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Old 05-16-2012, 01:17 PM
 
1,176 posts, read 2,763,529 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by portlanderinOC View Post
Last time I checked, Brazil is MUCH cheaper than the US.
Have you been there recently? We are there now. As usual, it depends on what you're buying. Cars, even domestic ones but especially imports, are much more expensive than equivalent cars in the U.S. Gasoline is much more expensive. Some food items in the supermarket cost less than you'd pay in the U.S., and some are more. Air fares quite similar. Hotels, at least as much. As noted, imported items, whether computers or running shoes or CDs or liquor or food, are much more expensive than in the U.S. (I mean items imported to both countries, not just those imported to Brazil from the U.S.). Biofuel costs less than gasoline, but the push to grow more sugarcane has had the unintended effect of incresed deforestation.

Brazil's boom has already started to subside a bit. Growth estimates are down. At one point not that long ago, the exchange rate was under 1.60 Reais to one US Dollar. Now the Dollar is up to over 2 Reais for the first time in 3 years. The crisis in Europe is blamed in part. Seldom mentioned in foreign reports on the U.S. economy is the government's high debt. The last administration spent a lot of money and left a big debt. The new president said she'd restrain spending, but would not lessen spending on social or infrastructure programs. At the same time, she also said she'd lower many taxes,

Mentioned even less often in news reports is the high degree of personal consumer debt, with credit card interest rates than can range to over 150% annually.

Lowering commodity prices have also hurt the economy. About 3 years ago I bought some Petrobras (petroleum) stock. It's now worth under 1/3 of what I paid. That doesn't mean the economy's going to go bust, or even stall, but its progress could well slow, and if there is a significant downturn and people can't pay off their debts, there could be problems (as in the U.S.). There is still a large amount of really abject poverty in Brazil (we see it firsthand). And there is, yes, still corruption affecting progress. I hope the progress continues, and even picks up, but I'm not investing in the Bovespa just yet.

Last edited by Samoi137; 05-16-2012 at 01:34 PM..
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Old 05-16-2012, 03:02 PM
 
136 posts, read 180,621 times
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If Brazil wants to become the "USA of the 21st Century" it better start developing something the rest of the world wants. Right now it looks like a "boom" largely based on lifting it's people out of poverty.
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Old 05-18-2012, 07:06 AM
 
50 posts, read 112,370 times
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This question is such non sense that I dont even know where to begin...

A crime ridden country, with endless amounts of people living way below the poverty line of Uganda, widespread corruption and a sick mentality of "Lei de Gerson" (you must be brazilian to understand this), Brazil is still a 3rd world country only because there is no such a thing as 4th world country.

Watching videos on Youtube - yes - it is a prosperous country that will dominate the world. Set a foot there for a DAY and your opinion will change completely.
I was born and raised in Brazil (Salvador-BA) and left the country almost 15 years ago. There has been a tremendous modernization process in Brazil and indeed the middle class lives in a different way now, while quite a few people "left" the poverty line and now have access to goods that were unimaginable before. The sad reality is that there are now people that finally can buy a clothing washing machine, yet they still need to walk a mile to the nearest river and bring water in buckets, to fill up the machine.
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Old 05-18-2012, 07:21 AM
 
Location: In the heights
22,210 posts, read 23,725,878 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baiaxaba View Post
This question is such non sense that I dont even know where to begin...

A crime ridden country, with endless amounts of people living way below the poverty line of Uganda, widespread corruption and a sick mentality of "Lei de Gerson" (you must be brazilian to understand this), Brazil is still a 3rd world country only because there is no such a thing as 4th world country.

Watching videos on Youtube - yes - it is a prosperous country that will dominate the world. Set a foot there for a DAY and your opinion will change completely.
I was born and raised in Brazil (Salvador-BA) and left the country almost 15 years ago. There has been a tremendous modernization process in Brazil and indeed the middle class lives in a different way now, while quite a few people "left" the poverty line and now have access to goods that were unimaginable before. The sad reality is that there are now people that finally can buy a clothing washing machine, yet they still need to walk a mile to the nearest river and bring water in buckets, to fill up the machine.
I agree the question is ridiculous, but I think you're vastly underestimating just how much more poverty some other parts of the world are if you're putting up a comparison to Uganda and the least developed of third world countries.
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Old 05-18-2012, 02:59 PM
 
Location: Rio de Janeiro, Brazil
597 posts, read 1,157,931 times
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Yes, I hope so!
Today, Brazil has high rates of economic growth and jobs and people from many places of the world want to come live here.
Now, I hope our government close our borders to this immigrants flow, as U.S. always has done with Brazilians and others.
Now the game is changing!!
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Old 05-18-2012, 06:29 PM
 
