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Greetings, all!
TLDR: If you rent in Albuquerque, did your landlord give you a copy of the lease agreement before you moved in?
I visited seven landlords in a whirlwind tour over a long weekend, all fairly major apartment complexes. One thing stuck out as odd. None of them would show me the lease agreement. Some hemmed and hawed, some were evasive, some said "I'll have to talk to my manager and get back to you" but ultimately all seven, without exception, refused point-blank to show me the contract for the product that they were theoretically trying to sell me.
Is this...is this just a cultural *thing* in Albuquerque?
Where I come from, every landlord just gave the lease out freely. The tech-savvy ones put it on their website. The less tech-savvy ones put it in the front office with their printed ad. I never thought about *why* they did it. Possibly just because it was a universally known fact that a landlord who wouldn't show you the lease had something to hide. Like...they had a hidden mold problem they were trying to trick you into paying for with a mold clause hidden in the fine print, or something. I don't know, I never gave it much thought. Maybe it was just that every landlord has something they're persnickety about --- pet policies, sublet policies, whatever --- and being upfront causes tenants to effectively screen themselves. What could they possibly have to gain by *concealing* the information?
The seventh landlord actually did tell me why she didn't want to part with the lease --- because if she did, and I didn't move in, I could use the lease as "proof" that I lived there. Therefore, if my application was approved, then I would come in and read the lease right there in her office, and if I signed it, then and only then could I get a copy.
This explanation was so bizarre that I didn't even know what to say. It turns out that, indeed, you can use a rental agreement as proof of address. http://www.mvd.newmexico.gov/uploads...v2015Final.pdf
But...I mean...I'm pretty sure the MVD won't accept it if the landlord hasn't signed it. And if the MVD *would*, then concealing the lease wouldn't help: It's not like I don't have access to word-processing software, it's not like sample leases aren't freely available online, and it's not like the MVD knows what their real lease looks like in the first place.
Not to mention...what kind of crime requires getting *your* mail to go to *someone else*? Identity thieves want to get *my* mail to go to *their* address. Giving out somebody else's address as their own wouldn't help any would-be malfeasor.
Oh, and they accept a lease as proof of address in Illinois, too. https://www.cyberdriveillinois.com/p...s/dsd_x173.pdf
(No idea whether they'd accept an *unsigned* lease. I never tried, obviously.) Nobody in Illinois ever thought this was an issue.
When the first landlord refused to show me the lease, I thought "Oh, it's some kind of scam. Weird, they seemed all polished and corporate, but whatever, that's why I scheduled more visits." But all seven? Either I have the worst luck in the world, or...maybe this is just normal for Albuquerque? Hence my question.
Location: In my cat's house, until she finds a better human servant
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Maybe a regional thing? I've rented in large cities in various states, never needed to see the agreement beforehand for a residential property, it was pretty easy to go through it and sign (or not) if I decided to rent there. Never saw anything that concerned me to think I was getting screwed over. I don't know of anyone personally who demanded to see it before the signing (the contracts are generally not complicated or in legalese) maybe where you are moving from there are more bad landlords so you are cautious?
ETA: I always had a signed copy of the lease before I "moved in"
I can understand them not wanting you to have a copy of the lease in your posession, before it's signed, since I guess you could cause problems by falsifying it (with a forged signature for the landlord), when you might not actually be accpted to rent. I don't think it's acceptable for a landlord to withhold a lease from you until you've actually moved in, however!
I honestly don't remember whether I've ever had my own copy of a lease before signing it. I have certainly looked over a lease before signing. Back in Philadelphia there was one case when I insisted that a clause be included in the lease stating that certain problems would be fixed by a certain time (better windows that needed to be put in).
Edited: because I think I misunderstood the original post a little, the first time around.
2015 New Mexico renter's guide:
Quote:
Although New Mexico law requires a written rental agreement or lease (NMSA § 47-8-20(G)), some landlords don’t use them. Usually, a landlord who refuses to give the tenant a written rental agreement is a landlord the tenant may have trouble with down the road.
Personally, I've had better experiences with landlords in Albuquerque than I did with landlords in Philadelphia. My current landlords have not raised my rent in six years. In turn, I pay my rent early when I can, and avoid bothering them with problems that I don't consider essential. In Philadelphia I sometimes had to cite chapter and verse of local housing codes to get things done!
Last edited by ApartmentNomad; 07-30-2017 at 03:25 PM..
I tried to find a more recent print of this guide but it appears this is the latest. And it is an excellent guide for anyone needing to know the ins and outs of leasing a residence in New Mexico.
I'm on my second landlord in ABQ. Both provided a copy of the lease and asked me to look it over to alert them to any errors or issues. This is after I said verbally that I wanted to move in and applied, however. If I didn't like the leash terms at that point, I could ask for an alteration or not take the place. These were not rental management companies, though. They were individuals with a few rental houses.
For six years, I was a property manager for a 44-unit apartment complex when I lived in Portland Oregon. In the process of showing units, if a prospective asked to read over our standard lease before deciding to apply, I was happy to have them read it in my office. I would also break down all the monies on paper for them. This was just good practice and the other on-site managers that worked for the company did the same.
Perhaps there is so much "scam" stuff going on in all over now that landlords in ABQ have gotten wary. You can use a lease as proof here, but it can't be the only proof, so a signed (even forged!) lease alone won't get you jack at the MVD. So I honestly don't think that is the reason. Maybe the competition between apartment complexes is so fierce in ABQ that they are nervous about other companies getting their lease terms?
Just a few months a drove around to do a market survey in two different areas of ABQ. I am a long-term renter and I like to be aware of changes and trends in the city apartment rental market. Also at the time I was trying to track the market rates. I don't lie. I just walk into an office and say I might consider moving but I have no firm date. That gets me a tour around and a discussion of the lease.
If you are already a tenant, you are required to receive a copy of your lease, but ...
If you are looking around and not signing, you will not get a copy of the lease from the professionally managed apartment complex. I finally found out why: they are considered copyrighted documents and they are all just slightly different. It sounds stupid but that is the way it is. After all everyone knows what leases are.
However when you go into the office, you should be able to read the lease there. Also ask LOTS of questions about everything important. It is time-consuming but renting an apartment should be an important decision.
Also, if you are from out-of-state or even live here--know your tenant rights and laws. Every state is different.
I'm on my second landlord in ABQ. Both provided a copy of the lease and asked me to look it over to alert them to any errors or issues. This is after I said verbally that I wanted to move in and applied, however. If I didn't like the leash terms at that point, I could ask for an alteration or not take the place. These were not rental management companies, though. They were individuals with a few rental houses.
For six years, I was a property manager for a 44-unit apartment complex when I lived in Portland Oregon. In the process of showing units, if a prospective asked to read over our standard lease before deciding to apply, I was happy to have them read it in my office. I would also break down all the monies on paper for them. This was just good practice and the other on-site managers that worked for the company did the same.
Perhaps there is so much "scam" stuff going on in all over now that landlords in ABQ have gotten wary. You can use a lease as proof here, but it can't be the only proof, so a signed (even forged!) lease alone won't get you jack at the MVD. So I honestly don't think that is the reason. Maybe the competition between apartment complexes is so fierce in ABQ that they are nervous about other companies getting their lease terms?
Sorry you had such a frustrating experience!
THAT is the big difference between Professional Managed places and owners just renting one or two properties. There can be negotiation between owners of only a few properties. Remember even if the law doesn't require it: always sign a lease when you are renting somewhere.
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