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View Poll Results: Is raced discussed in The Americas 24/7
Yes, Latin Americas think about race all the time 1 33.33%
No, this board has been invaded by race extremists. 2 66.67%
Voters: 3. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 01-16-2014, 11:08 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lexdiamondz1902 View Post
The biggest reason why Latin America is not as racially mixed is because most Latin American colonies were not settler colonies. Most Europeans who came to Latin America did not arrive with the intention of settling and so did not bring women. As a result, most sexual relations occured between White males and women of Colour. Present-day White Latinos are generally the descendants of immigrants who came in the 19th and 20th centuries, not the descendants of the original colonisers.



The USA ISN'T very racially mixed, not by a long shot. Most White Americans have very little admixture from other races, and while the two largest minorities (Hispanics and non-hispanic Blacks) do tend to be more racially mixed, together they make up less than 30% of the population.
-The U.S. Chattel-Slavery SYSTEM was 'Mother-Based' (Matrilineal) --NOT 'Color-Based' (RACIAL),*

-Many WHITE people WERE Chattel-SLAVES in the U.S.*

-MOST Chattel-SLAVES in the U.S. WERE NOT BLACK (most were Mulatto or Metis and many were even White)*

-The U.S. received LESS THAN 6% of the West Africans captured*

-The 'Willie Lynch Speech / Letter' is a total HOAX*

-The Color-Based 'Slave-Hierarchy and Color-Based 'Features-Tests' are MYTHS

 
Old 01-17-2014, 01:10 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by french user View Post
Yes, but not necessary more open on the cultural mixing or diversity. Here in France we have xenophobia, but usually based on cultural aspects (sometimes associated with a noticeable "different from average" looks, so it can gives birth to racism). Above this I tend to think that the difference is what is considered to be the element that defines the identity of one person: In Germanic cultures this is more the idea of genetic heritage, while in latin cultures it is more the culture. I tend to think that the germanic cultures make the focus more upon the individuals, while the latin ones focus more on the group. The "collective" thing is the culture, and especially the language (the ciment of the nations); while the individual identity is his family history (so something linked to genetic heritage).



.

I have met several Francophone African professionals who have reported that upward mobility for them (despite having to learn English) is easier in the USA than in France. The USA prides itself on its immigrant roots, and immigrants are not forced to complete dump their identity, or culture. That is provided that they learn English and the basic rules of how to succeed in the USA. As such it is probably easier for your average American to imagine an immigrant in an upwardly mobile position, even if he still retains strong evidence of his culture and identity.

We have Barack Obama who was elected president TWICE. Father a foreigner, and his name being unusual for the USA. He got more votes from whites than did every Democratic presidential candidate since Jimmy Carter, and that includes Bill Clinton.

I just cant imagine a French Arab being president of France, or a Pakistani being the PM of the UK.

Despite all the US bashing that occurs on this site about its "obsession" with race one, will see more blacks in the upper middle class than is typical in most white dominated societies, and that includes Brazil. Indeed in 2010 1/3 of black households in the USA earn higher incomes than does the average white household.

It might shock some to know that we immigrants in the USA LIKE being allowed to be who we are, but yet having the ability to be upwardly mobile. This is true to a lesser degree in the UK. From what I have been told in France this is clearly NOT true. This is why African professionals migrate to the USA and the UK. The Africans in continental Europe being mainly unskilled.

So in the 21st century the Anglo Saxon nations seem to be more accepting of diversity, and less demanding that ethnic minorities transform themselves into being indistinguishable for the dominant culture. It may well be that the Anglo Saxons don't mix, and therefore don't demand that others do so, so aren't forced to dramatically transform their merely because their work colleague enjoys different food, or music, or has a different style. To each his own, and every one goes home to their own worlds.

Last edited by caribny; 01-17-2014 at 02:13 AM..
 
Old 01-17-2014, 01:13 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MalaMan View Post
I have already noticed that "Islamophobia" is much more widespread in France than racism. Black Christian immigrants from the Caribbean and from the former African colonies face less discrimination than Islamic immigrants from Algeria, .

There is less public discussion about them but France was all abuzz some years ago when the first black female newscaster appeared. In a nation with millions of blacks.
 
