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Old 06-18-2019, 12:40 PM
AFP
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EVANGELISTTI View Post
Racism is not the real reason what it happens in Brazil, but history.
First, paulistas are of recent Europeans background, 100 years ago when this state had half million people arrived 2 millions Europeans being 1 millions Italians and most from Veneto, ligther skinned italians, ligther than the average Brazilian-Portuguese white.
So how Sao Paulo is the richest state, having the headsquare of the biggest companies in Brazil of course you will see these overhelming whites paulistas with more central European looks at offices.

The people in blue collar jobs are poor migrants from northern Brazil (mostly mixed and blacks), Bolivia, Haiti and Africa. They are to Sao Paulo what center americans are for the USA.
Sao Paulo had never large slavery workforce used in farms. When the coffee plantation starded here the slavery had already over and because that these 2 millions Europeans were brought here.

But we have another big issue, one big mistake from the pastÖ Brazil until 1950 was a rural country, so the dumb Brazilian goverment at that time thought was not important educate the rural workforce. While Argentina and Uruguay as example were educating all their population, Brazil educated only the urban cities population with really good free school and college. So until in 1960 we had 60% of Brazilian population FULLY ILITERATED (whites and blacks but 90% of the blacks were farme workers). When Brazil started its industrialization in 1950 we had illiterate people coming from the interior to dispute job opportunities with well educated city citizens (whites). Because that you saw poor whites and poor blacks in blue collar jobs but only whites with few exceptions in white collar jobs.

The white paulistas and southern brazilian (from recent immigrants background, not the white from portuguese colonial stock) in another hand even being their grandparents farm workers as well, as they were from europeans countries that already valued education 100 years ago, they created theirselves colonial schools for its kids and driven them for college education. Because that languages like German, Italian and Japanese is spoken in Brazil yet, and because that Sao Paulo and south Brazil is prety much richer than the rest of the country.

Brazil just universalizated the education (elementary school and high school) 20 years ago, and only 10% of all brazilians have college degree so the things is only starting change now... we are really rich country for the few educated people we are.
The blacks in USA have the same education of the whites for much longer because that is easier for the clever black american get high position than the clever black Brazilians lacking formal education.
The colonial Portuguese-Brazilians from Sao Paulo and Minas Gerais and even the more southern states aren't just Portuguese many are descended from the Bandeirantes who often had Amerindian mother's even from the most important families.
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Old 06-18-2019, 07:01 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grad_student200 View Post
How do I know this? I am an indigenous member of a tribe that the Spanish colony had tried to kill off through a policy of genocide and slavery. The early Spaniards destroyed entire tribes or enslaved them. If the tribes fought back, then a scalp bounty system was set to pay pesos to kill off the tribes such as Apaches, Comanches, Kiowas, Navajos, etc. The Comanches and Kiowas drove the Spanish Army out of Central Texas. The wars were fierce. There was no "unity". [/url]
When you say you are an indigenous member of a tribe you should at least say which tribe and what area you come from. First and foremost indigenous tribes are not all the same, tribes in Texas tended to be very pluralistic and even more so in California.

For example, along the Gulf coast, The Karankawas, Attacapanis and Hasinais were sedentary tribes. These type of tribes tended to live and trade with the Spanish missions and presidios. The tribes mentioned along with the Mescales, Tacames, papalates, and Lipanes would come and live at the presidios for safety reasons, as well as for food and shelter. Once they got situated at the missions, they learned to be cooks, carpenters, shoemakers, and farmers. For example, the population of the San Antonio mission in 1743 was made up of 740 Spanish, 936 Indians and 387 mestizos.

