make it very easy to enter the business, even coming to your place to build the necessary broiler houses for you and then providing you with baby chicks on a regular basis.

[Rocky Shoals]

Poultry house odors should be the least of your concern. I left the NW AL area, in part, because of my concern of the imminent pandemic bird flu threat due to the high concentration of breeders and the fact that the breeders and processors are unable to control nor contain the virus whenever it does materialize. I was consulting for the Franklin County Emergency Management Agency (EMA) and did an in depth study of the risk and quite frankly I did not like the results of my work. However, the principal export from all of AL is poultry and the risk is everywhere where there is poultry production. Something else to keep in mind and to worry about.

[harry chickpea]

I have serious doubts about the whole bird flu issue. I'm not saying that the researchers are wrong, but just that they could be overstating the issue to bring it more into public awareness (and get funding), and the media has used the story to sell more soap. In short, there are two factors that I feel are not being given proper weight in the media scare stories.

1. The broiler houses are much closer to science-fiction bio-dome containment than a farm of old. The number of people in contact with the live birds is extremely limited, and the contact that the birds have with any wild birds is totally eliminated, except for the few operations that allow birds outside. A disease in a broiler house could mean the loss of an entire "crop" of poultry, and the cost of that loss is significant enough that farmers go to great lengths to avoid it.

In essense, the broiler house flocks have far less impact than the ducks that freely migrate all across the country, or pigeons that roost in cities and are protected by ordinences and laws.

While exploring Alabama and Tennessee, I noticed an amazingly large number of ducks on the Tennessee River and the local lakes. Those ducks get to **** into water supplies, die in rivers, and fly over cities. Compare the potential effect of a single sick duck with that of an entire flock of contained and isolated birds in a broiler house.

It isn't just ducks that are a problem. When I was managing theatres, I learned that one important and often missed task was to inspect the air handlers on the rooftops. At one theatre, there was a distinct unpleasant odor coming from the HVAC vents. Climbing to the roof, I found that gnerations of pigeons had nested in the shelter of the fresh air vents. I've seen a lot of disgusting sights, but that had to rank high in the top ten.

The nests were a foul mass of straw and feathers mixed with pigeon poo, skeletons of dead birds, rotting corpses of fledglings that didn't survive and were being eaten by worms and flies, and a stench that was full of mold and death and decay. That air was being sucked into the HVAC and blasted down on entire audiences of theatregoers. Every building with rooftop air handlers has the same potential problem. Schools, emergency control centers, firehouses, hospitals, all could be reservoirs of death in a bird flu pandemic.

I won't even go into the potential threat from ravens, starlings, and seagulls that hang out around fast food restaurants looking for handouts.

2. Extremely deadly viruses quickly self-extinguish or mutate into less deadly versions. The higher the mortality rate and speed that a virus kills, the less chance it has to spread. Norwalk and other viruses that are a continuing problem are successful as viruses because they don't kill but sicken, and provide plenty of opportunities for potential hosts to become infected.

Ebola is rare because the more quickly it kills, the less chance it has to spread. In point of fact, the worst outbreaks of it are bad because of the funerary practices of the people affected. Extended contact with the dead and dying provides the route of infection within the tightly knit villages.

Could there be a pandemic of an extremely deadly virus? Sure, anything is possible. Will it be significantly worse in rural Alabama than anywhere else? I find that extremely doubtful. The bottom line is that nobody gets off this planet alive and we have to accept that living has risks. Over-reacting to potential risks, like a form of bird flu that doesn't yet exist, while under-reacting to more serious known threats like unsafe drivers, high blood pressure and the like, is counter-productive.

[JohnH]

My concern is not the odor coming from the chicken house, its the flies that they cause. I cant even leave my garage door open during the summer months because of the flies. My neighbor built his operation right before i moved in to my house. Ever since, the flies are awful. My other neighbors have told me that he never informed the community of his plans or the nasty stuff that comes from it. Can anyone help me find out if there is any laws or rules that can be inforced. Thanks.

[harry chickpea]

Sounds like he just isn't managing his litter and dead chickens right. Since posting, I've learned more about the operations, to the point that a well-run poultry house is no longer a concern to me.

There are a certain number of chickens that die every day from the stress of such fast growth, and those need to be removed and buried or composted promptly. Flies are a part of country life, but by not composting and turning the compost, more maggots can reach maturity. The heat of the compost pile can kill them, given a chance.

I can guarantee you don't have the fly problems I once had when a neighbor spread whey on his fields. Just opening the screen door to the house would let in (no joke) 25 or more flies. Still, I understand your frustration.

Look in Lowes or Home Depot for fly traps. Place them near the perimeter of your property (they can stink) and let them do their job. You might check with a county AG agent to get other suggestions and maybe get some help to the farmer. I doubt that complaining will do you any good.

Bottom line is that if he isn't handling his crops well, he'll have more dead birds and disease, and the company he contracts with will not be pleased.

And be thankful you don't have swarms of biting horseflies.

[jsherman9901]

Originally Posted by harry chickpea

And be thankful you don't have swarms of biting horseflies.

Or deerflies, which are *almost* as bad

[sunshine girl]

Isn't part of the problem of the poultry industry the waste that gets into the ground water? I thought I read somewhere that the waste enters the streams and rivers and because of the high nitrogen content messes up the chemistry of the waterways and the fish, etc. Just asking...I really don't know.

[harry chickpea]

It can get into waterways, but the waste is highly sought as a non-chemical fertilizer and not allowed to (pardon the pun) "go to waste." If you wanted some for your garden or crops, the going price is over $60 per truckload - IF you can find someone willing to sell it. Considering that the bagged fertilizer found in the home stores is made using an energy-intensive process of fixing nitrogen from the air, the used poultry litter is more ecologically sound (and MUCH cheaper per unit of fertilizer) than that bag of Scott's weed-n-feed. The issue is that some of the nitrogen isn't completely "fixed" and so it has an odor for a few days. Some people are very sensitive to it, and some farmers aren't the best farmers in the world.

[jsherman9901]

Originally Posted by harry chickpea

... I've learned more about the operations, to the point that a well-run poultry house is no longer a concern to me.

Question is, how many of them are "well-run"? As many of them as I have driven near, seldom do I not notice the smell. Yesterday, I was looking at some lakefront property in NW Alabama. I noticed on the drive to the lake that there were a number of poultry houses about 1/2 to 3/4 mile away from the lake. Sure enough, when I got to the property, the stench was enough to gag a maggot. I also noticed quite a few "For Sale" signs in front of houses on the lake.