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Old 06-21-2012, 07:22 PM
 
Location: Chicago, IL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Antonio84 View Post
The number of actual blacks in the US is less than the official figure. Remember that the US is in a serious denial of its mixed race population, especially their significant black/white mixed people. Having said this, things are changing.

Here's a map that shows the percentages (in pie charts) of each race in the Americas. All you have to do is figure out what's the population of each country and then you will have an idea of the size of each race, including those that are mixed. Notice that in the US, blacks make up roughly half of African Americans while the other half is composed of mulattoes (white/black mixed). Despite that, there are more pure blacks in the US than in Brazil, but Brazil has more people of full and partial African descent than the US.

LINK: Racial Composition of the Americas (in Spanish)

Color Code (Each word is colored to reflect its portion in each pie chart)

Native American / Amerindian
Mestizo (Amerindian/white mixed)
Caucasian
Mulatto (White/black mixed)
Black (predominantly Sub-saharan African)
East Asian (
China, Japan, etc)
Indian (from India)
Garifuna, Zambo (Amerindian/black mixed), or Multiracial
Javanese (from the island of Java in Indonesia)
Other origins, other mixes

Note: Each category was listed here as it appears in the lower left corner of the map.

Latin American countries with significant mulatto/black populations are Cuba, Dominican Republic, Puerto Rico, Venezuela, Colombia, Panama and Brazil.
Interesting info, but I would have to question how they came up with this data. At least with the US and Canada.

The US is about 12%-13% black by American standards and I would guess about 1% mulatto. In the US and Canada someone who is considered mulatto is generally about 1/2 to 1/4 black. Although it also depends on a person's appearance as most people would say president Obama is black but would probably say Derek Jeter is mulatto, even though both are 1/2 black.

According to that chart the US appears to be about 7% black and about 7% mulatto. Now I know that light-skinned blacks may be put into other categories in other nations, but in the US census they would just be considered black. I don't know how there would ever be a basis to determine how "mulatto" American or Canadian blacks are.

Canada is only 16% visible minority according to their 2006 national statistics, of which the largest groups are from Asia. However, that map you posted says Canada in about 15% mestizo and 15% mulatto. In fact Canada is only 2.5% black and has no mestizo people to speak of.

 
Old 06-21-2012, 08:11 PM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Antonio84 View Post
I thought the typical white admixture in African Americans ranged from 15% to 30% of DNA?

Anyway, I personally think that anyone with a predominant race admixture that is less than 90%, can be considered mixed since usually something shows physically that points to some mixture. Obviously the greater the admixture, the more pronounced the physical tell-tell signs that there was a mixture somewhere down a person's genetic tree.

I've seen studies that have concluded that white genes are much more prevalent in African Americans than black genes in European-Americans. It actually makes sense when you think about it.
This is only the case because most visibly 'mixed' people in the US are classified or seen as 'black.' If they're half black/half white they're considered 'black' so it's a matter of perspective. In Brazil Obama would just be seen as mixed. One could even see him as a white person with a lot of black ancestry, just as much as a black man with white ancestry.
 
Old 06-21-2012, 08:30 PM
 
Location: Toronto
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5Lakes View Post
Interesting info, but I would have to question how they came up with this data. At least with the US and Canada.

The US is about 12%-13% black by American standards and I would guess about 1% mulatto. In the US and Canada someone who is considered mulatto is generally about 1/2 to 1/4 black. Although it also depends on a person's appearance as most people would say president Obama is black but would probably say Derek Jeter is mulatto, even though both are 1/2 black.

According to that chart the US appears to be about 7% black and about 7% mulatto. Now I know that light-skinned blacks may be put into other categories in other nations, but in the US census they would just be considered black. I don't know how there would ever be a basis to determine how "mulatto" American or Canadian blacks are.

Canada is only 16% visible minority according to their 2006 national statistics, of which the largest groups are from Asia. However, that map you posted says Canada in about 15% mestizo and 15% mulatto. In fact Canada is only 2.5% black and has no mestizo people to speak of.
The "one-drop" rule is distinctively an American historical phenomenon (which some still obsess about/carry over to the present day).

