Weapon recommendations for use in the Bush (Kodiak: travel, work)

[Floyd_Davidson]

Originally Posted by warptman

Sweet, I've never been that far upriver. Farthest up I've been was Sleetmute. Great country upriver.

A great hunting trip is to go up river to McGrath, and then drift home. (Makes almost no difference how far down the river "home" is.)

But, let me tell everyone else a story about Warptman. I know this is true, cause he's an akulamiut. a downriver guy from the tundra (and they're all the same down there). They go up river in the fall to hunt for mooses. Mooses hangs out in the trees... trees block the view! And all downriver tundra dwellers are absolutely positive that there's a carayuk around every bend. (The word "carayuk" translates literally as "brown bear", but that isn't what the word means. It means MONSTER. A man eating monster.)

Okay, so now imagine all of the above to be Honest Truth, as clear as you can see me and I can see you. How does a downriver guy find a place to camp if they go up the river to where the trees, moose, and monsters are??? (All the camping places used by upriver residents, btw, are on the cut banks and in the trees! Those places are out.)

So I'll bet you dollars to donuts that every single one of those downriver guys finds the biggest, longest, most sweeping bend in the river they can, and pitches a tent on the gravel bar out in the middle of the river! It's the only place suitable for a claustrophobic.

Keep that in mind when you travel the Kuskokwim, because you can tell where a boat is from, by whether they hauled out on a gravel bar or on a cut bank to camp.

[warptman]

....Or camp on whatever gravel bar we get stuck on.

[RayinAK]

For a fast handling gun at close range, I would go with one of the .45-70's. However, if you can shoot a 12-gage shotgun well, load it with some tough slugs. Don't alternate slugs/buckshot, just load slugs all the way.

Next are the most popular cartridges in Alaska: the .30-06, .300WM, and .338WM. My favorite would be a .338WM with a 22" barrel, loaded with 250-grain bullets, or 275-grain A-Frame, or with 300-grain Woodleigh for close work.

[DannyL]

Originally Posted by Barkingowl

Is poor marksmanship a big problem, Danny?

It's just a pet peeve of mone, I didn't mean to step on any toes with my original post.

[DannyL]

Originally Posted by RayinAK

For a fast handling gun at close range, I would go with one of the .45-70's. However, if you can shoot a 12-gage shotgun well, load it with some tough slugs. Don't alternate slugs/buckshot, just load slugs all the way.

Next are the most popular cartridges in Alaska: the .30-06, .300WM, and .338WM. My favorite would be a .338WM with a 22" barrel, loaded with 250-grain bullets, or 275-grain A-Frame, or with 300-grain Woodleigh for close work.

ok folks, listen to this guy.
Now one other thing about a 12 guage, 30-06, or a 45-70.
Ammo can be had at any sporting goods store, and even the corner gas/grocery store.
oh... don't forget your .22 rifle. Very handy...

[travelmate38]

Originally Posted by snowpuppy

We are moving back to the bush in a few months. The first year we were out there, we came without weapons. We explored a lot of trails in the great unknown, and other than a few moose and a porcupine, we were fortunate enough not to tangle with any irate wildlife. That said, we did encounter bear and wolf tracks many times, along with scat, that let us know we weren't alone out there.

What kind of guns are best in the bush? We want something that will put a predator down the first time- not just p*** 'em off! Of course, we do take precautions and don't want to have to kill an animal. But we all know that sometimes that can't be avoided.

Thanks for your recommendations!

An expert to ask on this subject is Timothy Treadwell. He will tell you how to protect yourself during a wild life encounter.

[Marty Van Diest]

I have a little different take on this...one that might get me killed someday.

First, there is no gun that is guaranteed to put a bear down the first time. In fact many times in a bear attack there is no chance to shoot at all. You are hit before you can get a shot off.

If you have ever been in heavy bear country that is full of alders you can see how this can happen. This is Tim Treadwell country.

If I were in that kind of country I would have a short barrelled pump shotgun loaded with heavy slugs. I forget the name of the slugs but the guides know them...they start with a "b". But I would also want a handgun that was secured to my body.

I don't have one yet but I intend to get an airlite 357 magnum. This would only be used in actual "point blank" range which would be too close for a long gun of any kind.

Then, in all the other types of country that isn't crawling with bears, I will carry only the 357. It's better than what I carry now...which mostly is nothing. Since it only weighs about 12 ounces unloaded, it wouldn't bother me to carry it. I already have a big old 45 Long Colt, but it's a pain to carry.