Old 01-17-2014, 01:23 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AntonioR View Post
This is the only place where I have seen the Spanish and the Portuguese labelled as the most racist when the opposite was true. Maybe it has to do with the large amount of Americans here, since the USA was born from mostly British colonies.

.

Yet blacks have achieved much more socio economic success in these Anglo dominated societies. The fact that a culture is more likely to engage in sexual intercourse with another doesn't make it less racist. Indeed one would expect that Mediterranean people would be less paranoid of difference, given that historically they have had massive exposure to cultures which were very different. The average Englishmen (living in the UK) only became exposed to people who looked different after WWII, when significant Caribbean migration to the UK began.

I can watch TV in the USA and see black experts discussing all sorts of issues. Politics, the financial markets, etc. I wonder if Globo TV is as diverse as say MSNBC, especially when we consider that it has a much larger % of the population have VISIBLE African ancestry.

That's why some one in Brazil wanted to start a black TV station.
 
Old 01-17-2014, 01:40 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AntonioR View Post
For

There were few women in most British colonies such as JAMAICA or INDIA, but do you see a mixed majority population over there?

Given that slaves accounted for 90% of the population in Jamaica during its peak those Englishmen would have had to be very busy. Having said that I am sure that a large % of Jamaica isn't 100% African.

To talk about India is even more ridiculous given that there was always a huge population there.

Indeed its always good to do research before one talks. In the British Caribbean colonies, a three tier system developed, as indeed it did in North America before Jim Crow. There were whites, mulattos and blacks.

In the Caribbean the mulatto offspring were usually freed and allowed an education, and indeed in Jamaica by the late 18th century this group began to dominate the professions, and when slavery ended, they became powerful land owners.


Mulattos in Jamaica have been MORE educated than whites for at least 200 years now!


Indeed one thing that shocks many people is in the English speaking Caribbean black and mixed people usually assume that the local whites will perform at a lower standard educationally, because it is thought that they do not value education!


Even in the USA the mulatto offspring of whites enjoyed privileges. There was a fairly large free population, most of whom were mulattos, who were recognized as a separate category until Jim Crow. Indeed there is still a legacy of this among black Americans where the elites are disproportionately light skinned.

Indeed one can argue that mulattos in the non Hispanic Caribbean, and light skinned blacks from old families are BETTER off than are the mulatos in Latin America. They are seen as a PRIVILEGED group.

I see no evidence that mulatos in Latin America have any privileges other than they are more mixed, and so more favorably viewed.
 
Old 01-17-2014, 01:46 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AntonioR View Post
LOL


They weren’t as racist as the British.


Oh, I see. You should publish a new history book, because your “vision” of what happened doesn’t lives up to what has been written. Considering all the books I’ve read about this topic so far, I should have bumped into this by now. Hmm, wonder why I haven’t…

It would be a tremendous loss to humanity for your incredible knowledge of things that no other expert has discovered. It would be a tremendous loss.


Hmm, I wonder why the native americans of the US haven’t recuperated to more than 1% of the population. Since the USA was so less racist than much of Latin America, it only makes sense that there would be more native americans in the US than in any Latin American country.

Why is that not the case? Explain.


Right. That explains why the indigenous population has been so numerous in Mexico and Peru, the centers of the Aztec and Inca civilizations, respectively. To this day, almost half of Peru is of Inca origin with most of the rest being mestizos of Inca extraction. I guess since the British were much nicer to the native americans, that explains why they hardly exist at just 1% of the US population.

It all makes perfect sense.





Let me guess, you’re going by what you saw in the Miami-based Univision channel or the Los Angeles-based Telemundo? Both are owned by American companies, LOL.

Here, let me show you a few examples of actual Latin American media:

News:


Felix Victorino is interviewed due to his extreme popularity and for being one of the most highly respected news anchors in the Dominican Republic.


Cuba

Movies:







Serious shows focused on social/economic/political issues:









It goes on and on and on… but since you haven’t been to Latin America, it makes sense you don’t know this. J


This is a perfect example that you have an agenda.

I already gave you examples!

Ulises Heureaux, he was 100% of black African extraction. The guy was so dark, he was almost blue!

Evo Morales is 100% of Amerindian descent.

