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Unread 03-24-2009, 10:03 AM
 
1,688 posts, read 3,295,945 times
Reputation: 1751
Default Canine origin & psychology

Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyersFan View Post
they pull that sled purely out of obedience and the desire to please their owner.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyersFan View Post
the dog can't make an "intelligent" decision about this nor is it asked if it would like to compete nor do we know that it enjoys hauling a sled all those miles.....

FF- on a point of order:

You are either ill-informed or mistaken. A dog's drive, be it to retrieve, to point, to set, to herd or to pull a sled has taken place over thousands of years of evolution and selective breeding.

The drive that pushes a canine to enjoy an action or a task to the extent that the action/task of and by itself is the reward, has ZERO to do with either obedience &/or wanting to "please".

I suggest you learn the basics of canine psychology and behaviour. Plenty of good solid academic articles out there for you to enjoy. And NO, Cesar Milan doesn't qualify.

Your second post shows some of the very muddled thinking that goes hand in hand with anthropomorphism. You are ascribing human thoughts and values to canines under the misguided notion that canine logic is tantamount to human logic. Again, as a point of fact, you are wrong.

I suggest you go back to Canine Psychology and Behaviour 101 - "A BASIC Introduction."

 
Unread 03-24-2009, 10:16 AM
 
Location: valdez, ak
109 posts, read 199,036 times
Reputation: 68
Quote:
Originally Posted by warptman View Post
peta, the other nazis...
pmsl!!!:d
 
Unread 03-24-2009, 10:20 AM
 
Location: Bethel, Alaska
20,876 posts, read 20,360,254 times
Reputation: 11597
Yes, it does look like they hate pulling a sled...


YouTube - North American
 
Unread 03-24-2009, 10:22 AM
 
Location: Bethel, Alaska
20,876 posts, read 20,360,254 times
Reputation: 11597
Peta/Earth First...yup, they're a sane bunch of people...


YouTube - Emotional Hippies - Crying Over Dead Trees
 
Unread 03-24-2009, 10:36 AM
 
Location: The Woods
14,033 posts, read 11,976,375 times
Reputation: 5502
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyersFan View Post
Sure.....dogs love pulling heavy sleds through snow in sub-zero temperatures for over a thousand miles with someone on the back of the sled screaming in their ear all the way.......sounds like a lot of fun to me.....gee....throw in the torn muscles, broken limbs and other assorted injurjies not to mention the occasional frozen dog and you've got yourself a really enjoyable time that no dog wants to miss !!! Since you seem to want to present yourself as an authority on dogs enjoying this activity I'd like to know specifically how do you know the dogs enjoy pulling that sled as opposed to enjoying pleasing their masters demands ?
You mischaracterize these races, sounds like PETA propaganda. There are checkpoints at which any injured dog gets proper treatment and is removed from the race. Mushers put a lot of time, work, money and care into their dogs, they don't want their dogs harmed or killed.


Quote:
Yes.....actually its very easy.....you have no idea how "stupid" this all sounds to those in the other 49 states.
You have no clue what Alaska is like...

Here's a couple recent news stories: newsminer.com • Be prepared

Deep snow calls a halt to modern-day Serum Run: Outdoors | adn.com

Weather history for area my property is at, cold, unpredictable weather is simply a fact of life in Alaska, if no one did anything when it's below zero nothing would get done: History : Weather Underground


Quote:
.....surely your not going to attempt to compare the weather conditions and length of races in New England to that of the one in Alaska....are you ?.....
That wasn't my point and you know it, though it does indeed get to 20 or 30 below commonly in Northern VT. The point is sled dogs enjoy pulling sleds. The longer the better to sled dogs...
 