I have had close encounters with a lot of brown bears over the years, but so far have only been false charged 2X. Both times they just stopped as if they recognized me, completely lost all show of hostility and wandered off. It's funny, but very few of the brown bears I have run into ran away. They just seem to saunter off with no concern. Most blackies run like a rabbit from a hound dog.

Bottom line, there are lots of other things to worry about. If you aren't in heavy bear country, don't worry too much.

PS...I found the name of the slugs: Brenneke Black Magic

[karibear]

Originally Posted by Marty Van Diest

I have a little different take on this...one that might get me killed someday.

First, there is no gun that is guaranteed to put a bear down the first time. In fact many times in a bear attack there is no chance to shoot at all. You are hit before you can get a shot off.

If you have ever been in heavy bear country that is full of alders you can see how this can happen. This is Tim Treadwell country.

If I were in that kind of country I would have a short barrelled pump shotgun loaded with heavy slugs. I forget the name of the slugs but the guides know them...they start with a "b". But I would also want a handgun that was secured to my body.

I don't have one yet but I intend to get an airlite 357 magnum. This would only be used in actual "point blank" range which would be too close for a long gun of any kind.

Then, in all the other types of country that isn't crawling with bears, I will carry only the 357. It's better than what I carry now...which mostly is nothing. Since it only weighs about 12 ounces unloaded, it wouldn't bother me to carry it. I already have a big old 45 Long Colt, but it's a pain to carry.

I have had close encounters with a lot of brown bears over the years, but so far have only been false charged 2X. Both times they just stopped as if they recognized me, completely lost all show of hostility and wandered off. It's funny, but very few of the brown bears I have run into ran away. They just seem to saunter off with no concern. Most blackies run like a rabbit from a hound dog.

Bottom line, there are lots of other things to worry about. If you aren't in heavy bear country, don't worry too much.

PS...I found the name of the slugs: Brenneke Black Magic

Forget about the hand gun. I've seen and heard a lot of Coasties from the deep south who were just "sure" they were the best hunters in the world - maybe they were, with raccoons - and their .44 would take anything down. I heard all this over and over because I was a civilian employee on the base for a couple years. I always told them to PUH-LEEZE talk to some of the locals with real, actual, experience with bears, because a Kodiak can take a heart shot and still run a hundred or more feet and kill you before it drops. The only way to keep one off is to break a shoulder, then they tend to run in a curve, they can't track straight on 3 legs with all that rage and adrenaline pumping. And it gives you a chance for another shot.

Of course, they'd all roll their eyes and give me that "she's just a woman, she don't know nothin" look - until they finally hooked up with one of the locals who'd tell them the same thing. And I always said the same thing, that just because I didn't hunt didn't mean I was deaf or stupid, and when the same kinds of people said the same things year after year, I tended to believe them. Some of them even came back and apologized, and asked if I had any recommendations for hunting. I always said no, none of those critters ever bothered me, I wasn't interested in doing anything that would bother them, and that included guide recommendations. What I didn't tell them was that most of the guides were friends and acquaintences, and no way was I going to recommend one over the rest.

And don't ever trust blackies to run. If they don't run, and a lot of them don't. they are the ones that would be more than happy to make a meal of you.

[icarian]

Politics, taxes, and which bear gun to have in Alaska...always sure to be a lively debate

[alaskaboy]

With Treadwell, even State Troopers begged him to keep a firearm. He refused and everyone knew it was only a matter of time. I'm truly surpised he got away with living among those bears for as long as he did. Even he himself seemed to know eventually his luck would run out. Bears are generally respectful of human, but once they cross that line, they don't go back.

I remember the many stories of bears stalking humans in Alaska for hours, even days without giving up. Do you recall the lady eaten by a small black bear a decade or so ago? She was a trained survivalist and the bear decided to harass her and her husband in their cabin. They climbed onto the roof and when the lady distracted the bear from the roof top, the husband jumped down and ran to the river where he had left his gun on his boat. When he returned, the bear was eating his wife.

If you go into the woods, mother nature's animals rule all, period. The only chance you have at being equal when things go array, is to carry a firearm and know how to use it. Cross a mother bear when she is with her cubs and all bets are off.

I read somewhere that during a bear encounter 95% of the time they will not charge after you, out of those 5% encounters that do result in a charge, 95% of those are bluffs. So the odds are you will never be charged and if you are it is a 95% chance the bear still will not attack. However, if you are that one unlucky person, a firearm sure comes in handy.