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Meat has been our survival for centuries. I do best with animal protein and have cut back portion sizes etc. Just ate a chicken sausage infused with feta cheese and spinach and no harsh additives. Open Nature brand is great. Ate my sausage in romaine lettuce leaves, no breads in this house. I buy most of meats from an organic source. No soy either if I have anything to say about that.
I could never be vegan or possibly even vegetarian. Every time I eat celery or cucumbers which I do like on occasion I just get more hungry. I even tried a parfait before for breakfast and that made me hungry too.
I need some meat or I'm not satisfied. Another problem I have is veggies go bad far too easily. I never get to eat much of the cucumber or celery before it starts getting dark. We even used a mini food saver that you attach but it didn't seem to make any difference.
I suppose you could take supplements as that is most likely what most vegans/vegetarians do but that doesn't seem very...for lack of a better word natural. They always say it's best to get your nutrients right from the source. I take supplements myself as they are fine if you really need them and inside they are the same thing but if you can eat the food that has it that might be better.
We are not designed to be herbivores anyway. Just look at our teeth. They're meant to chew up meat.
You remind me so much of myself even just before I "took the plunge"! As someoone who'd been diagnosed with hypoglycemia over 30 years ago the same excuses you're using were my favorite ones.
I don't know why you say that if you eat celery or cucumbers you get hungrier. Nobody eats just those things so I'm going to guess you meant eating them with other foods, that happened to me with other foods.
And I still have to eat other foods not long after eating fruit but that didn't stop me because the benefits outweigh a small thing like that.
As for your veggies going bad to soon could be because your fridge temperature is a bit too low or there's mold lurking in there, I get that to happen during the summer because I've lowered the temp during the winter, and when the fridge needs cleaning and the baking soda (which helps to kill mold) needs replacing.
Since I took tons of supplements for like 3 decades before I became a vegan it's entirely "natural" for me to continue taking a few, so that's not a good excuse either. And if you plan your diet properly the ONLY one you really need is vit. B12, which most people over 40 need, vegan or not - I began taking it long ago because I had several of the symptoms and an integrative medicine doctor advised it.
Oh dear heavens, tell me you didn't say our teeth are meant to chew meat! I don't mean to make fun of you but that's such an outdated misconception that I thought it had gone the way of the dinosaur. But I really don't blame you, that had been circulated for so long even I believed it long ago. But please watch this video and see why we are herbivores and only omnivores by choice:
That is not even the only reason for us to stop eating meat, the older we get the less stomach acid we produce and the harder it is to digest it and, therefore, to extract any benefit from it. It's well documented now that eating animal products contribute not only to cancer but to diabetes, heart disease, hypertension and a host of other health problems. And there's the issue of how unsustainable growing animals for food really is, how polluting and bad for the environment (for info on that please go to YT and look up the documentary "Cowspiracy" or "Meat the Truth"). And last, but certainly not least, the animals. Factory farming is a horrible practice that needs to stop. I only had an inkling of its horrors about 20 yrs. ago I saw on TV some news about how pigs were treated, at the time I stopped eating pork for years but due to a limited budget I began eating it again sometimes. Then in '14 I watched a documentary called "Food, Inc." on Netflix and it showed clips of animal abuse across the board and I felt sickened inside and wanted to stop, but due to my old beliefs ("it's not for me") and not knowing how to do it I only lasted like 2 days and just tried to reduce my meat consumption, but then I ended up eating more cheese, using whey protein, eating yogurt, etc. ignoring everything I'd read about the link of dairy with breast cancer... which my mother died of. Thank goodness "life" pushed me to get past my old beliefs.
Maybe you're just not ready to change, perhaps you need time to learn more and either be convinced or find the right motivation. I had it in my ever worsening health and now all I regret is not having done it sooner.
I hate seeing these animal abuse documentaries, even though they do good in getting the word out. Joaquin Phoenix is wonderful and such a great advocate for animals!
Being vegetarian is easier than vegan. As I've been telling my vegan friend for years, vegan cheese doesn't taste as good, and tofu chicken and steak need improving. I've made lots of vegan recipes and cooking takes longer, many recipes require a lot of prep work. I'm guessing that making vegan food taste good, simply requires more work. The end results have been good though.
The other day, when my spouse and I were driving through dairy country, I mentioned the cruelty of the veal industry. He didn't know, so I told him. He totally agreed it's a cruel industry. The thing is, there are a lot of sociopaths involved in animal abuse. People get paid to kill/maim animals. They are indifferent and not about to stop. That makes it very hard, since decent people do feel bad and want to help, but people getting paid will do anything to keep the money rolling in.
I know what you mean, yesterday I accidentally watched a video that had cruelty clips and I ended up crying out of sadness and outrage.