50 posts, read 112,370 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
I agree the question is ridiculous, but I think you're vastly underestimating just how much more poverty some other parts of the world are if you're putting up a comparison to Uganda and the least developed of third world countries.
I see your point. But reality is, unless you have been to the far cities in the North and Northeast regions of Brazil, the cities you dont see on TV documentaries, you will realize the comparison to Uganda may not be that much of a stretch.
We used to own a few farms back in the 80's and took old clothing to the people living in the nearby town. The following year, they'd still be wearing the same clothes you brought the year before. Rinse and repeat 10-15 years, no jokes. At times, the smallest holes in the shirt would make it look like the opening of a skirt. In certain areas, there is extreme poverty and people are very malnourished because not even the reptiles survive the drought, to serve as alternative food. The first time I read about "cardboard soup" and "stone soup" I thought it was a joke, but it was not. People were so hungry they'd prepare a soup out of water, salt and cardboard, to add texture and colour. Others would use dirty stones to replace cardboard. No nutritional value whatsoever, just chemicals but with some salt it feels better in the stomach than nothing.
I understand that those "googling" Brazil will find youtube videos showing the best places in Rio or Sao Paulo. What those videos dont show is the widespread crime, people smoking crack on the streets, etc.
My point is that no matter if we are the 6th largest economy in the world or move up or down, you simply cannot consider yourself a world class place and trend setter if you still have those ugly aspects as part of some people's everyday life.
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Old 05-18-2012, 07:48 PM
 
842 posts, read 1,101,160 times
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Brazil is doing okay but nothing compared to China-like growth. It did very good in 2010 but last year was just fine. Nothing truly spectacular or sustained high growth.

Besides, the country's infrastructure and education system have a long, really long way to go. China, on the other hand, has some infrastructure to be envious of.
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Old 05-18-2012, 07:52 PM
 
842 posts, read 1,101,160 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BRAZILIAN View Post
Yes, I hope so!
Today, Brazil has high rates of economic growth and jobs and people from many places of the world want to come live here.
Now, I hope our government close our borders to this immigrants flow, as U.S. always has done with Brazilians and others.
Now the game is changing!!
Brazil is only good for those who have a degree, the low paying jobs are really terrible.

Brazilians with poor education (most of them) will continue to try to find jobs elsewhere because they will still be much better paid abroad.

Every country has the right to close its borders to immigration or to demand the right documents, I can't understand why that is so surprising to many people.
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Old 05-18-2012, 09:40 PM
 
Location: In the heights
22,210 posts, read 23,725,878 times
Reputation: 11662
Quote:
Originally Posted by baiaxaba View Post
I see your point. But reality is, unless you have been to the far cities in the North and Northeast regions of Brazil, the cities you dont see on TV documentaries, you will realize the comparison to Uganda may not be that much of a stretch.
We used to own a few farms back in the 80's and took old clothing to the people living in the nearby town. The following year, they'd still be wearing the same clothes you brought the year before. Rinse and repeat 10-15 years, no jokes. At times, the smallest holes in the shirt would make it look like the opening of a skirt. In certain areas, there is extreme poverty and people are very malnourished because not even the reptiles survive the drought, to serve as alternative food. The first time I read about "cardboard soup" and "stone soup" I thought it was a joke, but it was not. People were so hungry they'd prepare a soup out of water, salt and cardboard, to add texture and colour. Others would use dirty stones to replace cardboard. No nutritional value whatsoever, just chemicals but with some salt it feels better in the stomach than nothing.
I understand that those "googling" Brazil will find youtube videos showing the best places in Rio or Sao Paulo. What those videos dont show is the widespread crime, people smoking crack on the streets, etc.
My point is that no matter if we are the 6th largest economy in the world or move up or down, you simply cannot consider yourself a world class place and trend setter if you still have those ugly aspects as part of some people's everyday life.
I didn't say anything towards Brazil being a developed first world paradise at all. I did say that you are way off base with comparisons to Uganda, because the truly impoverished nations of sub-saharan Africa (along with Haiti) are in an entirely other league. The kinds of problems those areas are facing with interethnic warfare, minimal penetration of any infrastructure or government whatsoever, massive political and social instability, etc. is on an entirely different scale.

This is a closer indicator of where Brazil fits, based on data about seven years old (whereas Brazil has improved overall to some extent in those years).
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Old 05-18-2012, 11:50 PM
 
Location: US Empire, Pac NW
5,008 posts, read 10,805,042 times
Reputation: 4125
I second China becoming the next US. Brazil has way too much economic disparity. Not saying that it doesn't exist in China as well or even the US for that matter, but in Brazil it's stark.
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