In fact, it's one of the ways Americans stand out compared to countries in the rest of the world. For example on this "How to tell you're an American" list: one of the characteristics of the American worldview is -- "Between "black" and "white" there are no other races. Someone with one black and one white parent looks black to you."

Unlike the US, Canada doesn't have the same history of that at all, and from my understanding, nobody cares. "Black" like the other census categories are all just self-identified categories.

On a related note, there is a distinctive group/category called the Metis in Canada which refer to those of mixed Aboriginal and European settler (originally mostly French) descent, who developed their own cultural/collective identity.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M%C3%A9tis_people_(Canada)
 
Old 06-21-2012, 08:35 PM
 
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"Black" in the US is more fixed than in other places, as well as much more simple.

If there is ANY sign of "blackness," you are considered black, by pretty much EVERY American. Derek Jeter is an example of someone that Americans view as "black, but mixed." His eyes obviously hint at non-African ancestry, but because his other features illustrate his black heritage, he is still seen as black. They eyes just add the "mixed" part, but he is still sen as "black."

About blackness in Brazil, there is a saying that is not too dissimilar to sayings in the US:

You may not know if you're black or not, but the police does!

There are variations to it, but Black Americans say things very similar to this. That is to say, you may deny your blackness, but someone will usually come around and make it clear as to what you are.

Black Canadians are very different from Black Americans and Brazilians. Black Canadians are more so recent immigrants, or their offspring. Black Brazilians and Americans are an intrinsic part of their countries' history, culture, etc. They are just as American/Brazilian as the Germans, Irish, or Italian immigrants (some may argue more, because the Blacks were here longer, before "the waves"), as opposed to Black Canadians, who are recent introductions to Canada.
 
Old 06-21-2012, 09:55 PM
 
81 posts, read 203,112 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DginnWonder View Post
"Black" in the US is more fixed than in other places, as well as much more simple.

If there is ANY sign of "blackness," you are considered black, by pretty much EVERY American. Derek Jeter is an example of someone that Americans view as "black, but mixed." His eyes obviously hint at non-African ancestry, but because his other features illustrate his black heritage, he is still seen as black. They eyes just add the "mixed" part, but he is still sen as "black."
.

I didn't know this dude, but here in Brazil he wouldn't be considered black. People here would probably call him "moreno" or "mulato" and maybe even white, but not black.
 
Old 06-22-2012, 01:22 AM
 
Location: Toronto
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DginnWonder View Post
Black Canadians are very different from Black Americans and Brazilians. Black Canadians are more so recent immigrants, or their offspring. Black Brazilians and Americans are an intrinsic part of their countries' history, culture, etc. They are just as American/Brazilian as the Germans, Irish, or Italian immigrants (some may argue more, because the Blacks were here longer, before "the waves"), as opposed to Black Canadians, who are recent introductions to Canada.
Black Canadians have had a long history in Canada, though maybe not as large in number proportionally compared to the US, and still make up a fair number of the population (after south Asians and Chinese, they're the largest population that forms a statistical category in the "visible minority" census classification). Mathieu de Costa was part of the band of explorers of Samuel de Champlain in the early 17 th century and is an individual I've heard mentioned in history classes as the first Black Canadian.

Some Black Canadians are descended from Americans who arrived via the Underground Railroad in the 19th century. Indeed, a great number of those individuals did go back and return to the United States later on after the abolition of slavery, but they are still many with those roots in Canada. A good number of Canadian blacks were also free Americans. Not all are "recent" immigrants (whether that matters or not), though it's true that most (I'm guessing a large majority?) came after the relaxation of immigration laws and Trudeau's multiculturalism policy in the 1960s and later.

However, the Black Canadian community is very diverse in general, and doesn't really have a single label "Black". Aside from the American immigrants from earlier on, there are also those coming from the Carribbean (eg. Jamaicans which make up a sizeable proportion of Black Canadians in Toronto for instance, and Haitians which do the same from Montreal), and those with origins from African countries, both English-speaking and French-speaking. Some are also descended from refugees, such as those escaping political strife/war from say Rwanda or Somalia (Canada I think takes in the most refugees per capita of any country). The Black communities in Canada are very diverse, and compared to American Blacks, often choose to emphasize various parts of their identity based on culture (eg. identify as a West Indian, from the West Indies).
 