I started out thinking being vegetarian would be easier for me but under the weight of evidence of how eggs nor dairy are not good for us, plus the fact that it still involves animal exploitation after 5 weeks I went all the way and don't regret it. I did struggle for a while because I liked to use a "creamer" in my coffee and the only vegan one I found at a supermarket was still too watery for me. But then I had the idea of ordering a powdered soy milk made from tofu which tastes better than regular, and powdered coconut milk and that worked great for me. As for cheese, I didn't have much to choose from here so when I went to a bigger city I bought a block of Daiya "cheddar" and was very impressed, then I found the slices here and I've been happy with that. Not so much with a mozzarella of another brand that I tried. And for a while I bought a smoked Gouda that was more or less ok, but my objection is that they're all very high in fat and I try to eat low fat. However, I learned that there are many other brands out there that people sing the praises of, it just depends of where we live. Some can be ordered on the 'net but they're expensive, like the cultured cheeses that supposedly taste like the real thing. There's even a book on how to make them and free recipes online but once I weaned myself from cow's milk cheese, which is addictive, I don't feel motivated to go to all that length, cheese has just become an occasional thing.
I found it interesting that you said vegan meals take longer to prepare when my experience was the exact opposite and I was SO thrilled because I'd get tired easily and don't even like to cook every single day. I guess it depends on our taste and what we choose to fix. What I noticed is that chopping a lot of veggies for my stfries, which is not always necessary but I would get carried away, is what took me "long", but definitely not longer than when I combined them with meat; the cooking was a breeze as chopped veggies only take a few min. to cook as opposed to meat, perhaps with the exception of a fish. For me what take the longest are things like beans and rice, but I solved that by cooking enough for several meals and freezing the excess. I also have a pressure cooker which shortens the cooking time to 1/3. Even rice (white) I can have ready in just 15-20 min. tops. I don't even keep the burner on the entire time, I start out with a covered pot and low heat and once most of the water is absorbed I turn it off, cover with a couple of old folded dish towels and let it rest for 10 min. and it's done. Brown rice I often fix in the pressure cooker too. I use rice pasta because I'm wheat intolerant and that cooks very fast. Another favorite of mine is veggie tacos and I only need 5 min. to chop a few veggies, 1 min. to warm up the corn tortillas, and another couple to assemble them so at first I relied on them a lot. When I make oven fries or potato chunks it may take a little longer but since I use a toaster oven they're really done like in 15 min.
or little more. Perhaps when you want to have a "Meatless Monday" you could try some of the simpler things I've mentioned. There's also plenty of videos on YT of recipes that take 10-15 min. to prepare, my favorite channel is "cheap lazy vegan".
It's all really about the $$, the meat, dairy and egg industry are very powerful both in the U.S. and the UK from what I've heard. However, with more people becoming aware of the cruelty and even going vegan overnight, the message is being sent loud and clear and while it's going to take time, one day those awful practices will disappear because there will simply be too few people who don't care how they get their meat, etc. I saw a documentary about all the new companies making vegan foods and all the big name ones that have been around "forever" making vegan foods due to the increased demand. The consumer votes with his/her wallet, and since businesses exist to make money they don't care how they make it, so if people in increasing numbers demand vegan foods you'd better believe they'll make them.
Prior to becoming a vegan 1 1/2 yrs. ago I had not heard of vegan "mayo" and the only one I saw here cost me $5 (mostly wasted because it expired pretty soon) and didn't really taste so good, but recently I bought a bigger jar of a different brand at Aldi, of all places, that cost me $2.99 and made my potato salad taste identical as before. So more and better products are coming, that's for sure. But there was a huge scandal over vegan mayo just a few years ago that even involved someone suggesting a "hit" be put on the president of a competing company because "it was bad for the egg industry".
You remind me so much of myself even just before I "took the plunge"! As someoone who'd been diagnosed with hypoglycemia over 30 years ago the same excuses you're using were my favorite ones.
I don't know why you say that if you eat celery or cucumbers you get hungrier. Nobody eats just those things so I'm going to guess you meant eating them with other foods, that happened to me with other foods.
And I still have to eat other foods not long after eating fruit but that didn't stop me because the benefits outweigh a small thing like that.
As for your veggies going bad to soon could be because your fridge temperature is a bit too low or there's mold lurking in there, I get that to happen during the summer because I've lowered the temp during the winter, and when the fridge needs cleaning and the baking soda (which helps to kill mold) needs replacing.
Since I took tons of supplements for like 3 decades before I became a vegan it's entirely "natural" for me to continue taking a few, so that's not a good excuse either. And if you plan your diet properly the ONLY one you really need is vit. B12, which most people over 40 need, vegan or not - I began taking it long ago because I had several of the symptoms and an integrative medicine doctor advised it.