The sedentary tribes mentioned were enemies to the nomadic Comanches, Apaches and Kiwana tribes. These nomadic tribes were large in numbers and tended to roam in huge areas of west and north Texas. They would raid the missions and presidios and destroy and kill anything in their way, be it Spanish, Indian or Mestizos. They would destroy the farms and would steal hundreds of horses, thousands of cattle and sheep. They would also take farm goods and or whatever else that was stocked piled.
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Old 06-19-2019, 06:18 AM
 
726 posts, read 380,366 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AFP View Post
The colonial Portuguese-Brazilians from Sao Paulo and Minas Gerais and even the more southern states aren't just Portuguese many are descended from the Bandeirantes who often had Amerindian mother's even from the most important families.
Not really.
Until the end of XVII century Brazil had only 300.00 people, when the gold was discovery in Minas Gerais and its neighboring states half part of Portuguese population migrated to Brazil. 100 years after, Brazil already had 3.6 millions people.
Most Brazilian of colonial background descends from these people.
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Old 06-19-2019, 09:14 AM
 
24,192 posts, read 17,574,394 times
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Originally Posted by walker1962 View Post
EXACTLY! When it comes to power/earnings/education, Latin America is OBVIOUSLY less integrated.
But depending how on the nation, that has changed considerably in the last 20 years. This is something racist Americans hate to acknowledge.
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Old 06-19-2019, 04:54 PM
 
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Racist Americans don't ever think about Latin America...
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Old 06-20-2019, 11:06 AM
AFP
 
6,898 posts, read 4,229,093 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EVANGELISTTI View Post
Not really.
Until the end of XVII century Brazil had only 300.00 people, when the gold was discovery in Minas Gerais and its neighboring states half part of Portuguese population migrated to Brazil. 100 years after, Brazil already had 3.6 millions people.
Most Brazilian of colonial background descends from these people.
Most but not all I see their DNA results even the very wealthy important families most have a minor component of Amerindian they aren't just Portuguese the weird way you guys pronounce the R's in that part of the country is because many of the Bandeirantes had Native American mother's who couldn't pronounce the R's. I see this all the time Brazilians are in denial they have some Amerindian and African.
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Old 06-21-2019, 10:10 AM
 
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American races are all completely divided against each other so there is certainly more unity down there
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Old 06-23-2019, 04:57 AM
 
24,192 posts, read 17,574,394 times
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Originally Posted by AntonioR View Post
I have to say that when affirmative action was put in place in the USA, where it coincides with the history, it created no problems for the population, except some backlash. Copy it word-for-word in Brazil and people donít even know how to identify but most people want the resources. To make matters worse, they identify one way to get the benefit of affirmative action, but identify some other way in reality. SMH
They solved the problem by having people send in pictures of themselves. Your eyes can tell whether someone has substantial African ancestry or not.

It really is very simple and yes it worked out well.
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Old 06-23-2019, 04:59 AM
 
24,192 posts, read 17,574,394 times
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Originally Posted by homenj View Post
I heard they are now implementing Affirmative action throughout colleges in Brazil. I donít know if things will change, though.
At least in Colombia you see Black People employee across the economy so yes it changed. Iím sure there changes in Brazil.
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Old 06-23-2019, 05:38 AM
 
64 posts, read 20,320 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AntonioR View Post
.

As far as Obama goes, just keep in mind that a real black hasn’t made it to the White House. Obama used his “black identity” and his “mixed identity” depending on the audience, but always to gain the most votes. When someone only had their “black identity” and can’t choose win the election is something else. I reality, the US had its first mixed race president. A real black one hasn’t arisen yet.

This is a tough call to make since the line between “black” and “Mulatto” is extremely blurred in the USA. Both genetically, socially and even phenotype-wise in a lot of cases.

Sources say that the average Black American is a quarter (25%) white - which is equivalent to one whole parent being a mulatto and one parent being full black. This means that black Americans are just as much a mulatto as they are a full black person. This blurs the line between black and Mulatto.

However, IF the black population in a given country was generally pure black and THEN we compared them with mulattoes THEN there is a clear distinction. But this is not the case with black Americans who have had their African ancestry significantly diluted down.

Heck, if you go into most Sub-Saharan African countries and you have 25% white ancestry then your instantly thrown into a mixed/colored/creole category separate from the pure-bread natives. You’ll probably stick out like a sore thumb too.

I believe that nowadays, American mulattoes deserve the right to identify as mixed-race if they wanted to...but with this being said, I believe that black Americans who either have heavy non-black ancestry and/or a mixed phenotype also have the right to identify as mixed (if they so chose to). They should also be able to identify as both if this accurately defines their experiences and how they navigate the world.

I think I promised myself that i’d stop discussing this topic back in 2010 but screw it lol

Last edited by HomeHunt82; 06-23-2019 at 06:23 AM..
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