If you were not so busy trying to push your racial agenda, you would had noticed that!

Now, much more interesting is why did the USA had to wait until 2008 to vote its first non-white president into office. The guy is still 50% white and his black heritage is not even connected to the slaves, but rather an immigrant from Kenya! The slaves weren’t even from that part of Africa! Lets talk about this.


Brazil’s case was peculiar when it came to abolishing slavery. Its often used by those with a racial agenda. I always find it interesting how people like you ‘forget’ to mention that the only Latin American places that abolished slavery after the USA was Puerto Rico (1873) and Brazil (1888). Every other place abolished slavery many years before the USA, starting with Argentina in 1813, a full half century before the US! By the 1830s all but four Latin Americans had abolished slavery (a good third of a century before the US).

Much more remarkably, after slavery was ended, not one Latin American country imposed segregation. Interestingly, the USA had the need for segregation and subjected your people for another 97 years after “abolishing” slavery. African Americans were, in effect, still slaves despite being free. You were the ones subjected to the longest slavery of any Western Hemisphere country!

No other Afro-descended people suffer what your people have suffered under the most racist of colonialists and their descendants, the British!

157 years of British colonial slavery, 89 years of American slavery, and 97 years of segregation; a total of 343 years!


I can talk about race relations in Latin America because I studied its history, I’ve experience it in person, and I’ve discussed this with experts and everyday people. This is why its obvious to me that you have an agenda. Its ok, you’re a victim of the most racist colonial power ever to exist, the British!


That’s what I think too. Lol


It is talked about, that’s what you don’t get! And how can you get it, when you don’t know what you’re talking about!


Yes I have, but apparently you haven’t and it shows. I’ve been to Mexico, Panama, Puerto Rico, Venezuela, Brazil, Peru, and last November I was in Dominican Republic. I even posted some pictures of my trip to the Dominican Republic here in the forums. All of my trips have been from between 3 weeks to just over a month. I have also dated many Latino women and have wonderful friends from many countries south of the border, have been accepted by wonderful Latino families and have had more than my fair share of opportunity to discuss and study this issue; of all races and mixtures.

The problem here is that you are talking about something you know little about, and based on that limited knowledge, you’re trying to impose some sort of racial agenda and it shows.

Travel to the region. Once you start doing that, your views will definitely change and we can continue with this debate. I can’t continue to debate this with someone that hasn’t even been to a single country in Latin America and yet, wants to be an expert on its matters. LOL

I see that you are using the Dominican Republic, a nation where upwards of 85% of the population are mixed or black as evidence that blacks are in the media in Latin America. The notion that the DR wouldn't have blacks in its media would be as impossible as if that were true of Trinidad and Guyana, which are only 50% black and Afrodescended mixed by the way.

Please note that the USA is 13% black, inclusive of people who will be considered mixed in Latin America.

Please explain why in Brazil a black man is forced to start his own TV station because ehe claims that blacjs
 
Old 01-17-2014, 01:56 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buahh View Post
Why was racial segregation in the US South so extreme during the Jim Crow era? Like blacks not allowed to marry whites, many black men hanged for being with white women. Other nations with a colonial past, presumably also pretty racist, never took things that far.

-----

The South was a defeated nation and they took refuge in racism and religion, but they were not like that before. That's why many very old families have their pinch of Comanche or black, and then you have the Melungeons, etc.
I wonder why Latin Americans like to justify the fact that its OK that blacks in that region are at the bottom of the ladder by citing Jim Crow.

Guess what blacks in the South organized to fight against it, assisted by many whites and Jim Crow has been over now for 50 years.

Also there hasn't been legally sanctioned racism in places like New York as least as long has been true for Latin America.


Basically BOTH the Anglo Saxon North America and the Iberian Latin America have a history of racism. Arguing about who is less racist in 2014 seem quite stupid, especially when a quick trip to Rio will show that blacks/dark mulattos there are much worse off than they are in New York City.

And from what I have seen if I were a dark skinned black person I would much rather be in the USA. At least I would be ALLOWED to speak out against racism, which is quite difficult in Latin America. I have frequently noticed that the loudest talkers are almost on this topic are almost never people who would actually have to endure racism in Latin America.
 