Oh dear heavens, tell me you didn't say our teeth are meant to chew meat! I don't mean to make fun of you but that's such an outdated misconception that I thought it had gone the way of the dinosaur. But I really don't blame you, that had been circulated for so long even I believed it long ago. But please watch this video and see why we are herbivores and only omnivores by choice:
That is not even the only reason for us to stop eating meat, the older we get the less stomach acid we produce and the harder it is to digest it and, therefore, to extract any benefit from it. It's well documented now that eating animal products contribute not only to cancer but to diabetes, heart disease, hypertension and a host of other health problems. And there's the issue of how unsustainable growing animals for food really is, how polluting and bad for the environment (for info on that please go to YT and look up the documentary "Cowspiracy" or "Meat the Truth"). And last, but certainly not least, the animals. Factory farming is a horrible practice that needs to stop. I only had an inkling of its horrors about 20 yrs. ago I saw on TV some news about how pigs were treated, at the time I stopped eating pork for years but due to a limited budget I began eating it again sometimes. Then in '14 I watched a documentary called "Food, Inc." on Netflix and it showed clips of animal abuse across the board and I felt sickened inside and wanted to stop, but due to my old beliefs ("it's not for me") and not knowing how to do it I only lasted like 2 days and just tried to reduce my meat consumption, but then I ended up eating more cheese, using whey protein, eating yogurt, etc. ignoring everything I'd read about the link of dairy with breast cancer... which my mother died of. Thank goodness "life" pushed me to get past my old beliefs.
Maybe you're just not ready to change, perhaps you need time to learn more and either be convinced or find the right motivation. I had it in my ever worsening health and now all I regret is not having done it sooner.
The need for B12 pretty much sinks any argument that we are naturally anything other than omnivores. We are, naturally, omnivores. We can't synthesize our own Vit C (like most mammals) and we can't synthesize our own B12 - and unlike some ruminants we do not have sufficient B12-synthesizing bacteria living in us. Hence - we are omnivores, in the middle, by nature.
So forget the natural argument I agree - its just a matter of informed choice and ethical viewpoint.
The need for B12 pretty much sinks any argument that we are naturally anything other than omnivores. We are, naturally, omnivores. We can't synthesize our own Vit C (like most mammals) and we can't synthesize our own B12 - and unlike some ruminants we do not have sufficient B12-synthesizing bacteria living in us. Hence - we are omnivores, in the middle, by nature.
So forget the natural argument I agree - its just a matter of informed choice and ethical viewpoint.
That's what I used to believe until I learned that B12 but precisely because B12 is made by a bacteria it doesn't change anything for me. I've known this for decades after reading it in one of Adelle Davis' books. What is happening today is that people's gut bacteria have been altered by the bad food choices most of us have made at one point or another, also our higyene practices inevitably wash out the bacteria that lives in the soil and which cows can get, but even today they are being supplemented with B12. So I find your dismissal of the entire video, which I bet you don't want to watch, based on this point not very fair, besides being convenient to justify eating things that are really ruining people's health and the whole environment. But no surprise there, I used to think the same exact way. "Funny" how some of us can change our minds when we decide to consider the other side of a matter.
I know what you mean, yesterday I accidentally watched a video that had cruelty clips and I ended up crying out of sadness and outrage.
I started out thinking being vegetarian would be easier for me but under the weight of evidence of how eggs nor dairy are not good for us, plus the fact that it still involves animal exploitation after 5 weeks I went all the way and don't regret it. I did struggle for a while because I liked to use a "creamer" in my coffee and the only vegan one I found at a supermarket was still too watery for me. But then I had the idea of ordering a powdered soy milk made from tofu which tastes better than regular, and powdered coconut milk and that worked great for me. As for cheese, I didn't have much to choose from here so when I went to a bigger city I bought a block of Daiya "cheddar" and was very impressed, then I found the slices here and I've been happy with that. Not so much with a mozzarella of another brand that I tried. And for a while I bought a smoked Gouda that was more or less ok, but my objection is that they're all very high in fat and I try to eat low fat. However, I learned that there are many other brands out there that people sing the praises of, it just depends of where we live. Some can be ordered on the 'net but they're expensive, like the cultured cheeses that supposedly taste like the real thing. There's even a book on how to make them and free recipes online but once I weaned myself from cow's milk cheese, which is addictive, I don't feel motivated to go to all that length, cheese has just become an occasional thing.
I found it interesting that you said vegan meals take longer to prepare when my experience was the exact opposite and I was SO thrilled because I'd get tired easily and don't even like to cook every single day. I guess it depends on our taste and what we choose to fix. What I noticed is that chopping a lot of veggies for my stfries, which is not always necessary but I would get carried away, is what took me "long", but definitely not longer than when I combined them with meat; the cooking was a breeze as chopped veggies only take a few min. to cook as opposed to meat, perhaps with the exception of a fish. For me what take the longest are things like beans and rice, but I solved that by cooking enough for several meals and freezing the excess. I also have a pressure cooker which shortens the cooking time to 1/3. Even rice (white) I can have ready in just 15-20 min. tops. I don't even keep the burner on the entire time, I start out with a covered pot and low heat and once most of the water is absorbed I turn it off, cover with a couple of old folded dish towels and let it rest for 10 min. and it's done. Brown rice I often fix in the pressure cooker too. I use rice pasta because I'm wheat intolerant and that cooks very fast. Another favorite of mine is veggie tacos and I only need 5 min. to chop a few veggies, 1 min. to warm up the corn tortillas, and another couple to assemble them so at first I relied on them a lot. When I make oven fries or potato chunks it may take a little longer but since I use a toaster oven they're really done like in 15 min.
or little more. Perhaps when you want to have a "Meatless Monday" you could try some of the simpler things I've mentioned. There's also plenty of videos on YT of recipes that take 10-15 min. to prepare, my favorite channel is "cheap lazy vegan".
