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Old 08-15-2019, 12:19 PM
 
24,396 posts, read 17,826,155 times
Reputation: 9232

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Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
Okay. Marine areas were the fastest growing areas being put under protection over the last decade under the Natura 2000 program. Also, the general thrust of what youíre saying, that Europe as a whole will not countenance working against certain economic interests in order to do anything ecologically necessary is silly. What do you think the shifting towards electric vehicles does for Europe? They are already a major player in the automobile industry with industrial combustion engines and the changeover to EVs potentially leaves a lot of European car companies in the dust as well as opens them up to substantial competition from upstarts from all over.

Regardless, all of the above is besides the main point that all countries should be doing more on a policy level and that it will be the poorest segments of the population with the least means and resources to draw upon who will face the worst consequences. Trying to check someone on their privilege isnít going to be so gratifying when **** really hits the fan.
I see no electric vehicles in Spain and dud not see them in Portugal. Electric vehicles are not a thing with the majority of the population. I actually live in Europe and have direct knowledge and experience. The agricultural sector, especially its exports of citrus, olives, and warm weather crops has caused major wilderness destruction in Southern Europe that isnít being done. Oh, a lot of coastal areas in recent years have had apartments and hotels spring up as British and other Northern Europeans invest and move to the South.

Theyíre very happy to take tourism and foreign investment in the Mediterranean.
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Old 08-15-2019, 12:21 PM
 
5,472 posts, read 8,146,100 times
Reputation: 4313
No electric vehicles in Spain? I can understand seeing few electric vehicles, but none?



Let me check on a map to see in what country are Madrid and Leon.


https://somoselectricos.com/proximos...-tesla-espana/

Oh look, Tesla has service stations in all regions of that country. Who knew!

Tesla is the visible kind, but imagine other electric cars that look like their all gasoline counter parts!
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Old 08-15-2019, 12:25 PM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
21,887 posts, read 19,504,147 times
Reputation: 8657
Quote:
Originally Posted by EVANGELISTTI View Post
ORBITAL RADARS for checking in real time what is happing including when have clouds, not just satellite that take pics.

You Germans an old industrialazed country who poluted a lot the world think with 35 millions dollar the problem is solved there? Brazil expend billions dollars there. How Bolsonaro said we don't need this money.

If you want opine in Amazonas put the necessary money there for ORBITAL RADARS, drones and patroll all the Šrea bigger than EU.
Of course it is not a lot of money, but it is a clear sign. Bolsonaro is being reprimanded.

I definitely agree that the world is unfair. Europeans and Americans have caused almost all environmental pollution for 200 years.
Still, that doesn't mean Brazil and other countries should make those same mistakes.
Nor does Brazil do itself a favor when it goes the easy way of agricultural exports. It is the same cheap money as tourism. Would make more sense for Brazil to increase (instead of decrease, the way Bolsonaro does) education funding so that the country can develop sustainable soft industries.



As for Spain, much of it is simply too dry for reforestation, same in the southern half of Portugal. The Sahara is slowly creeping into Europe...

Last edited by Neuling; 08-15-2019 at 12:37 PM..
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Old 08-15-2019, 12:30 PM
 
24,396 posts, read 17,826,155 times
Reputation: 9232
Quote:
Originally Posted by AntonioR View Post
No electric vehicles in Spain? I can understand seeing few electric vehicles, but none?



Let me check on a map to see in what country are Madrid and Leon.


https://somoselectricos.com/proximos...-tesla-espana/

Oh look, Tesla has service stations in all regions of that country. Who knew!

Tesla is the visible kind, but imagine other electric cars that look like their all gasoline counter parts!
And how many gas stations are there in Spain? Lots of people drive motorcycles here too. Electric vehicles are not a thing here.

Used cars here are pretty common. Clunky, fuel consuming ones.
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Old 08-15-2019, 12:31 PM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
21,887 posts, read 19,504,147 times
Reputation: 8657
Quote:
Originally Posted by AntonioR View Post
No electric vehicles in Spain? I can understand seeing few electric vehicles, but none?



Let me check on a map to see in what country are Madrid and Leon.


https://somoselectricos.com/proximos...-tesla-espana/

Oh look, Tesla has service stations in all regions of that country. Who knew!

Tesla is the visible kind, but imagine other electric cars that look like their all gasoline counter parts!
Of course there are electric cars in Spain and Portugal. I seem them plugged in every day at the usual parking lots equipped with chargers.
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Old 08-15-2019, 12:33 PM
 
24,396 posts, read 17,826,155 times
Reputation: 9232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
Of course it is not a lot of money, but it is a clear sign. Bolsonaro is being reprimanded.

I definitely agree that the world is unfair. Europeans and Americans have caused almost all environmental pollution for 200 years.
Still, that doesn't mean Brazil and other countries should make those same mistakes.
Nor does Brazil do itself a favor when it goes the easy way of agricultural exports. It is the same cheap money as tourism. Would make more sense for Brazil to increase (instead of decrease, the way Bolsonaro does) education funding so that the country can develop sustainable soft industries.



As for Spain, much of it is simply to dry for reforestation, same in the southern half of Portugal. The Sahara is slowly creeping into Europe...
Itís not too dry for reforestation. Itís being used for heavy export agriculture, which is the real reason Southern Spain nor Southern Portugal will be reforested.

That and the real estate development doesnít help. Itís all about money.
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Old 08-15-2019, 12:34 PM
 
24,396 posts, read 17,826,155 times
Reputation: 9232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
Of course there are electric cars in Spain and Portugal. I seem them plugged in every day at the usual parking lots equipped with chargers.
Yeah right. I never saw any in Madrid, Barcelona, AndalucŪa, or Portugal.

That doesnít mean there are no electric cars, but they are hardly in danger of being a significant number of cars here.
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Old 08-15-2019, 12:38 PM
 
24,396 posts, read 17,826,155 times
Reputation: 9232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
Except Brazil will be getting billions for mining and timber in the Amazon. So Germany changes nothing there.

But Germany cannot even do anything about environmental destruction here in Europe.
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Old 08-15-2019, 12:56 PM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
21,887 posts, read 19,504,147 times
Reputation: 8657
Quote:
Originally Posted by NyWriterdude View Post
Itís not too dry for reforestation. Itís being used for heavy export agriculture, which is the real reason Southern Spain nor Southern Portugal will be reforested.

That and the real estate development doesnít help. Itís all about money.
That's not true. Most of southern Spain is simply dry, unused land. Almeria, where most of the greenhouses are located, is just a tiny part of Spain, although the ocean of plastic covers looks impressive (in a negative way), of course. The very fact that they use green houses in southern Spain is due to the fact that it is by nature very dry land, not made for agriculture or forests.
Add to the diminishing groundwater climate change and the future for southern Spain looks gloomy...

https://www.biu.com/climate-change-t...n-desert-2100/
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Old 08-15-2019, 12:57 PM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
21,887 posts, read 19,504,147 times
Reputation: 8657
Quote:
Originally Posted by NyWriterdude View Post
Yeah right. I never saw any in Madrid, Barcelona, AndalucŪa, or Portugal.

That doesnít mean there are no electric cars, but they are hardly in danger of being a significant number of cars here.
Their numbers are increasing fast...
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