Medical marijuana screeches to a halt in Arizona (crime, buying)
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I was personally against it all along because there are too many loopholes for abuse ... plus, marijuana contains just as many (if not more) long term side effects as cigarettes. However, what I'm opposed to even more is the government imposing bans and restrictions on these so called vices. Keeping these substances illegal has constantly proven to be ineffective, much like Prohibition was in the 1920s. The way I see it, being personally against something should never warrant laws to be enacted against it.
The main point of this whole thread is to show (once again) how these arrogant politicans and lawyers think they know better than the public. It was the voters who approved this law ... and like it or not, when the voters approve something it should go through and not be halted, watered down, or dismantled for whatever reason. Otherwise, what's the sense in voting???
The voters didn't vote for this law knowing all the loopholes in it. I voted for this law but wouldn't have had I know that naturopaths and homeopaths can certify people and that people with chronic pain were eligible for it. The way it was advertised was that it would be limited to certain diseases and that one would need a prescription from a physician. They also made it sound like dispensaries were limited in number. It was after the law passed that all these loopholes manifested itself. I'm glad the government kicked in and put a halt to it. The state definitely needs to clean it up.
Legalize it and quit pussyfooting around with these retarded laws. Pot's no worse than alcohol, generally speaking. All this hypocrisy and double-standard is ridiculous. I'm sure most of the naysayers enjoy tipping a little booze here and there. Same difference. Prohibition was already proven to be a big mistake, and some drug laws are about as bad and are supporting greater criminal activity.
If you don't like pot you don't have to smoke it, just like many people decide not to drink alcohol, or coffee, or use diet pills, etc. It's a choice. Problems arise when choice is removed (freedom removed). All the arguments in this thread smack of hypocrisy--oh, it's OK for this but not for this, or it's a woman thing, or it's as bad as guns...yeesh. Whatever.
Put your drug of choice (booze, caffeine, etc.) down and think about it, please.
Location: Upstate NY where the deer & the woodchucks are really happy right now
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Originally Posted by Esenjay
Legalize it and quit pussyfooting around with these retarded laws. Pot's no worse than alcohol, generally speaking. All this hypocrisy and double-standard is ridiculous. I'm sure most of the naysayers enjoy tipping a little booze here and there. Same difference. Prohibition was already proven to be a big mistake, and some drug laws are about as bad and are supporting greater criminal activity.
If you don't like pot you don't have to smoke it, just like many people decide not to drink alcohol, or coffee, or use diet pills, etc. It's a choice. Problems arise when choice is removed (freedom removed). All the arguments in this thread smack of hypocrisy--oh, it's OK for this but not for this, or it's a woman thing, or it's as bad as guns...yeesh. Whatever.
Put your drug of choice (booze, caffeine, etc.) down and think about it, please.
The voters didn't vote for this law knowing all the loopholes in it. I voted for this law but wouldn't have had I know that naturopaths and homeopaths can certify people and that people with chronic pain were eligible for it. The way it was advertised was that it would be limited to certain diseases and that one would need a prescription from a physician. They also made it sound like dispensaries were limited in number. It was after the law passed that all these loopholes manifested itself. I'm glad the government kicked in and put a halt to it. The state definitely needs to clean it up.
Honestly, I can't believe this is coming from you. You do realize that people who want marijuana will get access to it regardless if it's legal or not, right? So what's the sense in keeping these substances illegal, and continuously wasting our tax money on fighting a useless drug war? I can't believe you would actually support a clan of jackass politicians who are overstepping their bounds and going against the will of the voters.
Furthermore, being in favor of this at first, and then citing reasons for opposing it after passage does not warrant stopping this from going through. Frankly, I don't care what the public knew or didn't know before voting. The point is that the voters passed it, and the voters should always have the final say. If you're personally against marijuana (as I am as well), then the best advice I can offer is: don't use it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Esenjay
Legalize it and quit pussyfooting around with these retarded laws. Pot's no worse than alcohol, generally speaking. All this hypocrisy and double-standard is ridiculous. I'm sure most of the naysayers enjoy tipping a little booze here and there. Same difference. Prohibition was already proven to be a big mistake, and some drug laws are about as bad and are supporting greater criminal activity.
If you don't like pot you don't have to smoke it, just like many people decide not to drink alcohol, or coffee, or use diet pills, etc. It's a choice. Problems arise when choice is removed (freedom removed). All the arguments in this thread smack of hypocrisy--oh, it's OK for this but not for this, or it's a woman thing, or it's as bad as guns...yeesh. Whatever.
Put your drug of choice (booze, caffeine, etc.) down and think about it, please.
