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Old 04-09-2019, 08:46 AM
 
Location: Sunnyvale, CA
5,809 posts, read 9,467,884 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lieqiang View Post
....
I'm not saying all expats are as I've described. I'm sure you are one of the exceptions. It would be nice if more of them were the exceptions.


I don't want to put down those of you who are moving with genuine intentions, integrating with the community, working in the community alongside the locals (teaching, working in a co-op that employs locals), living in the neighborhood alongside locals - in other words living your daily life in a similar fashion to how the locals do (and in similar fashion to how you yourself would do in your own country). You all are doing the right thing.

Last edited by 80skeys; 04-09-2019 at 09:07 AM..
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Old 04-09-2019, 09:56 AM
 
Location: Pereira, Colombia
974 posts, read 1,962,673 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 80skeys View Post
The main problems I have with expats are:
1. They move in and outprice the locals or take over local businesses

2. They move in and behave obnoxiously, act superior, like they're better than the locals
3. They don't bother learning the language or integrating in positive ways with local communities. They "pretend" to learn something about the culture but all they do is dip their toes in the water a little while keeping their distance and retaining as much of their own culture as they can.
My feeling is: if you want to retain your own culture, stay in your own country.
Otherwise: relocate and go all-in; integrate 100% with the local culture. If more expats did this, they would have more appreciation for the people and the culture and they would effect positive influences rather than negative ones.
I tend to agree wholeheartedly, but there is a culture/integration ceiling that seems to be imposed on foreigners in developing countries. That ceiling may be much lower than said "developed country immigrant" (I hate the term expat) wants it to be, but some locals, particularly those who donīt know these immigrants well, will continue to implement it. Even immigrants in Europe or North America can be made to feel like the "other". I know Iīve been banging my head on the ceiling with some people for a couple years now...not everyone though.

That being said, Iīm not detracting from your statements above. I know too many people here and in other countries who violate all the expectations you listed. I try to keep my distance from them.
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Old 04-10-2019, 02:01 PM
 
Location: Sunnyvale, CA
5,809 posts, read 9,467,884 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aab7855 View Post
That being said, Iīm not detracting from your statements above. I know too many people here and in other countries who violate all the expectations you listed. I try to keep my distance from them.
Those people are the ones that give the bad name.

There are exceptions - I know a group of people in Shanghai - they are from Europe and the Middle East, they moved to China several years ago and they all learned Chinese and are fluent in it. .... *That's* the way to go!
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Old 04-10-2019, 04:57 PM
 
Location: Canada
4,811 posts, read 4,431,836 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 80skeys View Post
The main problems I have with expats are:
1. They move in and outprice the locals or take over local businesses

2. They move in and behave obnoxiously, act superior, like they're better than the locals
3. They don't bother learning the language or integrating in positive ways with local communities. They "pretend" to learn something about the culture but all they do is dip their toes in the water a little while keeping their distance and retaining as much of their own culture as they can.
My feeling is: if you want to retain your own culture, stay in your own country.
Otherwise: relocate and go all-in; integrate 100% with the local culture. If more expats did this, they would have more appreciation for the people and the culture and they would effect positive influences rather than negative ones.



I was real disappointed to see in Cambodia most of the bars, restaurants are owned by French people. Local Cambodians own very few of their businesses.
Yeah the same thing happens all over, prices go way up. The same thing happens here in Canada though. Wealthy Asians have made IT hard for middle class people to buy a house in places like Vancouver.

Different things draw different people to certain places. Many of the expats in Guatemala are laid back hippie types or retirees. I am aware though that in others places you have expats that set up their own enclaves.

Places like Medellin seem to be very popular with expats.
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Old 05-04-2019, 10:20 PM
 
Location: Crappyville,PA
371 posts, read 284,002 times
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Based only on the Latin American countries that I have visited, on safety only:
1. Ecuador
2. Panama
3. Nicaragua
4. Peru
5. Mexico


I found Ecuador to be less dangerous then here in the USA. Panama about the same level of danger as the USA, Nicaragua and Peru slightly more dangerous, and Mexico way more dangerous.
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Old 05-09-2019, 11:16 AM
 
356 posts, read 108,881 times
Reputation: 790
[quote=cid911;54885477]
Quote:
Originally Posted by 80skeys View Post

Are they retiring to Chiahuahua? I doubt it. Most retirees go to Mexico City or a couple specific locations where there are a lot of expats. We already know those are (fairly) safe.
I've never been to those expat communities, but knowing the little I know about expats, I wouldn't consider those places "Mexico", I would consider them American communities encerradas within Mexico. In other words, retirees don't go down there to integrate with the culture. They go down there to create their own little version of the U.S. within Mexico. To say this is Mexico is kind of a stretch, in my opinion. They aren't really living in or familiar with the Mexican culture, so I would take with a grain of salt any opinions they have on the matter.
So to the OP: it depends on whether you intend to live as a local, not in an expat community - in which case I would be hesitant if I were you - or if you intend to live in an expat-dominated community, in which case you should probably talk to them and ask them.