Unread 03-24-2009, 10:37 AM
 
Location: Rossville, TN
10 posts, read 23,327 times
Reputation: 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyersFan View Post
Sure.....dogs love pulling heavy sleds through snow in sub-zero temperatures for over a thousand miles with someone on the back of the sled screaming in their ear all the way.......sounds like a lot of fun to me.....gee....throw in the torn muscles, broken limbs and other assorted injurjies not to mention the occasional frozen dog and you've got yourself a really enjoyable time that no dog wants to miss !!! Since you seem to want to present yourself as an authority on dogs enjoying this activity I'd like to know specifically how do you know the dogs enjoy pulling that sled as opposed to enjoying pleasing their masters demands ?
FF- at first I was confused about the screaming, torn muscles, broken limbs, etc. Sounded like fans at a hockey game in NJ at first. They seem to enjoy it just as much as dogs doing what they were bred to do.

As a long time dog owner, never sled dogs but other "working breeds", I've had retrievers that would bust through buckbrush all day long, wearing the skin off their bellies and never stopping because they loved doing what they did. I had a Lab once that would see me get a shotgun out and would go sit by the door shaking in anticipation. This dog would sit in a blind with ice balls in her hair all day just to pick up a duck, work so hard she'd fall asleep halfway across the living room floor when coming home in the evening, and be up at 3 AM to do it again.

From your posts, it would be hard to assume you ever had the pleasure and honor of owning a good working dog. I'll bet the mushers share the same sentiment about their animals as I do with my dog, my wife with her performance horse or any other animal owner that cares for these animals daily and, moreover, has taken the time to understand the animal's needs. A working animal needs the work to be balanced and happy.

Yes, it's tragic that these animaks died. Question though, if the musher had frozen to death, would PETA be fussing like they are? From the report, the musher did everything he could under the circumstances to keep himself AND his animals alive. Any responsible pet owner would have done that.

For my 2 cents- we should take the PETA folks that wrap themselves in saran wrap and leave them in the sun for a few hours.....whatever happened to common sense? Bet many of them have never read Genesis 1:26.
 
Unread 03-24-2009, 10:41 AM
 
Location: Fairbanks, AK
67 posts, read 119,718 times
Reputation: 55
so the guy almost froze to death, as well... but he was prepared with the proper gear to protect himself.

It seems to me like these extreme temperatures are a known risk, so why wasn't the musher carrying gear that could protect the dogs, as well? Insulation from the snow is only going to keep you so warm in -45 degrees.

At the very least, some sort of new regulations should come out of this- requirements to have weather gear for the dogs.
 
Unread 03-24-2009, 10:42 AM
 
Location: South Dakota
4,167 posts, read 5,491,118 times
Reputation: 1826
Quote:
Originally Posted by rav4grl View Post
Any animal abuse that can be stopped should be. No question about it! The Iditerod team racing has been known to leave dogs behind if they cannot continue on, only to freeze and die a horrible death.
Where are your sources for this statement, please? From what I have seen and heard, if a dog cannot go any further, it is flown off the trail to for instance, Anchorage, where it is cared for.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rav4grl View Post
PETA is not a perfect organization by far, and yes they have some outhere people involved. Yes, they can do more damage than good. But one thing they do accomplish is bringing attention to the welfare of an animal/animals that cannot speak up for themselves!
PETA does not accomplish that at all. Most who have taken the time to learn what PETA is really about know that the attention is for THEM, not for the animal.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rav4grl View Post
If they could speak out I am sure they would all rather be lying next to a nice warm fireplace, next to their owners.
You do not know much about these dogs, do you?
 
Unread 03-24-2009, 10:42 AM
 
Location: Seatte, WA
1,606 posts, read 2,710,730 times
Reputation: 1454
Toss them in jail!
 
Unread 03-24-2009, 10:44 AM
 
15,911 posts, read 7,670,562 times
Reputation: 5903
Some humans are so sick By that I mean those people turning animals into weird creatures nature would never have brought about.
I think we should simply leave animals alone, neither harm them, nor use them, nor make pets out of them in order to replace the people we don't want to take care of.
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