Very very well said! I find it amusing that the politicians who are thumping the federal drug laws are the same ones who preach about restoring personal freedom, states' rights, and getting the federal government off our backs. If their hypocrisy wasn't so pathetic, I'd be rolling on the floor laughing.
Brewer is abusing her POWER and THE GOVERNMENT SYSTEM! First, she claims Arizona does not HAVE TO abide to Federal law, after the passing of the Health Care Act. She whined, kicked, scream, like a poor loser. Well, she is a loser. but this time literally. Oh, but wait! The PEOPLE of Arizona voted YES to legalize the use of Medical Marijuana, just like California. Then, Brewer decided that she didn't like this and decided to enforce the Federal law (remember, the one that she said we didn't have to, with health care?). But President Obama made it publicly clear to the head law enforcement (Attorney General) NOT to enforce the federal law in those states that VOTED to have legalized, Medical Marijuana.
Let me get this straight. WEhen the majority voted in the new health care law, Jan Brewer was, or is refusing to follow it, then when the people that put her butt in office voted Medical Marijuana to be legalize and won, the same crazy lady, Brewer is incorrectly abusing the system and ignoring the actual people who just gave her the job to represent them, UNILATERALLY denying the wishes of the voters, threatening Federal Law, which we already know Obama gave it the OK, but Whack-Brewer is enforcing the FEDERAL law, even though it is NOT necessary and President Obama gave our Attorney General the express order not to enforce the Federal law in states like Arizona?
The sad thing here is, Jan Brewer isn't even smart enough to do this and hide the fact that she is full-on, transparently abusing her power and enforcing her personal wishes, over all of the people that went to the voter's box. I think the Federal Government needs to do something about this huge problem. The X-Ray Tech, Governor CANNOT decide when and when not to enforce Federal law, simply based on her feelings and without flinching, overriding the wishes and votes of the residents of Arizona whop put her behind in the seat!
I guess I am so confused, that I think Jan Brewer is representing Cuba, not the wonderful state of Arizona. They don't vote in Cuba, so Brewer doesn't have to worry about that. The citizens of Arizona made it crystal clear to the woman who works for us, that we do want legalized, medical marijuana. W hat gives her the right to unilaterally ignore our wishes? She needs to follow Arizona tradition and get the big old boot. Either Impeach her (like we did Meacham). Either way, she did not respect our wishes, so get somebody in there that will. Then to add to not representing us, she abused her power and the Federal system.
No wonder Arizona is the joke of the entire world and considered both the Hate State and the Stupidest State. Won both titles AFTER Brewer took office.
By the way, according to a study done by the Unites State's Government, there has never been a single fatality from the use of Marijuana, as opposed to normal Aspirin, or Tylenol, which are readily available at any store, are the primary cause for many fatalities per year. Therefore, Marijuana would be the safest medication available for Arizona Residents. Again, more people have died from Alcohol and other OVER THE COUNTER DRUGS than a single person ever dying from Marijuana.
Also, for those who do not like the idea of breathing smoke into their lungs, vaporizers, specifically used to ingest marijuana, are readily available. The use of this machine includes water and is much, much easier to administer the medication. The use of this appliance has grown substantially since the legalization of many states, to use Marijuana for Medical reasons.
No wonder Arizona is the joke of the entire world and considered both the Hate State and the Stupidest State. Won both titles AFTER Brewer took office.
Some of your points are interesting, but statements like the one above do much to discredit your viewpoint.
I was initially for this law but now I'm against it. The reason is the law was loosely written. There are loopholes in it that enable people to abuse the system and not use marijuana for what it was designed to do.
For example, one of the approved reasons/diagnoses is chronic pain. Chronic pain is so subjective. Anyone can claim they have chronic pain. A 21 year old college student can claim fibromyalgia and chronic pain. Fibromyalgia has no confirmatory imaging or lab criteria. It's a clinical diagnosis and one that many narcotics abusers will use to get Oxycontin and other drugs to sell on the street.
The second loophole is prescribing privileges are not limited to physicians (M.D. and D.O.) Naturopaths and Homeopaths can also certify patients. Naturopaths and Homeopaths do not possess the same training as physicians. They also do not have the same oversight committees that doctors are under with regards to prescribing controlled substances. I've talked to several physicians who don't even want to get involved with this because they are afraid they will be under increased scrutiny from the DEA and medical oversight committees. The ones who were open to certifying patients had strict criteria for who would receive it and wouldn't hand out scripts like candy.
The third problem was certification mills were popping up. In the New Times, you had people opening certification mills and charging $150 for a history and physical examination...hint...hint...pay me $150 cash and I'll certify you to get a script for marijuana. It's a huge money maker and invites abuse.
