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View Poll Results: Is raced discussed in The Americas 24/7
Yes, Latin Americas think about race all the time 1 33.33%
No, this board has been invaded by race extremists. 2 66.67%
Voters: 3. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 01-09-2014, 10:45 PM
 
Location: Hollywood, CA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Perfect Stranger View Post
Your premise is faulty. You're assuming all 16 great-great-parents were born in Latin America, where in certain cases that's not true of a single one of them.

I can't guarantee that someone like say Thiago Splitter has no black or Indian blood at all, but it seems unlikely:

You'd never know. This Brazilian Model has confirmed African ancestry. But looks "White". It would be silly to call this man "Mixed Race"


 
Old 01-09-2014, 10:53 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hipcat View Post
You'd never know. This Brazilian Model has confirmed African ancestry. But looks "White". It would be silly to call this man "Mixed Race"

The USA has tons of people like this. More than 1/3 of WHITE U.S. Americans have detectable confirmed black African ancestry.

Multiracial WHITENESS is nothing new. The White race has NEVER been pure.

Look up groups like Melungeons, Redbones, Jackson Whites, Brass Ankles, Appalachians etc and many more and others.

Whiteness has never been about racial purity.
 
Old 01-09-2014, 10:54 PM
 
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Essays on the U.S. Color Line Blog Archive Myths Across the Color Line
 
Old 01-10-2014, 12:48 PM
 
Location: Vineland, NJ
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A big reason why Latin America is so racially mixed is because Spanish and Portuguese colonists put a lot more emphasis on institutionalized racism rather than racism involving sexually relations. Basically the Spanish and Portuguese were not as concerned about keeping the race pure as oppose to the English colonies.
 
Old 01-10-2014, 01:11 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gwillyfromphilly View Post
A big reason why Latin America is so racially mixed is because Spanish and Portuguese colonists put a lot more emphasis on institutionalized racism rather than racism involving sexually relations. Basically the Spanish and Portuguese were not as concerned about keeping the race pure as oppose to the English colonies.
The English colonies were not concerned with keeping the race pure either. In addition each colony had it's own unique experiences so it's not homogenous. One size fits all myopic view narrative will not work. Try again.

British colonies have just as much race mixing. USA especially had heavy race mixing which still continues to this day.
 
Old 01-10-2014, 01:13 PM
 
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I don't know why people act like the USA is not very racially mixed. Ppl really need to get a mother****ing clue.
 
Old 01-10-2014, 03:31 PM
 
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The biggest reason why Latin America is not as racially mixed is because most Latin American colonies were not settler colonies. Most Europeans who came to Latin America did not arrive with the intention of settling and so did not bring women. As a result, most sexual relations occured between White males and women of Colour. Present-day White Latinos are generally the descendants of immigrants who came in the 19th and 20th centuries, not the descendants of the original colonisers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MelismaticEchoes View Post
I don't know why people act like the USA is not very racially mixed. Ppl really need to get a mother****ing clue.
The USA ISN'T very racially mixed, not by a long shot. Most White Americans have very little admixture from other races, and while the two largest minorities (Hispanics and non-hispanic Blacks) do tend to be more racially mixed, together they make up less than 30% of the population.
 
Old 01-10-2014, 05:22 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lexdiamondz1902 View Post
The biggest reason why Latin America is not as racially mixed is because most Latin American colonies were not settler colonies. Most Europeans who came to Latin America did not arrive with the intention of settling and so did not bring women. As a result, most sexual relations occured between White males and women of Colour. Present-day White Latinos are generally the descendants of immigrants who came in the 19th and 20th centuries, not the descendants of the original colonisers.



The USA ISN'T very racially mixed, not by a long shot. Most White Americans have very little admixture from other races, and while the two largest minorities (Hispanics and non-hispanic Blacks) do tend to be more racially mixed, together they make up less than 30% of the population.
Your premise is faulty. You're looking at things in a very one sided narrow minded myopic tunnel vision view which over looks mutual, intra and interconnected and complex and diverse nuances of culture, history and transmission of ideas and race and time periods and trends and how they vary and the ways in which they can overlap and/or be the same or rather remarkably similar. You also overlook that the region or areas that comprise what is called so called "Latin America" (including Brazil and Haiti) consists of many various nations, which all have different histories and different cultures and even within each nation, it is not a monolith or homogenous and there are many differences within one nation alone even especially when it comes to history and culture.