your ignorance and stupidity are really irritating. As of now there are Americans living in pretty much every city in Mexico. And of course, there are certain places where Americans tend to prefer to live do to the fact that want someone they can relate to (like language, cultural background). That shiit you call gated communities you make it seem like this fortress for Americans where they rule, and Mexicans are not allowed(have their little segregated communities like America before the 60's) to be part of, but in reality the majority of the people living in those gated communities are Mexicans. Americans go live in Mexico because they like the people, the culture, the system, the food etc.Ö there are pros and cons but it seem that at the end the pros out weight the cons, otherwise they will be flooding Colombia or other countries in south America that for some weird reason they are not, even thou you make them seem to be this 1st world industrialize high tech, very sophisticates, futuristic, highly educated white European countries. The people living in communities with high percentage of expats, most are retirees too old to learn another language this group of people donít even like to mingle with anyone while in America, they like their space and for the most part they go out to the city and inter act with the local culture that is one of the main reason they moved there. Expats in Mexico donít live in this island communities dude they are part of the community.i don't think many smart people here in this forum swallows your diatribe.

here we have the preferences of city data members vs reality there are more Americans preferring to retire in Mexico than in the rest of Latin America together, and they donít go there to live inside I bubble they come because they like the Mexican way of life, other wise they would be living the south American way of life.

https://vivatropical.com/mexico/wher...s-expats-live/

https://vivatropical.com/nicaragua/w...ntral-america/
I would point out a couple things:
1) the 1st article you link to says :
"What the data doesnít take into account is those who donít register or those who are only in Mexico for part of the year (i.e. snowbirds). Since places like Quintana Roo, Cancun, and Playa del Carmen contain the seasonal homes of many from the U.S., a visit to one of those places would have you wondering why every city on the entire Yucatan Peninsula didnít make the list."

Also all those places are TOURIST destinations, more than places to LIVE. Sure some live there but they're tourist destinations and MX is protecting those better because there's BIG MONEY in it. Not the same out in some small town ...

The bottom line is, I know MEXICANS who are afraid to live where they grew up in Mexico. Also in El Salvador which is worse, but not all that much worse especially if things keep going the way they have been in MX.

One last point: OK, a lot of gringos live in Mexico. But many bought there many years ago and simply don't want to move or can't move because no one will buy their homes.

I know gringos who are leaving MX due to crime.

I'm sure there are some safer areas but it's not a place I would choose to even travel at this point, let alone move to!
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Old 05-09-2019, 11:24 AM
 
356 posts, read 108,881 times
Reputation: 790
Quote:
Originally Posted by tone77 View Post
Based only on the Latin American countries that I have visited, on safety only:
1. Ecuador
2. Panama
3. Nicaragua
4. Peru
5. Mexico


I found Ecuador to be less dangerous then here in the USA. Panama about the same level of danger as the USA, Nicaragua and Peru slightly more dangerous, and Mexico way more dangerous.
I would not include Nicaragua nor Mexico on a list of safe countries. Panama, more or less. We were threatened with a machine gun by a border guard there who extracted a bribe from us.


Peru and Ecuador I know nothing about.

In my opinion an equally big concern about moving to the places mentioned above is the lack of good infrastructure, lack of reliable internet, lack of good roads, abundance of ridiculous bureaucracy, willy-nilly enforcing of rules and laws (i.e. the police decides if he wants to hassle YOU or not...), burglary (more common against gringos who everyone thinks are rich even when they're living on social security), lack of available quality products at good prices, etc. I could go on but those are some of the big ones.

Granted not all Latin countries nor those above have ALL these problems mentioned, but most have many of these problems.
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Old 05-09-2019, 12:07 PM
 
Location: Pereira, Colombia
974 posts, read 1,962,673 times
Reputation: 1023
Quote:
Originally Posted by movingvanmorrison View Post

In my opinion an equally big concern about moving to the places mentioned above is the lack of good infrastructure, lack of reliable internet, lack of good roads, abundance of ridiculous bureaucracy, willy-nilly enforcing of rules and laws (i.e. the police decides if he wants to hassle YOU or not...), burglary (more common against gringos who everyone thinks are rich even when they're living on social security), lack of available quality products at good prices, etc. I could go on but those are some of the big ones.

Granted not all Latin countries nor those above have ALL these problems mentioned, but most have many of these problems.
Pretty much why I want out after 6 1/2 years...I donīt wake up and fear for my safety, but what you just mentioned turns into "death by a thousand paper cuts" after so long.
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Old 05-09-2019, 09:02 PM
 
Location: London, UK
2,870 posts, read 1,544,263 times
Reputation: 1616
Quote:
Originally Posted by aab7855 View Post
Pretty much why I want out after 6 1/2 years...I donīt wake up and fear for my safety, but what you just mentioned turns into "death by a thousand paper cuts" after so long.
Good riddance. No place is perfect.
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Old 05-09-2019, 11:41 PM
 
Location: Sunnyvale, CA
5,809 posts, read 9,467,884 times
Reputation: 2950
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pueblofuerte View Post
No place is perfect.
This doesn't mean "every place is equal".
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