Old 06-22-2012, 03:11 AM
 
Location: Macao
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DginnWonder View Post
Black Canadians are very different from Black Americans and Brazilians. Black Canadians are more so recent immigrants, or their offspring. Black Brazilians and Americans are an intrinsic part of their countries' history, culture, etc. They are just as American/Brazilian as the Germans, Irish, or Italian immigrants (some may argue more, because the Blacks were here longer, before "the waves"), as opposed to Black Canadians, who are recent introductions to Canada.
True. Africans from Africa in North America, seem to be very well-educated to be able to pass all the paperwork and emigration proceduces to come across the Ocean in the modern era.

I've seen stats that continental Africans from Africa have much higher educations and incomes than just regular white americans. I think continental Africans are either just above or just behind Asian emigrants in the income/education levels as the top 2 in the U.S.

I'd imagine that probably applies to Canada as well, although I'm not sure about Canada stats.
 
Old 06-22-2012, 07:00 AM
Status: "I hate living in Georgia!!" (set 8 days ago)
 
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One thing about Brazil is that it imported more slaves and continued the slave trade much longer than the USA did. Ten times as many slaves were imported to Brazil as to the USA. Many remnants of the culture that were from Africa were preserved. Candomble is a synecretic religion based on some of the traditional African religions.
 
Old 06-22-2012, 07:21 AM
 
Location: In the heights
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Did anyone watch the African American Lives series? It was pretty interesting when the host found out he had more European than African-American ancestry.

Also, I believe Brazil also has a comparatively larger mix of indigenous Native American admixture overall than the US does for those considered black, white or in-between.
 
Old 06-22-2012, 07:52 AM
 
497 posts, read 873,687 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stumbler. View Post
Black Canadians have had a long history in Canada, though maybe not as large in number proportionally compared to the US, and still make up a fair number of the population (after south Asians and Chinese, they're the largest population that forms a statistical category in the "visible minority" census classification). Mathieu de Costa was part of the band of explorers of Samuel de Champlain in the early 17 th century and is an individual I've heard mentioned in history classes as the first Black Canadian.

Some Black Canadians are descended from Americans who arrived via the Underground Railroad in the 19th century. Indeed, a great number of those individuals did go back and return to the United States later on after the abolition of slavery, but they are still many with those roots in Canada. A good number of Canadian blacks were also free Americans. Not all are "recent" immigrants (whether that matters or not), though it's true that most (I'm guessing a large majority?) came after the relaxation of immigration laws and Trudeau's multiculturalism policy in the 1960s and later.

However, the Black Canadian community is very diverse in general, and doesn't really have a single label "Black". Aside from the American immigrants from earlier on, there are also those coming from the Carribbean (eg. Jamaicans which make up a sizeable proportion of Black Canadians in Toronto for instance, and Haitians which do the same from Montreal), and those with origins from African countries, both English-speaking and French-speaking. Some are also descended from refugees, such as those escaping political strife/war from say Rwanda or Somalia (Canada I think takes in the most refugees per capita of any country). The Black communities in Canada are very diverse, and compared to American Blacks, often choose to emphasize various parts of their identity based on culture (eg. identify as a West Indian, from the West Indies).
But that's my point. Before the easing of immigration, the country had the same policy as "White Australia." Also, many Black Canadians have ancestry from the United States, underlining the Black presence in the US. Furthermore, the vast majority of Canadians, when speaking of "minorities," immediately think of East Asians. In the US, many people will use the word as code-language for Blacks or Hispanics.

Of course Canada had blacks before the 60's, especially in places like Nova Scotia, but when you compare it to the Black presence/size in Brazil or the US, it's tiny, especially if we're excluding recent immigrants.

Also, I think the fact that Blacks in Canada choose to place such emphasis on their ancestry is telling, because it implies that they still have not yet seen themselves as Canadian. The same cannot be said of Black in the US or Brazil, especially blacks that have families in these countries for more than a generation.
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