It's all really about the $$, the meat, dairy and egg industry are very powerful both in the U.S. and the UK from what I've heard. However, with more people becoming aware of the cruelty and even going vegan overnight, the message is being sent loud and clear and while it's going to take time, one day those awful practices will disappear because there will simply be too few people who don't care how they get their meat, etc. I saw a documentary about all the new companies making vegan foods and all the big name ones that have been around "forever" making vegan foods due to the increased demand. The consumer votes with his/her wallet, and since businesses exist to make money they don't care how they make it, so if people in increasing numbers demand vegan foods you'd better believe they'll make them.
Prior to becoming a vegan 1 1/2 yrs. ago I had not heard of vegan "mayo" and the only one I saw here cost me $5 (mostly wasted because it expired pretty soon) and didn't really taste so good, but recently I bought a bigger jar of a different brand at Aldi, of all places, that cost me $2.99 and made my potato salad taste identical as before. So more and better products are coming, that's for sure. But there was a huge scandal over vegan mayo just a few years ago that even involved someone suggesting a "hit" be put on the president of a competing company because "it was bad for the egg industry".
When I started cooking vegan, I chose a lot of gourmet meals. Tasty, but labor intensive. I remember one vegan cassoulet that was out of this world, took a couple hours to make though. I also used to get vegan recipes from a local vegan chef that he sent out online. Great dinners and deserts, took a skill level to make though. You mentioned so many great suggestions, thanks! Those veggie tacos will be on the menu soon. Tonight's dinner is vegan, Mexican pasta, with veggies and seasoning. No meat or cheese. You don't have to sell me on coconut milk. So Delicious yogurt is amazing!
Diaya cheddar sounds like a brand to try. I agree, vegan food will get better and better if the demand is there. Years ago, I tried a Chinese vegan restaurant, where they specialized in making tofu chicken, beef, fish. The dishes were prepared to look like meat, and were spiced accordingly. I thought the taste was a little off, although my friends raved about it. My favorite thing on the menu was tofu, cooked with veggies and seasoned like tofu. I haven't tried any tofu meat substitute since, although veggie burgers are good and you never miss the meat.
I hope you're right about the decline of slaughterhouses. Years ago, I sold an insurance policy to a man and his family. Afterward, we were chatting and it came out that he worked in a slaughterhouse. His job was hanging up poultry by their feet to be beheaded by the machines. This man didn't have much in the way of formal education, and may have struggled in a paperwork job. He was a decent person though, and I could see in his eyes how upset this work made him, as he was telling me about it. I wonder what questions facilities that kill or hurt animals ask potential employees to weed out the sensitive? Worse yet, what types get the job?
Factory farming is wrong on so many levels. I got some baby chicks this spring, after we recently moved to the country. They are such cute and endearing little things. Totally spoiled. Battery hens lead a short, miserable life and of all the animals, they have made me not want to buy eggs. I opt for cage free, although I was talking with my friend who is vegan recently and she said cage free is not as it seems. The hens are allowed very little space, it's nothing like the industry wants us to believe. That thug who wanted to kill an innocent person is disgusting and probably a good example of the types who run these places.
When I started cooking vegan, I chose a lot of gourmet meals. Tasty, but labor intensive. I remember one vegan cassoulet that was out of this world, took a couple hours to make though. I also used to get vegan recipes from a local vegan chef that he sent out online. Great dinners and deserts, took a skill level to make though. You mentioned so many great suggestions, thanks! Those veggie tacos will be on the menu soon. Tonight's dinner is vegan, Mexican pasta, with veggies and seasoning. No meat or cheese. You don't have to sell me on coconut milk. So Delicious yogurt is amazing!
Diaya cheddar sounds like a brand to try. I agree, vegan food will get better and better if the demand is there. Years ago, I tried a Chinese vegan restaurant, where they specialized in making tofu chicken, beef, fish. The dishes were prepared to look like meat, and were spiced accordingly. I thought the taste was a little off, although my friends raved about it. My favorite thing on the menu was tofu, cooked with veggies and seasoned like tofu. I haven't tried any tofu meat substitute since, although veggie burgers are good and you never miss the meat.
I hope you're right about the decline of slaughterhouses. Years ago, I sold an insurance policy to a man and his family. Afterward, we were chatting and it came out that he worked in a slaughterhouse. His job was hanging up poultry by their feet to be beheaded by the machines. This man didn't have much in the way of formal education, and may have struggled in a paperwork job. He was a decent person though, and I could see in his eyes how upset this work made him, as he was telling me about it. I wonder what questions facilities that kill or hurt animals ask potential employees to weed out the sensitive? Worse yet, what types get the job?
Factory farming is wrong on so many levels. I got some baby chicks this spring, after we recently moved to the country. They are such cute and endearing little things. Totally spoiled. Battery hens lead a short, miserable life and of all the animals, they have made me not want to buy eggs. I opt for cage free, although I was talking with my friend who is vegan recently and she said cage free is not as it seems. The hens are allowed very little space, it's nothing like the industry wants us to believe. That thug who wanted to kill an innocent person is disgusting and probably a good example of the types who run these places.