I support medical marijuana but I don't support legalization of marijuana. The way the California law is written is very loose and allows for abuse which is occurring as we speak. I wanted our law to be responsible and allow people who genuinely need it to get access to it.
I can understand what you are saying. But there will be always abusers, and just smoking pot may have some medicinal value, but not very much.If marijuana is used properly as medicine it is best to make it a tincture or oil.
If you google Rick Simpson in Nova Scotia, he cured many patients with the oil, that he make himself from the buds of marijuana, including thousands of cancer patients. He calls it hemp oil,he was charged four times by the Canadian RCMP, and he had to pay a fine, but he is still making it, and I m not sure, but marijuana will be totally legal in Canada soon, not just as a medical marijuana, but all across the country.
Honestly, I can't believe this is coming from you. You do realize that people who want marijuana will get access to it regardless if it's legal or not, right? So what's the sense in keeping these substances illegal, and continuously wasting our tax money on fighting a useless drug war? I can't believe you would actually support a clan of jackass politicians who are overstepping their bounds and going against the will of the voters.
Sure, they can get it but they will pay more money for it and jump through loopholes to get it. You can get anything in this country if you really want to so why not legalize everything by that logic? Why stop with weed, why not heroin and crack? Legalizing marijuana is not going to stop the drug trade. They will sell cocaine, heroin and LSD. Unless you legalize all drugs, you won't stop the drug trade. The reason you keep it illegal is that you limit access to it (you are not denying access, you are limiting it) and you don't make it socially acceptable by making it illegal.
I'm more conservative than you. I don't want to legalize it. I think legalizing it sets a precedent and make it socially acceptable to smoke weed. I don't want it to be socially acceptable to smoke marijuana. I don't want it to be available at your 7-11 and have kids buy an 1/8 for 3 dollars and get stoned in the parking lot and drive on the freeways. It is worse than cigarettes medically speaking. It contains far more tar in addition to other chemicals. Marijuana is also creates more disorientation than cigarettes. People who try to equate marijuana and cigarettes have accepted the conventional wisdom that it's "Just as bad as Cigarettes" but it isn't accurate medically speaking.
I do think marijuana has properties that are appropriate for some individuals and have no problem approving it in a controlled setting.
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Furthermore, being in favor of this at first, and then citing reasons for opposing it after passage does not warrant stopping this from going through. Frankly, I don't care what the public knew or didn't know before voting. The point is that the voters passed it, and the voters should always have the final say. If you're personally against marijuana (as I am as well), then the best advice I can offer is: don't use it.
Are you kidding me? Arizona residents didn't support the California version of the law which is loose and leads to abuse. They only supported a law that would allow for medical marijuana in a controlled setting. And even with that, this law barely passed. Why don't you allow the people to vote on the law now that they know the loopholes, think it will pass...I don't think so. The point is the voters were not properly informed and passed a law with certain expectations. Now that the law revealed that it can be abused and lead to a California-like law, I'm glad the Governor stepped in. Just because they duped the public into passing a law based on bad information, it doesn't mean it's going to go through just because you want it to out of some libertarian ideal.
I'm all for passing this law but it needs to be reformed and eliminate the loopholes.
Last edited by azriverfan.; 06-04-2011 at 12:27 AM..
By the way, according to a study done by the Unites State's Government, there has never been a single fatality from the use of Marijuana, as opposed to normal Aspirin, or Tylenol, which are readily available at any store, are the primary cause for many fatalities per year.
That's a bad argument on so many levels. Where do I start
1. Acetaminophen and Aspirin are more much cheaper than weed hence their increased use
2. Are more accessible than weed hence their increased use
3. The fatalities cause from their use are due to overdose. Salt can kill you too. If someone ingests an entire container of Morton Salt, they can die. Does that mean salt is now worse than marijuana too?
4. These drugs have also been confirmed to have saved lives and reduced mortality where there hasn't been a single case where marijuana was proven to do so.
5. Stroke prevention, and reduced mortality from heart attacks are also caused by Aspirin
6. Tylenol has helped reduce fevers in critical situations which can life saving. You do realize that when your body temperatures exceeds a certain amount, it can lead to death.
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Again, more people have died from Alcohol and other OVER THE COUNTER DRUGS than a single person ever dying from Marijuana.
Considering that weed is illegal, what type of studies have been performed on weed to prove that. It's not like you can do some controlled studies :"Hey these 5,000 people were allowed to smoke weed and these 5,000 were not and then were followed over a period of 20 years and their health was tracked."
You don't know how many people have or would have developed lung cancer from chronic marijuana use or neurodegenerative disorders.
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