You have to consider that race in and of itself is a social construct and can also be cultural perceptions that vary over time. Many whites that settled in Spanish, Portuguese, and French colonies could have been of any race or had racial "admixtures" depending on what race one deems what.

Many whites did settle Latin American colonies and there were many that mixed as well but there were many that remained pure as well too. In fact many had extramarital affairs or relations. So in many examples you had Europeans that had an illegitimate mixed race child, and on the other hand a pure white child, and also the possibility of having other pure white children.

There were many pure whites that existed and maintained purity since the very earliest of colonial times.

So therefore there are many WHITES descended from the original white colonizers and white settlers of various classes and walks of life. Much of the elites of Latin American nations are descended from such.

This same exact thing did in fact happen in the USA and there was lots of mixing in the colonial USA, pre independence, and post independence. Mixing was and still is the norm in the USA. Also keep in mind that well over more than 3/4 of what is now the USA, was under Spanish, French, and/or Dutch colonial tutelage well into the 1800s so that is something thar you have to consider.

The 13 original colonies region were even French, Spanish, and Dutch colonies well over a century or two before the British settled and thoroughly began to further colonize it more.

Many of the first Africans to come to the US where freemen, not slaves, and there where no miscegenation laws so many mixed with European descent people and people of other racial and ethnic origins. So there was lots of mixing.

For much of USA history there were NO miscegenation laws, especially during the colonial and *antebellum and even postbellum period and areas and so people mixed freely with each other. Many of the Africans that came to the USA were NEVER slaves or enslaved and came to the USA free or as indentured servants but mostly free. Africans that had been baptized before or upon arrival to the New world would be FREE as well as their descendants. Many Irish were brought in as indentured servants and as slaves and so there were many cases of Irish women marrying and/or having children with African men. There are many that are descendants of such. Colonial Virginia is historically known for having lots of mixing. The colonial Southern united states resembles a microcosm of Latin America with interconnected and mutually shared culture. South Carolina had a lot of free and mixed blacks and people of color. Everywhere had mixing.*

In areas like Texas, Louisiana, Alabama, Mississippi, Florida etc, there was lots of mixing. These regions were hybrid Spanish and French colonies since the 1500s.

In the USA, there were many black women that married and/or had children with WHITE men and also of white women having children with BLACK men.*

And much of the racial mixing was/is consensual.

And in cases when any raping occurred or has occurred it has happened and gone in both directions and combos and angles as and in regards to race and racial groups and race/racial mixing.


Most whites were not slave owners. In fact, many slave owners were biracial/multiracial. A slave owner often had more black ancestry than their slave often.

A mixed person that had white appearance was considered white. Race was based on appearance. So there were many mixed people embraced and accepted as WHITE by the white community and openly known to have black and other ancestries in them.

In addition many triracial isolates groups existed such as the Melungeons, Redbones, Lumbees, Brass Ankles, Jackson Whites etc. All of these groups lived as white or as mixed race and isolated often. Many famous people and elites are descended from these peoples and others. The Kennedys are descended from or admixed with Melungeons.

Heather Locklear is of Lumbee descent.

Johnny Depp has notable black African and Native American ancestry.

The USA is in fact very racially mixed. What do you define as mixed? What is your perception of such? Is there a percentage cut off or certain proportion one must have to be considered mixed?

Also identity and determining what group is more mixed than who or what can be moot in point or intentions because it all comes down to how the person identified in relation to determining how mixed one is in relation to others. Lol.

At the end of the day, most U.S. Americans can't claim to be pure anything.

Slavery in the USA was also color blind and based on partus sequitur ventrem.

