Drilling in ANWR (area, companies, seller)

[northbayeric]

Originally Posted by Floyd_Davidson

Why the need for such dishonesty? We are not funding terrorists with any hundreds of billions per year.

It sounds like you don't think Hugo Chavez is a terrorist. Maybe Alaska doesn't have Citgo gas stations, but most of the Lower 48 does.

Nor are we prevented from developing resources that make sense to develop. (And none of your silly characterizations were valid either!)

Yes we are prevented. We can't drill in ANWR--and according to you, you're more preoccupied with seeing to it that the Republicans "get theirs" than with trying to protect the environment up in that region.

Oh yes, but what about solar and wind power? Both entirely too inefficient. Birds fly into windmill blades and get killed all the time--and besides, the Kennedy family didn't want their Hyannis Port view obscured by a bunch of windmill turbines. Solar power? Please. You need petroleum to maintain the solar panels, and they take up A LOT--and I mean A LOT--of land area. That's bad for desert wildlife. There are plenty of "environmentalists" who oppose solar power for these very reasons.

The only hysterics come from those who propose non-viable "solutions" that do not solve the problem. Destroying ANWR might put money into the pockets of a lot of good Republican pockets, but it wouldn't reduce the price of gasoline by 5 cents a gallon. The same is true of setting up offshore oil spills...

There you have it, dear readers. The gentleman would prefer to see our energy dollars going to Hugo Chavez and Muslim extremists in Saudi Arabia than to our American oil companies because--God forbid--they're probably Republicans! Sir, do you have any idea how rich Dianne Feinstein, Barbara Boxer, Nancy Pelosi, the Kennedy family and Henry Waxman are? And on the general topic of petroleum drilling in general, why can China drill near the Gulf of Mexico and our own country can't?

The ANWR oil is there, and we can extract it in an environmentally responsible manner. Please stop holding the Alaskan economy hostage!

[mhouse2001]

Originally Posted by Moose Whisperer

Who cares. I'm not interested in what happened then, I'm concerned with what is happening NOW. You and Notrees need to get a room together. You have the same sick obsession with Bush.

Please review your own obsession with self-righteousness. You insult others because they believe differently and spray blanket generalizations over those you disagree with. A real nice guy, in other words.

Other technologies which would not require drilling in ANWR (or anywhere else for that matter) have been known for quite a number of years. They will NOT see the light of day because profits cannot be derived from them and the market cannot be controlled by a few suppliers. While it may seem logical that our use of fossil fuels needs to continue so why not drill in our own backyard, I think it's foolish and lazy to just continue the status quo. People need to get used to sacrifice, especially Americans who rely too heavily on natural resources for their standard of living. Unfortunately, Americans can't imagine giving up anything and consider it an affront to their "liberties" to be responsible earth stewards. Collectively, they don't care and their government doesn't mind that one bit. It makes more sense to be pro-active now then to pay the heavy price later on.

My worldview involves near term intense changes to our American way of life, most of them forced on us (don't get partisan on me, it's far larger than that petty manufactured divisiveness). So issues like energy and ANWR won't be addressed until after the dust settles. My hope is that one of the best possible outcomes--one wherein hidden technologies are revealed--comes to fruition.

[Floyd_Davidson]

Originally Posted by northbayeric

It sounds like you don't think Hugo Chavez is a terrorist. Maybe Alaska doesn't have Citgo gas stations, but most of the Lower 48 does.

Well, if you think the guy that Bush attempted (and failed) to overthrow is a terrorist, what does that make Bush? And no we do not send hundreds of billions a year to Venezuela.

Your opinion isn't worth diddly squat if you insist on manufacturing "facts" to support it rather basing it on truths.

Oh, BTW, Chavez donates heating fuel to Alaska villages. That's more than Bush ever did for them.

Yes we are prevented. We can't drill in ANWR--and according to you, you're more preoccupied with seeing to it that the Republicans "get theirs" than with trying to protect the environment up in that region.

Eh? That doesn't make any sense at all.

There you have it, dear readers. The gentleman would prefer to see our energy dollars going to Hugo Chavez and Muslim extremists in Saudi Arabia than to our American oil companies because--God forbid--they're probably Republicans!

Wrong again. Nobody has suggested that our energy dollars go to Americans. You think BP (or even Connico for that matter), the biggest producer on the North Slope is American??? What does British Petroleum mean to you? And what do you think an "International" company is?

Regardless of that, the point I've been making is that anyone who thinks we can drill our way out of dependence on foreign oil needs an education.

The ANWR oil is there, and we can extract it in an environmentally responsible manner.

