Weapon recommendations for use in the Bush (military, work)

[Barkingowl]

Xa'at I can understand your position, but sometimes there are predators among us that make bears & moose the more civilized ones. Even if you choose not to carry a firearm it would make me feel better if you knew your way around one & practiced with them so that if trouble came looking for you, you could win the day. Sorry about the rant & being off topic. Oh & I can only assume that bear spray is flammable. You could probably make a heck of a flame thrower out of one with a lighter.

[Xa'at]

I didn't say I don't know how to use one. I just said I refuse to carry one.

[Marty Van Diest]

Xa'at...I don't have any problem with you not carrying a gun. I don't carry one most of the time myself. It's just too much of a hassle to lug one around. I'll grab one if I think there is a decent chance of bears where I'm going.

Moose really aren't that dangerous. They do attack sometimes but far fewer people are killed by moose compared to bears. I wonder how the pepper spray would work on moose. If you are talking about moose down south you must be referring to the BMOCs

[Xa'at]

Originally Posted by Marty Van Diest

If you are talking about moose down south you must be referring to the BMOCs

I don't know what BMOC means. All I know is this moose was the size of a minivan and making some rather angry noises at me.

[rotorhead]

Gotta pipe up here, along with all the opinions here there's also some verifiably FALSE info posted here (from CA, go figure)

Bear spray is effective ONLY when sprayed directly at the bear at close range, NEVER "spray a ring around you" hoping to "repel" the bears.

Studies by wildlife biology types have found that bear spray is just as effective as a firearm at stopping a potential attack (if not more so) when used correctly as per the directions on the bottle. Ironically, they've also found that DILUTE pepper spray serves as a powerful bear attractant! They've even witnessed bears rolling in turf that's been previously sprayed, as if they LIKE the scent. ERGO, if you spray, go away. Not only have you verified that your present location has a problem bear nearby, but you've also put out a large, lingering cloud of bear attractant to draw in the more curious of the species. Time to find another place to hang out, preferably upwind.

Another consideration, the stuff works BOTH ways, so check your wind direction if you even think you're gonna have to use it. The effects of a faceful of full-strength bear-spray ranges from extremely unpleasant to outright disabling (at least in the short run) which can put you at a considerable disadvantage if you get it wrong in front of a predatory bear. If you nail yourself instead the effects are perhaps not quite as dramatic as shooting yourself with a magnum rifle, but your demise is likely to be less pleasant than a "mere" self-inflicted gunshot wound.

As for myself, I carry BOTH a large can of bear spray and a lightweight .44 magnum pistol. I don't shoot animals that I don't intend to eat, so I like to have a less-than-lethal option. You can always escalate to firearms usage if the spray doesn't work, but not the other way 'round. The 8.1 oz. bottle of "Counter Assault" and most other brands of the same size fit into the side tool pocket of a pair of Carharrts dungarees like it was custom-built for it, and falls readily to hand without fumbling with a holster strap.

[Glitch]

I agree with Xa'at in that I consider bears to be less of a threat than moose. Bears are at least quasi-predictable. You have a good idea how a bear will react in a given situation. Moose are completely unpredictable. They are just as likely to ignore you as attack you. I recall one year in Anchorage were 3 people were killed by moose, 2 by bear.

Where Xa'at and I part company is in our means of protection. I want some reasonable assurance that I can prevent an attack, whether by moose or bear. Pepper spray does not give me that assurance. However, a 12-gauge shotgun loaded with slugs does give me that assurance and is equally effective against either moose or bear.

Naturally, a firearm should only be used as a last resort. As Xa'at said, it is better to try and avoid the encounter in the first place. Keep a clean camp, be aware of your surroundings, and use common sense. I have never yet had cause to use a firearm in self-defense, and I hope that I never do, but I am prepared should that need arise.

[DannyL]

Originally Posted by Marty Van Diest

I wonder how the pepper spray would work on moose.

I wouldn't recommend it. Bear spray would probably blind him/her, really **** them off, and they would charge in God knows what direction. God help anything in their way smaller than a steel suspension bridge.

Just my .02 cents worth.....

[rotorhead]

If you want the REAL skinny on bear spray (for bears that is) you'll have to join me in badgering Blueberry into finally posting some of her hubbys data in that regards. I seem to recall her saying she was gonna send some stuff my way but that was a LONG time ago.

Hello Blueberry, are you lurking around out there?

[RayinAK]

Well, in relation to bears in Alaska for the past 100 years, there is a good web site to read data. Keep in mind that the data does not included deaths to bears from the past few years. Last year, I believe we had at least 2 deaths, not counting the guy who knew all about bears, and his girlfriend.

This is the "home" page, which has links to bear safety, pepper spray, and such:
Brown Bear Projects at the Alaska Science Center

This one, a link in the page above, shows you injury and death for the past 100 years:
A Century of Bear-Human Conflict in Alaska

[Glitch]

Originally Posted by rotorhead

If you want the REAL skinny on bear spray (for bears that is) you'll have to join me in badgering Blueberry into finally posting some of her hubbys data in that regards. I seem to recall her saying she was gonna send some stuff my way but that was a LONG time ago.

Hello Blueberry, are you lurking around out there?

Blueberry's husband wasn't Timothy Treadwell was he? Because if he was, there might be a slight delay in obtaining that data.