Thanks for your reply, I enjoyed reading it! I sincerely commend you for continuing to try to reduce your participation in this horrible cycle of violence. I'm a person who believes that everything is "energy", that each person, animal and thing has its own vibrations which change with our emotions and which can influence otheres/the world, like the "ripple effect" that we so often hear about, so when I first heard that eating animals brings "bad karma" it gave me pause. However, it still took me many years to free myself from that, and I say it this way because it appears I was almost instantly freed from depression (and anxiety) that I'd suffer from for decades. No other dietary changes or supplements, which I took diligently for years, had the effect that I experienced. I also think that perhaps the hormones, antibiotics, etc. present in the products I consumed had something to do with it but because the effect was so immediate I do wonder.
Re: the veggie tacos, I thought I'd add how I usually make mine. For protein, sometimes I use fat-free refried beans to spread on the tortillas but other times I use r just mashed beans with a little seasoning on top or hummus. I shop at an Aldi frequently and they sell several flavors of hummus which makes things more interesting, I recently bought a large container that had 3 different flavors besides "classic". I chop lettuce, tomato, green pepper (or any color), onion and shred a piece of carrot, last time I shredded some zucchini, other times I'll add any other veggie I feel like using for variety. Ideally, I'll also chop some avocado but last time I didn't have any and they were still pretty good, however, for me the avocado makes them really delicious. A time or two I've used some of the Daiya cheese but, personally, I don't find it necessary in order to enjoy them. I usually top them with salsa but last time I felt adventurous and used sriracha. When I first decided to make veggie tacos back in Dec. of '15 I found them so delicious I couldn't believe I'd never seen a recipe in a magazine, it was the same thing when I first made lentil burgers (following a recipe that starts with raw soaked lentils), I actually felt like I'd "discovered" some gourmet eating due to the new flavors I was experiencing.
Despite my age I adapted so quickly to not eating meat, etc., that I was surprised but later I heard how our taste buds "wake up" feeling other flavors more intensely, and it's totally true for me. For example, I thought I could not ever like spaghetti without cheese but I learned to enjoy it sprinkled with nutritional yeast. I recently discovered vegan shredded "parmesan" in the vegan section of the Publix supermarket here and it is practically like the real thing but when I made spaghetti today I went back to the nutritional yeast "just because". At first I used the Gardein "ground" beef substitute but after I tried their meatballs I prefer those. I cook them in the sauce (store bought) and then cut them in several pieces so they'll soak up its flavor and because the texture is so identical to meat it feels like regular spaghetti to me. (Sorry to have gotten carried away!)
Regarding slaughterhouse workers, 2 things come to mind. There is a lot of turnover from what I've read and the good people who felt they had no choice but to work there suffer a form of PTSD. Then there's the psycopaths. There's quite a few of those working with animals, I've seen clips where for no good reason at all some men hurt and torture the poor helpless animals who can't run away, and that breaks my heart to such a degree I still occasionally feel the guilt about all the years I ate meat, eggs, etc. because that was supporting the existence of such violence. I've thought that it's no wonder there's so much other violence in this world: murders, rapes, assaults, wars and even "natural" disasters. They happen because we really reap what we sow. Most people dismiss animals' feelings because of viewing them as inferior, but violence is violence and it doesn't go unpunished. We also pay in our own bodies with all the diseases we get.
When you mentioned the cage-free eggs it reminded me of me naively buying them thinking of the chicken of my childhood who pecked on the ground and got a lot of exercise, then I learned it was a lie. Idk if you've seen the documentary "Vegucated" but it shows other lies about the treatment of so-called free range cattle, etc. Lots of people think they're not contributing to as much violence by buying such expensive meats but in many places it's not much different than the factory farmed meats.
Thanks for your reply, I enjoyed reading it! I sincerely commend you for continuing to try to reduce your participation in this horrible cycle of violence. I'm a person who believes that everything is "energy", that each person, animal and thing has its own vibrations which change with our emotions and which can influence otheres/the world, like the "ripple effect" that we so often hear about, so when I first heard that eating animals brings "bad karma" it gave me pause. However, it still took me many years to free myself from that, and I say it this way because it appears I was almost instantly freed from depression (and anxiety) that I'd suffer from for decades. No other dietary changes or supplements, which I took diligently for years, had the effect that I experienced. I also think that perhaps the hormones, antibiotics, etc. present in the products I consumed had something to do with it but because the effect was so immediate I do wonder.
Re: the veggie tacos, I thought I'd add how I usually make mine. For protein, sometimes I use fat-free refried beans to spread on the tortillas but other times I use r just mashed beans with a little seasoning on top or hummus. I shop at an Aldi frequently and they sell several flavors of hummus which makes things more interesting, I recently bought a large container that had 3 different flavors besides "classic". I chop lettuce, tomato, green pepper (or any color), onion and shred a piece of carrot, last time I shredded some zucchini, other times I'll add any other veggie I feel like using for variety. Ideally, I'll also chop some avocado but last time I didn't have any and they were still pretty good, however, for me the avocado makes them really delicious. A time or two I've used some of the Daiya cheese but, personally, I don't find it necessary in order to enjoy them. I usually top them with salsa but last time I felt adventurous and used sriracha. When I first decided to make veggie tacos back in Dec. of '15 I found them so delicious I couldn't believe I'd never seen a recipe in a magazine, it was the same thing when I first made lentil burgers (following a recipe that starts with raw soaked lentils), I actually felt like I'd "discovered" some gourmet eating due to the new flavors I was experiencing.