The colonial set up and patterning of the 13 original colonies and the USA was modeled after Roman and Latin laws and even Greek/Grecian laws and and doctrine and input and the set up and methods of British often challenged or went against their own traditional ideas mostly or often eventually modeled their colonies after the Spanish, French, and Portuguese, and the Arabs as well as the racial terms and enslavement methods etc and many colonial powers worked in collusion with each other even when and while competing with and/or against each other. Arabs are the real culprits as they began slave trading of Africans since ancient times and this is what led to the Europeans taking part, although all groups of people were involved in slavery and slave trading. Arabs had mostly black slaves and mixed slaves but there were also white slaves too and the racist and colorist distinctions of white and black and light vs dark and good vs bad/evil etc.*

And btw, more than 1/3 of WHITE U.S. Americans have detectable notable genetic black African ancestry, and that doesn't even include the Native American ancestry and other races that many WHITE identified people are (ad)mixed with.

The whole "two largest minorities" sociopolitical semantics is tricky and complex at best. Hispanic is NOT a race. Hispanics can be of any race or race admixtures.*

NOT ALL black people in the USA are descendants of or are members of the ETHNIC GROUPING of people that our society currently refers to as and by the (misnomered) term of African American (AA). Many blacks and people of African descent from Africa, Latin America, Caribbean, Europe, Middle East, Asia, and elsewhere have migrated to the USA, and been falsely labelled as or categorized as African American or as part of that fold. These people are NOT African American.

In addition AA and black do NOT mean the same thing.

AAs are an ETHNIC group comprised of mostly multiracially mixed race peoples. AAs can be of any race. Black is more so a sociopolitical term that corresponds to an ethnic like usage in it's semantics. A person is either a member of an ethnicity/ethnic group or NOT. So therefore, one's ethnicity can not be diluted or broken down into fractions. A person never loses membership from an/their ethnic group or ethnicity. You can belong to more than one ethnicity or ethnic group. A person's race or racial admixtures can be broken down into factions or or degrees. So technically most AAs are NOT racially black people. They are all mostly mixed race. Some AAs are racially black, but they make up a minority of the AA ethnic community. And in some cases AAs are and can be white. In fact about 5% of AAs have been found to have absolutely little or NO African ancestry at all. That's because being AA is about a shared experience, having gone through surviving chattel slavery, and surviving Jim Crow and later on the imposition of racist segrationist one droppism and of course the positive uplifting and unifying Civil Rights movement, and thus a unique AA experience.

Again, varies by region, time period, etc. for example, only 100 years ago, in Ohio, Obama would have been seen as White man. They even put it in their code of law. That is what happened in Puerto Rico as well where more than half the population identifies as White even though the African ancestry in many is obvious. Again. experiences vary by region and blanket statements tend to be innacurate as they hold up in some cases and not in others.

The one drop rule was only legally enforced between 1931 and 1967 in some southern states and that was it and even then each court and jurisdiction varied on blood quantrums and how strict it was enforced and depending on the judge.

One group’s perception of what is “White”, “Black”, “Asian”, “Mixed” whatever might not be anothers. In one culture you might be seen as Black, in another you wouldn’t. The Masses vary by region
Ultimately, the dichotomy of Black and White introduced in Jim Crow (believe it or not, one droppism and what not was not a part of slavery) has caused a lot of these antagonisms. Forcing people to pick sides.

Yep, no reading comprehension. I told you you had a choice, but that African American choice was influenced by what its cultural parameters for Black are. Jim Crow created a much larger community that identifies as Black as it fused in mixed groups as well. So your choice is still affected by what you see growing up. And again, it is not just you the individual, it is about general trends.

And based on studies etc and some of what you mentioned it's fair to say that more than 60% of people living in the USA has black African ancestry in varying degrees. And that doesn't even account for the Native American ancestry that many have and other racial ancestries one has.*

You should read this book which goes in depth on the legal history of the color line:

Legal History of the Color Line: The Rise and Triumph of the One-Drop Rule:Amazon:Books

Read this link which debunks many urban myths and urban legends in regards to race and history etc.

Essays on the U.S. Color Line Blog Archive Myths Across the Color Line

Last edited by MelismaticEchoes; 01-10-2014 at 05:42 PM..
 
Old 01-10-2014, 05:36 PM
 
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Partus Sequitur Ventrem

Partus sequitur ventrem - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
Old 01-10-2014, 05:39 PM
 
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C9A. How Courts Decided if You Were a Slave - YouTube
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