Some facts about scorpions/spiders/snakes in Arizona. (Tucson: environment, landscaping)

[DML1651]

Originally Posted by LordBalfor

DML, Steve-o -

I have to say that this is a VERY interesting discussion involving 2 folks who really seem to know their stuff - but still have slightly different points of view. REALLY appreciate your posts.

Ken

Thanks.

I've already PM'ed Steve-o regarding his reply to my post. I think he is a very sharp individual, but I don't happen to agree with all of his positions regarding the bark scorpion.

Let's leave it up it to the pro's. If in doubt about what I posted regarding the sting of the bark scorpion, why not call the Phoenix Poison Control Center?

Tel number is (602) 253-3334 and ask them the following question.

"Is it true that any sting by a bark scorpion has the 'potential' to be a fatal sting since people have died as a result of same, but in reality, the odds of this happening, with competent medical care are so astronomically low that generally speaking, a bark scorpion sting, for nearly every person, simply isn't considered a life threatening event."

I'm entirely confident the answer you will obtain is "yes".

[DML1651]

Folks, I'm a health care professional, specifically an Emergency Department R.N. (and a former Poison Control Specialist). I am NOT, however, a physician. Just wanted to clear up any misperception.

[DML1651]

Originally Posted by Gretchen B

So . . . back to scorpions.
And now a quick question for DML1651 , if I'm allergic to spider bites (at least I think that's what I'm reacting to - bite spreads out to about golf ball size with redness and swelling), would I be at greater risk if I get stung by a scorpion or bit by a black widow? (I'm not going to worry about tarantulas since I hardly ever see those.) Is scorpion venom similar to a spider bite?

There is very little RELIABLE reason/evidence to believe in an allergic (true histamine based) response to a scorpion sting. Most toxicologists will tell you an allergic response (histamine based) reaction to a scorpion sting is very unlikely.

[kdog]

Originally Posted by DML1651

Folks, I'm a health care professional, specifically an Emergency Department R.N. (and a former Poison Control Specialist). I am NOT, however, a physician.

Well, that'll make Steve happy.

[DML1651]

Originally Posted by kdog

Well, that'll make Steve happy.

I'm simply thankful most of my post was agreed with... and I'll leave it at that.

[Steve-o]

Originally Posted by Gretchen B

So . . . back to scorpions. First question for Steve-O. We do have a few up here in Prescott. Most folks will never see one, but I've actually seen 1/2 dozen or so. The kind I see are quite pale, kind of a light tan or cream color. They're not very big - about 2" long. Would these be the bark scorpion or something else?

Do you have a picture of one by any chance, that would be the best way to ID. I could sit here and explain scorpion anatomy to help ID, but it probably wont do you any good. At 2" (tail extended and measured from "mouth" to tip of tail) Id venture theyre bark scorpions, but theres no way to tell except via photo ID. Most scorpions in AZ are pale/tan, to blend in with their xeric environments, so I cant base my ID off that aspect alone. Was the tail (metasoma) thick or really thin? Barks have a really thin tail and very slender pincers (chelae). Another common species in Arizona is the Vaejovis spinigerus, which is completely harmless and they dont get very big either. Google these names and see which they most closely resemble:

Vaejovis paysonensis
Vaejovis spinigerus
Hadrurus arizonensis
Centruroides exilicauda
Smeringurus mesaensis

[Steve-o]

Originally Posted by DML1651

"Is it true that any sting by a bark scorpion has the 'potential' to be a fatal sting since people have died as a result of same, but in reality, the odds of this happening, with competent medical care are so astronomically low that generally speaking, a bark scorpion sting, for nearly every person, simply isn't considered a life threatening event."

I'm entirely confident the answer you will obtain is "yes".

Id agree. A suspected bark scorpion sting should be treated with the utmost care, and a trip to the ER is most definitely in order, regardless of personal health. I recommend calling the AZ poison control center first and describe the symptoms of your sting. Localised pain and redness can be expected right away, with intense burning and shooting pains. Any pallor or uncontrolled tongue and eye movements are signs of serious envenomation and need to be promptly treated.

However, I still stand by my statement that bark scorpions are medically significant and can kill you. Ive seen/heard too many stories being in this hobby for so long to not believe that. Its like the copperhead snake scenario... even though its the "weakest" of NA's venomous snakes, its has still killed and will kill from now until the end of time. Would you not go to the hospital from a copperhead bite just to be safe? I know I would! Never take a bite/sting lightly, its something that you just dont mess around with.

[Steve-o]

Originally Posted by DML1651

Folks, I'm a health care professional, specifically an Emergency Department R.N. (and a former Poison Control Specialist). I am NOT, however, a physician. Just wanted to clear up any misperception.

Here, can you read the 2nd paragraph down and explain what that means? Does it not say that the more venom injected, the quicker respiratory paralysis set in? If thats the case, would I be correct in thinking that several stings would speed up the venoms effect, thus making the situation worse? Im trying to figure this and I figured what better way than to ask a MD?

Centruroides exilicauda Envenomation in Arizona

[ecloebl]

Originally Posted by Boatdrinks

Ditto It's nice to get some factual info from a real professional, conveyed in a non-ridiculing or fear-inducing manner Thanks doc!!!

Also, wanted to add that, in our 4 yrs here, we've not seen a single scorpian, icky spider or snake, and I'm knocking quite loudly on wood right now b/c yall will hear me screaming from a mile away if I walk into my backyard and see a snake lounging there on our patio. When we lived in VA, we saw snakes very frequently and I always find it funny that people think that snakes and various icky varmints are so bad here in AZ. Yes, we have them, but so do most other states.

Ok, going back to my knocking on wood now

We have lived in Tucson for four months and have had about half a dozen scorpions in our house. We moved from Arkansas, where we saw one every few months.

[ecloebl]

Originally Posted by kdog

I have no doubt at all about that, Steve. I was indeed referring to was the OP, DML1651.

We've been in AZ for a year now, and I've yet to see a scorpion. We haven't seen any snakes either, although I'm thinking of going looking for them. We're close to Rattlesnake Wash, and I hear that's where they hang out (go figure).

Now what we do have is tarantulas. Never had them in the house, but there are a couple that we see on occasion in the backyard. Very cool and fun to observe.
Last night we were in the pool, and some kind of giant flies that looked almost exactly like hummingbirds were buzzing us. They may have been humming birds, but I couldn't see the narrow snouts. Plus, they were a bit smaller than hummers. But their movements were the same. They'd dip down and take sips from the water and split. They'd also buzz our heads curiously, and that was pretty freaky. I'd love to know what they were. Any thoughts?

Bats? We see them every night.