Despite my age I adapted so quickly to not eating meat, etc., that I was surprised but later I heard how our taste buds "wake up" feeling other flavors more intensely, and it's totally true for me. For example, I thought I could not ever like spaghetti without cheese but I learned to enjoy it sprinkled with nutritional yeast. I recently discovered vegan shredded "parmesan" in the vegan section of the Publix supermarket here and it is practically like the real thing but when I made spaghetti today I went back to the nutritional yeast "just because". At first I used the Gardein "ground" beef substitute but after I tried their meatballs I prefer those. I cook them in the sauce (store bought) and then cut them in several pieces so they'll soak up its flavor and because the texture is so identical to meat it feels like regular spaghetti to me. (Sorry to have gotten carried away!)
Regarding slaughterhouse workers, 2 things come to mind. There is a lot of turnover from what I've read and the good people who felt they had no choice but to work there suffer a form of PTSD. Then there's the psycopaths. There's quite a few of those working with animals, I've seen clips where for no good reason at all some men hurt and torture the poor helpless animals who can't run away, and that breaks my heart to such a degree I still occasionally feel the guilt about all the years I ate meat, eggs, etc. because that was supporting the existence of such violence. I've thought that it's no wonder there's so much other violence in this world: murders, rapes, assaults, wars and even "natural" disasters. They happen because we really reap what we sow. Most people dismiss animals' feelings because of viewing them as inferior, but violence is violence and it doesn't go unpunished. We also pay in our own bodies with all the diseases we get.
When you mentioned the cage-free eggs it reminded me of me naively buying them thinking of the chicken of my childhood who pecked on the ground and got a lot of exercise, then I learned it was a lie. Idk if you've seen the documentary "Vegucated" but it shows other lies about the treatment of so-called free range cattle, etc. Lots of people think they're not contributing to as much violence by buying such expensive meats but in many places it's not much different than the factory farmed meats.
Agreed, the reason I started vegan eating was because for every meatless dinner, an animal somewhere was spared. I used to belong to a vegetarian/vegan group and once a month, we'd meet at a local restaurant. People's reasons were varied as to why they didn't eat meat and over dinner, I was surprised when several people said they weren't concerned about the animals, they were avoiding meat strictly for health reasons. Others avoided meat for a combination of ethics and health. You sound like a Buddhist, or a very enlightened person. I do believe in karma and had many good things happen in my life when I did dog rescue.
The flavors in food do change! I remember thinking how much deeper and more complex food tasted after I'd been eating vegan for a couple of weeks. Seasoning becomes noticed along with even simple things like beans and rice. Those veggie tacos sound so good and full of health, they will be enjoyed next week. The spaghetti sounds yummy as well. I'm going to look into making a batch. Don't worry about getting carried away, that's what good cooking is all about!
PSTD makes a lot of sense. The process is violent and bloody and enough to make any sane person crazy, having to deal with that for a 40 hour work week. I've seen some undercover footage, and remember reading where a worker stabbed a pig, then put salt in his wounds to hear him scream. Apparently there is not much supervision and I bet their foreman couldn't care less, even if they were caught. This industry dosen't seem to be regulated with much oversight. Very sad for the animals. When we moved to Washington from Arizona, we drove through northern CA. There is a cattle feed lot there, clearly visible from the interstate that goes on and on and on. It's really awful see all these cattle in pens, waiting.
The only true free range chickens out there, are the ones raised by backyard keepers who let them roam. On the chicken blogs, many keepers are devoted to their flocks and have named them all. The CDC sent out a warning recently, saying that due to some outbreaks of salmonella, chicken keepers shouldn't handle or kiss their chickens. Lots of outrage over that!
Agreed, the reason I started vegan eating was because for every meatless dinner, an animal somewhere was spared. I used to belong to a vegetarian/vegan group and once a month, we'd meet at a local restaurant. People's reasons were varied as to why they didn't eat meat and over dinner, I was surprised when several people said they weren't concerned about the animals, they were avoiding meat strictly for health reasons. Others avoided meat for a combination of ethics and health. You sound like a Buddhist, or a very enlightened person. I do believe in karma and had many good things happen in my life when I did dog rescue.
The flavors in food do change! I remember thinking how much deeper and more complex food tasted after I'd been eating vegan for a couple of weeks. Seasoning becomes noticed along with even simple things like beans and rice. Those veggie tacos sound so good and full of health, they will be enjoyed next week. The spaghetti sounds yummy as well. I'm going to look into making a batch. Don't worry about getting carried away, that's what good cooking is all about!