Old 01-18-2014, 10:20 PM
 
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Race in Brazil: Affirming a divide | The Economist

Article on racism in Brazil.
 
Old 01-19-2014, 07:37 PM
 
Location: Calgary,AB
70 posts, read 89,738 times
Reputation: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by caribny View Post
I wonder why Latin Americans like to justify the fact that its OK that blacks in that region are at the bottom of the ladder by citing Jim Crow.

Guess what blacks in the South organized to fight against it, assisted by many whites and Jim Crow has been over now for 50 years.

Also there hasn't been legally sanctioned racism in places like New York as least as long has been true for Latin America.


Basically BOTH the Anglo Saxon North America and the Iberian Latin America have a history of racism. Arguing about who is less racist in 2014 seem quite stupid, especially when a quick trip to Rio will show that blacks/dark mulattos there are much worse off than they are in New York City.

And from what I have seen if I were a dark skinned black person I would much rather be in the USA. At least I would be ALLOWED to speak out against racism, which is quite difficult in Latin America. I have frequently noticed that the loudest talkers are almost on this topic are almost never people who would actually have to endure racism in Latin America.

C'est ne pas vrai
D'abord, Latin American cultures are mixed partly the conquerors were mostly men and they mixed with the rest, also the catholic church mixed their beliefs with the indigenous cultures, or in oher words a religious and cultural miscegenation.

Additionally, Racism is openly discussed in Latin America if u have a basic level in Spanish you can try to ride the books of Garcia Linera or what about an indigenous president in Bolivia? Coming from the lowest income level? sorry but he isn't a rich guy like Obama, or Chili , Argentina and Brazil with woman being their head of State?



Additionally, of course anybody living in a developed country can have a better standard of living than a developing one that is just common sense , about the French bashing, Rachida Dati? , Sarkozy have Hungarian roots, is different a concept of Citoyenneté français is based on abstract conepts , at least Zidane, Farah, Ribery or DIAM are not supposed to be terrorists, or the large nummber of muslims in French cinema, music and debates.


In the end , you have to differenciate a concept of a Multicultural country like Bolivia or Peru with countries with high levels of Immigration like USA or Canada.
 
Old 01-19-2014, 07:39 PM
 
Location: Calgary,AB
70 posts, read 89,738 times
Reputation: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by caribny View Post
I wonder why Latin Americans like to justify the fact that its OK that blacks in that region are at the bottom of the ladder by citing Jim Crow.

Guess what blacks in the South organized to fight against it, assisted by many whites and Jim Crow has been over now for 50 years.

Also there hasn't been legally sanctioned racism in places like New York as least as long has been true for Latin America.


Basically BOTH the Anglo Saxon North America and the Iberian Latin America have a history of racism. Arguing about who is less racist in 2014 seem quite stupid, especially when a quick trip to Rio will show that blacks/dark mulattos there are much worse off than they are in New York City.

And from what I have seen if I were a dark skinned black person I would much rather be in the USA. At least I would be ALLOWED to speak out against racism, which is quite difficult in Latin America. I have frequently noticed that the loudest talkers are almost on this topic are almost never people who would actually have to endure racism in Latin America.

C'est ne pas vrai
D'abord, Latin American cultures are mixed partly the conquerors were mostly men and they mixed with the rest, also the catholic church mixed their beliefs with the indigenous cultures, or in oher words a religious and cultural miscegenation.



Furthermore, Racism is openly discussed in Latin America if u have a basic level in Spanish you can try to ride the books of Garcia Linera or what about an indigenous president in Bolivia? Coming from the lowest income level? sorry but he isn't a rich guy like Obama, or Chili , Argentina and Brazil with woman being their head of State?



Additionally, of course anybody living in a developed country can have a better standard of living than a developing one that is just common sense , about the French bashing, Rachida Dati? , Sarkozy have Hungarian roots, is different a concept of Citoyenneté français is based on abstract conepts , at least Zidane, Farah, Ribery or DIAM are not supposed to be terrorists, or the large nummber of muslims in French cinema, music and debates.

In the end , you have to differenciate a concept of a Multicultural country like Bolivia or Peru with countries with high levels of Immigration like USA or Canada.
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