Sure there's oil in ANWR. But not enough to be worth the damage we'd do getting it. And not enough to be of any significance at all anyway. The idea that in ten years time we could have some mythical 1 million barrels a day flowing is hilarious, except that people believe it.

Note that I live inside the area known as NPR-A, the National Petroleum Reserve -- Alaska. The USGS says it has just about the same amount of oil reserves that ANWR does, in just about the same type of formations. We've been drilling in the NPR-A since the late 1940's, and yet there has never been a single commercially producing well.

Do you know of any reason that ANWR would be different?

[Moose Whisperer]

Originally Posted by mhouse2001

Please review your own obsession with self-righteousness. You insult others because they believe differently and spray blanket generalizations over those you disagree with. A real nice guy, in other words..

Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa:cryi ng:

Originally Posted by mhouse2001

...I think it's foolish and lazy to just continue...People need to get used to sacrifice...My worldview involves near term intense changes to our American way of life...most of them forced on us...

Talk about self-righteous and arrogant. Holly cripes, who teaches you people this drivel? No wonder the American economy is in a backslide. If we survive as a nation until the next presidential election it will be a miracle.

[notreesininceland]

A place like ANWR should be off-limits to commercial exploitation. Whether or not there is oil there is IRRELEVANT. Some places on the planet should be left just the way there are. Period. 25, 50, 100 years are not much in the life of a nation considered over a long term. America will find a way not just to survive but thrive. But you despoil a place and it remains despoiled for thousands of years. I am surprised I have to explain these elementary points to allegedly grown-up men here.

[Floyd_Davidson]

Originally Posted by Moose Whisperer

Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa:cryi ng:

Good point! The best one you've made yet, in fact!

If we survive as a nation until the next presidential election it will be a miracle.

The miracle was that we survived eight years of Bush. Of course it's yet to be seen if we actually can recover from that...

[mhouse2001]

Originally Posted by Moose Whisperer

Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa:cryi ng:

Talk about self-righteous and arrogant. Holly cripes, who teaches you people this drivel? No wonder the American economy is in a backslide. If we survive as a nation until the next presidential election it will be a miracle.

What are you 5? Such a childish response, albeit typical, oh so typical of the right side of the ideological perspective. Your calling me self-righteous and arrogant in reference to my view of the future is irrational at best. What do you mean by "you people"? You know nothing about me but immediately group me in with other people you despise. Kind of substantiates very nicely my original post, don't you think? Or are you not old enough to add two and two together? Then you go on to blame this group, the one you assigned me to, for the economic backslide. Wow, that's a stretch of herculean proportions. That's what happens when you have nothing constructive to add but want to vent anyway.

Despite this, I agree with your very last statement. Only I'm astute enough to assign blame to everyone, regardless of ideology. It's a pity you can't see how your one-sidedness only serves to exacerbate the situation.

[Moose Whisperer]

Originally Posted by mhouse2001

What do you mean by "you people"? You know nothing about me but immediately group me in with other people you despise.

What? Read your own profile. You voted for Nader. Gives you about as much credibility as ole spaceship Kucinich. ET phone home.

[Xplorer]

Please take the time to watch this video...

You guys need to sit and watch this. he gives amples of proof. its all about oil, alaska, iraq, iran and etc... simply astounding!.. its quite long at over an hour but i promise this is something you should hear.. I am hearing it as I work. simply shocking and quite depressing about our gov't and how and why we are in Iraq and etc... you just have to hear it to understand. btw the speaker is a former preacher.


The Energy Non-Crisis

[Floyd_Davidson]

Originally Posted by Xplorer

Please take the time to watch this video...

You guys need to sit and watch this. he gives amples of proof. its all about oil, alaska, iraq, iran and etc... simply astounding!.. its quite long at over an hour but i promise this is something you should hear.. I am hearing it as I work. simply shocking and quite depressing about our gov't and how and why we are in Iraq and etc... you just have to hear it to understand. btw the speaker is a former preacher.


The Energy Non-Crisis

Yeah, and like many preachers, he's full of prunes.

I listened to less than a minute, and was rolling on the floor. First he said there's as much oil on the North Slope of Alaska as there is in Saudi Arabi. Then he quoted Frank Murkowski, former governor of Alaska, saying Alaska could supply the countries energy needs for a couple hundred years. Murkowski is not credible, and neither is your former preacher.

What I don't understand is how anyone could listen to more than a few minutes of that and not realize that nothing the guy says can be taken as gospel. He lies. He says whatever he thinks you would most want to hear! And you suckered up on it too!

I'm not going to listen to it, but I challenge anyone who does to come up with something the guy says that is honest and significant.