PSTD makes a lot of sense. The process is violent and bloody and enough to make any sane person crazy, having to deal with that for a 40 hour work week. I've seen some undercover footage, and remember reading where a worker stabbed a pig, then put salt in his wounds to hear him scream. Apparently there is not much supervision and I bet their foreman couldn't care less, even if they were caught. This industry dosen't seem to be regulated with much oversight. Very sad for the animals. When we moved to Washington from Arizona, we drove through northern CA. There is a cattle feed lot there, clearly visible from the interstate that goes on and on and on. It's really awful see all these cattle in pens, waiting.
The only true free range chickens out there, are the ones raised by backyard keepers who let them roam. On the chicken blogs, many keepers are devoted to their flocks and have named them all. The CDC sent out a warning recently, saying that due to some outbreaks of salmonella, chicken keepers shouldn't handle or kiss their chickens. Lots of outrage over that!
A lot of the people who go plant-based for health reasons stand the chance of dropping out of the diet at some point or another. I had to have a double motivation to really get to the point of doing it but it's the animals that have kept me from temptation. I am not a Buddhist, but I guess I've read about it and other spiritual beliefs even though I still consider myself to be a Christian, those beliefs began transforming quite a few years ago and for years I have not attended church. The Bible says that we reap what we sow, which is essentially what "karma" says too and it's easier to use a word that most people are familiar with.
I have a sister who's been dedicated to doing mainly dog and horse rescue, she still lives in our country of origin where there's still people using horses to pull wagons but they treat them very bad. She and her group of activists succeeded in getting laws not only passed for the protection of animals but also enforced so the view of animals there is slowly changing. However, at least a couple of years before I myself became a "vegan" I began telling her that if she loved animals so much she should not eat any of them.
She began cutting out most meats but still ate chicken and fish sometimes. Then when I cut them all out I began sharing some info about it and recipes and although I don't know for a fact that she completely stopped I know that she is now aware that she has more healthy alternatives that she didn't know about before (just like it happened to me).
Today I heard a vegan Mexican radio & TV celebrity talking about the factory farm and slaughterhouse workers sometimes actually venting their frustration on the animals, on one hand it makes no sense but perhaps they resent the existence of the animals in relation to them being in the position to have to earn a living that way. The human mind is very complicated, so go figure. I cannot stand to see the poor pigs in those narrow pens, it breaks my heart and my impotence makes me feel angry. I also feel a lot of guilt over the times when I ate pork chops, sausage and bacon even though for about 18 years before I quit it had been very few times. But there's all the beef, chicken, and fish, etc., that made me feel that I very much deserve all the health problems I'd developed over the years so I no longer complain.
One thing I did in the beginning was to buy several jars of oriental sauces or pastes like red and green curry paste, Indian jalfrezzi (a bit too hot for me), white & red miso paste, etc. and experimented with them. Yesterday I didn't feel like fussing a lot at lunch so I opened a can of coconut milk and poured about half of it in a skillet and made a sauce by adding about 1 tbsp. of green curry paste, a few dashes of soy sauce, 2 shredded garlic cloves, and 3 sliced green onions, then I finely chopped broccoli to make about 2 cups added it to the skillet along with some small cubes of baked marinated tofu, water (maybe abotut 1 1/2 C.) and extra salt, then put half of a 14 oz. bag of rice "vermicceli" (the one I use should really be called spaghetti because it's thicker than regular vermicceli) in the skillet separating them as much as possible, covered it and let it simmer a few min., then turned the heat off and let it absorb the liquid for about 10-12 min., checking and stirring once (I had to add some more water) and I had a very satisfying and easy meal with enough left for another meal, and only one pan to wash!
Another thing I did a lot but not so much lately, was to fix rice and bean Spanish style dishes called "Moro" or "Moros & Cristianos" , the beans have to be pre-cooked (canned are fine) but the white rice is used raw. I loved the leftovers because it made things so much easier on my lazy days. Yesterday I also cooked a batch of black beans and saved some in the freezer to use that way. I also like to use the Gardein "beef" grounds to make what we call "Picadillo" or chili w/beans, and I also used them for spaghetti but lately prefer the Gardein meatballs. For years I used to buy dried soy "chunks" form an Indian grocery store but I only used them to make a quick noodle & veggie soup, but since I had 2 bags when I became a vegan and they last "forever" I've experimented using them as I would beef, the only thing is that the chunks have a strong soy flavor so I learned to first soak them in water with spices which gets discarded. Last time I cooked them I did it in a Spanish style tomato-based sauce with cilantro, garlic, onions, green peppers, oregano & salt. I then added frozen mixed veggies and it was pretty good, and of course I had enough for about 4 meals. I really very rarely make anything that's not at least enough for 2 meals, I figure that if I'm going to go through all the trouble I might as well make it worth my while, lol!
A lot of the people who go plant-based for health reasons stand the chance of dropping out of the diet at some point or another. I had to have a double motivation to really get to the point of doing it but it's the animals that have kept me from temptation. I am not a Buddhist, but I guess I've read about it and other spiritual beliefs even though I still consider myself to be a Christian, those beliefs began transforming quite a few years ago and for years I have not attended church. The Bible says that we reap what we sow, which is essentially what "karma" says too and it's easier to use a word that most people are familiar with.
