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Old 01-14-2014, 06:01 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DginnWonder View Post
If


Cuba was much more demographically European pre-Castro, but there was no real middle class..

To the contrary Cuba did have a large urban middle class. The issue is that it also had wide spread rural poverty. Havana was a sophisticated city. Eastern Cuba was quite primitive in its rural areas, with 50% illiteracy.


If you merge the narrative of the Castro supporters with those of the elites, one probably gets closer to the truth of what Cuba was like pre Castro.

 
Old 01-14-2014, 06:09 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DginnWonder View Post
Statistics and personal anecdotes are all you need to answer that question. The entire island of Saint Martin is over 85% White/European. That's pretty white, especially when you compare that to Cuba's demographics, which state that over 60 to 70% of its population is "light-skinned."

!

I think that you meant St Barths. The local population of St Maarten/Martin is almost 100% black, though it has large numbers of migrants from every where, so racial statistics are hard to come by, as this is a fluid population.

I do agree that neither side of St Maarten is European even though thousand of French metropoles live on the French side. St Maarten/Martin is resembles the nearby Virgin and Leeward islands much more than anything European.
 
Old 01-14-2014, 06:22 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AntonioR View Post
This has also lead to a stronger sense of national identity, with many people from the Spanish Caribbean feeling uneasy whenever Americans want to break them down based on race or wants to impose a racial identity.

.

Its interesting that black and many mulatto Cubans don't live with their white counterparts when they reach the USA. So it appears as if this "utopia" which you imagine, doesn't apply to Cubans. Pre Castro black and mulatto Cubans had their own social groups. Indeed Club Atenas was targeted to the black middle class, and they often had dialogue with black Americans like DuBois.
 
Old 01-14-2014, 06:25 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AntonioR View Post
Why do people like to combine the black and mulatto statistics? It never made sense to me.

No one would even dream of combining the mulatto and white statistics, despite the fact that mulattoes everywhere (with few and rare exceptions - like in the USA) tend to be culturally closer to whites than to blacks. Also, no one would even consider combining the mestizo and indigenous people statistics.

I'm not saying those two statistics should be combined, but it does begs to be asked.

With that out of the way, how are the black, mulatto and white birthrates in Cuba? Brazil? Everywhere else?

Notice I'm not asking any combination, just each set separately, as it should be.

Please tell us at what point does a black person become a mulatto. When you do then maybe people can accurately separate the two. It is up to debate whether mulattos are culturally closer to blacks or whites. I suspect it depends on the person and the family which raised them, and whether they have close black or white relatives.
 
Old 01-14-2014, 11:41 AM
 
Location: Brasilia
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As a matter of fact almost every city in Latin America is European in style. From Mexico to Chile and Argentina from Mexico City, though Guanajuato, Bogota, Recife, Lima, Salvador, Quito, Ouro Preto, Rio, São Paulo, Buenos Aires, Rosario, Santiago, Valparaiso etc, all of them have European taste.
 
Old 06-08-2014, 11:08 AM
 
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Default yeah ok

Quote:
Originally Posted by caribny View Post
Does Cuba have that juju "presence" that Nigeria has? In Africa much time is spent dealing with demons and appeasing the ancestors and the consequences of not doing an adequate job are dire. A trip into the village Africa will terrify most of us westernized blacks, including Cubans. Even taking a picture of the wrong thing might lead to a serious beating by villagers who feel that they must avenge the spirits for what this stupid "white" man (yes that's what they call us) just did.
really?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZyyT2_8U2TM
 
Old 06-08-2014, 12:39 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TerryCarr View Post

What's your point? You know that there is a whole spiritual belief system beyond mere drumming, and the only blacks from the Americas who MIGHT have a clue about that are VERY RURAL Haitians and the Maroons from Suriname.

Face it a Cuban blacks will be more at home in New York City than in some remote village in West or Central Africa.
 
Old 06-08-2014, 01:05 PM
Status: "Happy 2020!" (set 15 days ago)
 
5,681 posts, read 8,423,996 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caribny View Post
What's your point? You know that there is a whole spiritual belief system beyond mere drumming, and the only blacks from the Americas who MIGHT have a clue about that are VERY RURAL Haitians and the Maroons from Suriname.
I think you are right about this. I remember that quite a while ago I read something about Haitians being superstitious about getting their photos taken because they think the camera might capture their soul or something like that. At the time I didn't know about this tradition in Africa, but now I'm thinking it probably is an African cultural trait that still survives in Haiti.

A few months ago I also watched this video about a group of Americans (and a Dominican woman that in the video appears to be named Alida) that were in Dominican Republic and they went to Haiti for a few days. Around the minute 1:23 (if you want to jump to that part, click where it says 1:23 on the time bar) in the following video the guy mentions that Haitians don't like to have their picture taken:

[vimeo]84423164[/vimeo]

If anyone is interested in the other parts of the video, here they are:

Part I
[vimeo]83204881[/vimeo]

Part II
[vimeo]83320460[/vimeo]
 
Old 06-08-2014, 02:10 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AntonioR View Post
I think you are right about this. I remember that quite a while ago I read something about Haitians being superstitious about getting their photos taken because they ]

In some instances its because people don't know what you will do with the photos and indeed NO WHERE in the Caribbean will I suggest that any one takes a photo of a person without permission.

In Africa we were told that in the rural areas they fear that the spirits might be trapped in the camera and the ancestors will wreak revenge on them. If one persists the very people who were so hospitable will break your camera to protect themselves.

There is also a pervasive paranoia about demons.

We westerners don't understand this, so when some one visits a village, is well treated and then assumes that they can live there, the disappointment to follow will be dire, once they begin to understand that these people have a non Western, and at times pre scientific, perspective on many things.

We are called a variety of names behind our backs, most suggesting that we are "white". Not physically of course, but culturally as we are so Western.

So when I hear some one marveling about how "African" Cuban blacks are because they drum I chuckle.
 
Old 06-09-2014, 05:56 AM
 
75 posts, read 86,029 times
Reputation: 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by caribny View Post
In some instances its because people don't know what you will do with the photos and indeed NO WHERE in the Caribbean will I suggest that any one takes a photo of a person without permission.

In Africa we were told that in the rural areas they fear that the spirits might be trapped in the camera and the ancestors will wreak revenge on them. If one persists the very people who were so hospitable will break your camera to protect themselves.

There is also a pervasive paranoia about demons.

We westerners don't understand this, so when some one visits a village, is well treated and then assumes that they can live there, the disappointment to follow will be dire, once they begin to understand that these people have a non Western, and at times pre scientific, perspective on many things.

We are called a variety of names behind our backs, most suggesting that we are "white". Not physically of course, but culturally as we are so Western.

So when I hear some one marveling about how "African" Cuban blacks are because they drum I chuckle.
africa is not one culture some people just ask for money if you are gonna take a pic of them
they do sacrifice and in sometimes drink the blood in Cuba


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