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Old 03-28-2019, 02:12 PM
 
12,266 posts, read 18,397,848 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 80skeys View Post
That's not true. The Spanish speaking people in northern NM referred to themselves as Mexicans all the way through the mid 20th century.
Of course it's true, what you meant to say is that is not true for (according to you) a small and remote portion of the territories such as Northern New Mexico, which of course does not necessarily make my statement false.
Actually I think parts of Northern New Mexico was claimed by France and sold to the US (Louisiana Purchase) before Mexico even gained there independence. Maybe they called themselves French.
However Santa Fe, a fur trading depot originally, was the territorial seat under both Spain (for centuries) and Mexico (for a short period of time). Heck they probably considered themselves as still part of Spain until they became a state.
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Old 03-28-2019, 03:09 PM
 
Location: New Mexico
3,874 posts, read 1,661,432 times
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Default Cutting for sign

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tritone View Post
Nuevomejicanos. Not Mexican, New Mexicans.

None of the Spanish origin groups from the American South West were ever Mexican nor did they identify with Mexicans. They were Californios, Tejanos, Nuevomexicanos, etc. There were also several indigenous groups from the South West, Pueblo Indians, Navajos, etc. They were not Mexican and never spoke Spanish.

Mexicans are NOT the natives of the American South West. They crossed the border.
They learned some Spanish, if only in self-defense. & some of the Native Peoples converted to Roman Catholicism. It was a complicated situation, & varied from pueblo to pueblo. The neomexicanos, Native Peoples, & mexicanos raided each other back & forth - for slaves, horses, & other goods.

& in New Mexico & Arizona - except for the Native Peoples then resident, Spain created the borders. TMK, the Spanish were the first set of Europeans in present-day NM & AZ.
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Old 03-28-2019, 08:25 PM
 
120 posts, read 52,625 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tritone View Post
Nuevomejicanos. Not Mexican, New Mexicans.

None of the Spanish origin groups from the American South West were ever Mexican nor did they identify with Mexicans. They were Californios, Tejanos, Nuevomexicanos, etc. There were also several indigenous groups from the South West, Pueblo Indians, Navajos, etc. They were not Mexican and never spoke Spanish.

Mexicans are NOT the natives of the American South West. They crossed the border.
The territory of Mexico as well as all of the Americas contained and still contain various types of indigenous groups, They differentiate in language, foods and culture. Exactly the same way as it was in the Southwest and most of North America.

Mexico became a nation in the early 1800's, but by then the Spanish with their language and culture had already been in the region for over 300 hundred years, way before the protestant whites ever dream of setting foot here.

Most Indians in the Southwest, Florida and the plains spoke some Spanish and had already come into contact with the Spanish culture three centuries prior. where do you think they got their horses? How did Geronimo get his Spanish name? why are they called Pueblo Indians?

California, Texas, New Mexico, Florida and lots of other areas in North America had become or were becoming part of the Latin American culture.
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Old 03-28-2019, 08:31 PM
 
1,226 posts, read 520,840 times
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at the rate the illegals are coming over the southern border.....by 2050, La Raza will reclaim the southwest.
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Old 03-29-2019, 12:19 AM
 
2,317 posts, read 943,447 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DonaldJTrump View Post
at the rate the illegals are coming over the southern border.....by 2050, La Raza will reclaim the southwest.
La Raza is full of it. They are inventing history and using it to make political claims. They are a bunch of new immigrants from what is today Mexico who are claiming something that was never theirs in the first place. You can't reclaim something that was never yours.

When we aquired the South West there were people there. THEY STAYED. No one left. No one was pushed out.

The following Native American groups have always been in the South West: Lakota, Apache, Pueblos, Shoshone, Navajos, Omahas, etc...

And there were a tiny number of Spanish descendants: Californios, Tejanos, NuevoMexicanos, etc.

They were the natives of the South West.

People who are running across the border from Latin America today, have nothing to do with the South West, never lived there, and have no claim to anything. How are you going to run across the border and claim to be the natives, when our natives are already here and never left? This whole "Atzlan" business that La Raza keeps talking about is fake. It was never Atzlan. They just made that up. They are the ones who are trying to colonize land that doesn't belong to them.

Last edited by Tritone; 03-29-2019 at 12:29 AM..
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Old 03-29-2019, 10:00 AM
 
7,437 posts, read 5,927,333 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Takezoe View Post
The Aztecs (Mexica tribe) found an island in the middle of a lake and called it Mexico.

the Aztecs then "Stole" the land from the surrounding tribes.

Then Spain "stole" the land from the Aztecs.

Then New Spain "stole" land and called themselves the country of Mexico.

then the United states Stole the land from Mexico that was vastly underpopulated and underdeveloped.
Good answer.
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Old 03-29-2019, 12:27 PM
 
Location: Sunnyvale, CA
5,819 posts, read 9,473,330 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tritone View Post
Nuevomejicanos. Not Mexican, New Mexicans.
No. "mejicanos." It was normal to hear them use the word "mejicano" by itself, to refer to themselves (and their language) through the 20th century.

Quote:
None of the Spanish origin groups from the American South West were ever Mexican nor did they identify with Mexicans.
Completely wrong. Not only were they under Mexican rule (from Mexico City) up to about 1830, but they knew they were and acknowledged it. There are several books that talk about the history of New Mexico and talk about how governors were sent from Mexico City to Santa Fe.

Quote:
There were also several indigenous groups from the South West, Pueblo Indians, Navajos, etc. They were not Mexican and never spoke Spanish.
It was not unusual to run into Native Americans in New Mexico who were fluent in Spanish up until the mid-20th century. The majority of them were not of course, but the number who were was not small either.
You need to pick up some books on southwest history, man.
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Old 03-29-2019, 04:58 PM
 
Location: New York Area
15,870 posts, read 6,248,592 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 80skeys View Post
Completely wrong. Not only were they under Mexican rule (from Mexico City) up to about 1830, but they knew they were and acknowledged it. There are several books that talk about the history of New Mexico and talk about how governors were sent from Mexico City to Santa Fe.
That's a grand total of nine years!
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Old 03-29-2019, 05:27 PM
 
Location: 912 feet above sea level
2,270 posts, read 879,068 times
Reputation: 12449
Quote:
Originally Posted by NyWriterdude View Post
With the current demographics, essentially they are taking it back. Latinos are now the majority in places like Los Angeles, New Mexico, etc. Anglos are now a minority in the state of California.

This will soon be the case in Texas as well.
This is true only for people who can't differentiate between ethnicity and nationality.

Los Angeles is no more being 'taken' by Mexico than Minnesota was ever 'taken' by Sweden.
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Old 03-30-2019, 08:03 PM
 
23 posts, read 3,486 times
Reputation: 16
No border. It was New Spain and then Mexico. Yes, Mexicans. Even English Speakers in Texas were nominally Mexican
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