I have a sister who's been dedicated to doing mainly dog and horse rescue, she still lives in our country of origin where there's still people using horses to pull wagons but they treat them very bad. She and her group of activists succeeded in getting laws not only passed for the protection of animals but also enforced so the view of animals there is slowly changing. However, at least a couple of years before I myself became a "vegan" I began telling her that if she loved animals so much she should not eat any of them.
She began cutting out most meats but still ate chicken and fish sometimes. Then when I cut them all out I began sharing some info about it and recipes and although I don't know for a fact that she completely stopped I know that she is now aware that she has more healthy alternatives that she didn't know about before (just like it happened to me).
Today I heard a vegan Mexican radio & TV celebrity talking about the factory farm and slaughterhouse workers sometimes actually venting their frustration on the animals, on one hand it makes no sense but perhaps they resent the existence of the animals in relation to them being in the position to have to earn a living that way. The human mind is very complicated, so go figure. I cannot stand to see the poor pigs in those narrow pens, it breaks my heart and my impotence makes me feel angry. I also feel a lot of guilt over the times when I ate pork chops, sausage and bacon even though for about 18 years before I quit it had been very few times. But there's all the beef, chicken, and fish, etc., that made me feel that I very much deserve all the health problems I'd developed over the years so I no longer complain.
One thing I did in the beginning was to buy several jars of oriental sauces or pastes like red and green curry paste, Indian jalfrezzi (a bit too hot for me), white & red miso paste, etc. and experimented with them. Yesterday I didn't feel like fussing a lot at lunch so I opened a can of coconut milk and poured about half of it in a skillet and made a sauce by adding about 1 tbsp. of green curry paste, a few dashes of soy sauce, 2 shredded garlic cloves, and 3 sliced green onions, then I finely chopped broccoli to make about 2 cups added it to the skillet along with some small cubes of baked marinated tofu, water (maybe abotut 1 1/2 C.) and extra salt, then put half of a 14 oz. bag of rice "vermicceli" (the one I use should really be called spaghetti because it's thicker than regular vermicceli) in the skillet separating them as much as possible, covered it and let it simmer a few min., then turned the heat off and let it absorb the liquid for about 10-12 min., checking and stirring once (I had to add some more water) and I had a very satisfying and easy meal with enough left for another meal, and only one pan to wash!
Another thing I did a lot but not so much lately, was to fix rice and bean Spanish style dishes called "Moro" or "Moros & Cristianos" , the beans have to be pre-cooked (canned are fine) but the white rice is used raw. I loved the leftovers because it made things so much easier on my lazy days. Yesterday I also cooked a batch of black beans and saved some in the freezer to use that way. I also like to use the Gardein "beef" grounds to make what we call "Picadillo" or chili w/beans, and I also used them for spaghetti but lately prefer the Gardein meatballs. For years I used to buy dried soy "chunks" form an Indian grocery store but I only used them to make a quick noodle & veggie soup, but since I had 2 bags when I became a vegan and they last "forever" I've experimented using them as I would beef, the only thing is that the chunks have a strong soy flavor so I learned to first soak them in water with spices which gets discarded. Last time I cooked them I did it in a Spanish style tomato-based sauce with cilantro, garlic, onions, green peppers, oregano & salt. I then added frozen mixed veggies and it was pretty good, and of course I had enough for about 4 meals. I really very rarely make anything that's not at least enough for 2 meals, I figure that if I'm going to go through all the trouble I might as well make it worth my while, lol!
I agree with you about karma. It always catches up with people, regardless if they believe in it or not. When you mentioned your sister, I thought of countries like Romania where they have an abysmal track record for abusing animals. Kudos to your sister, if it wasn't for activism in some countries, the animals wouldn't stand a chance.
Guess what we had for dinner tonight. Those vegan tacos were delicious and even got a high rating from DH. He usually likes meat with his meals, but he was very satisfied with dinner. The veggies were so good with some Mexican seasonings. I wouldn't mind trying vegan again. That curry you made for lunch sounds very flavorful and healthy! I also heard from my vegan friend this week and she sent a great utube link to a talk by Dr Klaper. I love this guy! He is entertaining while getting the message across. I hadn't heard of him before, but he is good and I liked what he had to say.
Yes, maybe it's time to try vegan eating again. You shouldn't feel guilty, after all you've walked the walk for a long time. It is just so hard to try to fight big animal abusing industries, the general public dosen't care and with friends who feel the same way, it's preaching to the choir. Anyway, one day, it's a guaranteed thing that karma will come looking for them. Funny how the universe works.
That Spanish dish sounds good. I'm going to look for Gardein meatballs. This week, due to road work, we had to buy groceries at Walmart, so I didn't have the chance to get vegan cheese. I think Fred Meyer sells it and the meatballs as well. Wish there was an Indian grocery store nearby, but haven't seen one yet. That's a good thing about vegan meals, with the right seasoning you never miss not having meat. Flavor is everything. I remember some tasteless vegan meals years ago. Glad the emphasis is on flavor these days.
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