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Old 10-20-2006, 11:55 PM
 
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
126 posts, read 500,127 times
Reputation: 90

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Lets get some real insight on this topic. I am interested to see what you Arizonans (negative or positive ones, respectively) have to say on the subject, and what is being done to correct it.

Heres mine:

This is a rampant problem thru out the southwest. I feel for them in the fact that they are looking for a better life, and trying to feed their families back home in Mexico. What I seriously despise about this whole situation is the fact that these people sneak themselves across the border, bring with them drugs, crime, and no respect for the United States. Dont get me wrong here, some are genuine good hard working people, just looking for work.

What also irritates me is the fact that some here in the US actually have sympathy for these people. They are here illegally for gods sake, and are costing millions of dollars to deport or clean up the various messes they make.

If they come into the US as any other prospective citizen would, and go thru the proper channels to gain their US citizenship, that is perfectly fine. More power, best of luck.

My opinion is, penalty for illegally entering this country should be very steep. Any US company that employs these people should also be severly penalized. It saddens me that neither the White House, nor the state of AZ is doing anything that is really effective to help these people, and correct this problem.
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Old 10-21-2006, 10:06 AM
 
Location: Colorado
10,017 posts, read 17,537,647 times
Reputation: 2170
I feel the same as you, what gets me even more is the fact that they( illegals), without paying taxes, send the money home to Mexico, I believe the estimate is at 1.4 Billion dollars, probably more, I figure if you are not goingto pay your taxes, then that money should remain here. No wonder mexico has issues with us not letting them come here illegally, we Americans support their economy, we can barely support our own. And for gods sake learn english!!
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Old 10-21-2006, 09:55 PM
 
Location: So. Dak.
13,495 posts, read 35,115,825 times
Reputation: 15171
I understand that the highest GNP for Mexico is money that is sent back to them from the U.S. It's sad that we aren't caring for our own citizens and senior citizens are deciding between groceries and meds, yet we furnish illegals with all types of perks.
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Old 10-21-2006, 10:55 PM
 
84 posts, read 131,068 times
Reputation: 54
Default Just my short and concise note on illegal immigration

This is what I have sent my Congressmen including J.D. Hayworth.


Immigration has been one of the worst issues that has ever hit this Country for its divisiveness.
I have listened to Hispanic activists and leaders on TV and radio. It seems they can only last for about ten minutes without throwing the racism card out, that it is not that it’s illegal, it is the color of their skin and racism. Nothing could be more preposterous and untrue.
Although it may be undeniable that illegals help businesses, it is also undeniable that illegal aliens are an increased source of crime and deficits in city budgets for services.
What part of illegal can anyone not understand as a clear violation of the law of the land?
Never have I heard such derogatory talk towards America as the illegal movement has brought in insults to our Country and the arrogance that they will do what they want in defiance of our laws as if they mean nothing.
I believe strongly and predict that ten years from now, when there are forty million illegals, John Mc Cain and others(whomever is around), will say "Yes, we haven't kept control of our borders but we will address the issue.
To me, all of the so called reasons for people justifying illegals are just a smokescreen for their greed and corruption.
Is Mexico liberal with Americans as far as their laws or do they make us go by the book? That’s right! Meixico is brutal with illegals in their Country. They don’t tolerate people breaking their laws.

There have been people who go to any lengths to justify people coming here illegally, such as picking apart the immigrants of the past to find discrepancies in the ways they came here to make illegals seem legitimate now as compared to immigrants of the past. They are not legitimate as compared to immigrants of times past.
Now I am reading that Social Security is being propped up by illegals who get bogus social security cards and then the employers pay in to the system and the employees pay in to the system. I read where Social Security doesn’t seem to care where the money comes from. Now would this be the reason there are efforts made to pay social security to illegals? Another thorn in my side is illegals are condoned by otherwise law abiding people. You have these sanctuaries like San Francisco and Mayor Giulliano that look the other way? SHAMEFUL!

Here is another thing that sounds real strange to me. The AFL-CIO is going to be backing up the illegals as far as more wages and better working conditions. HUH???? Why not have better working conditions and more pay for Americans and maybe Americans will do these jobs if there was a chance fulfilling the American Dream as a United States Citizen!! I’ll pay higher prices. It seems to me it would work out economically since Americans are paying higher costs for the problems illegals cause driving without insurance, hospital costs, etc. me.

Did I mention that maybe there should be a moratorium on immigration, legal or illegal? If not, why not? No one denies we need a work force in agriculture and other things or we may be outsourcing food and things. What we don’t need is the takeover of our Country and businesses defying our laws blatantly and with no concern for the laws of the land and total uncontrolled immigration without anyone in Congress addressing it.
As far as this land being Mexico’s land, GET OVER IT! As Mark Twain once said: "There is not one square foot of this land that wasn't taken at one time or another by someone. Move up to the present and
get over the past.

Finally:

After reading editorials and opinions in the Mesa Tribune and other newspapers, and listening to everyone talk about it, it has become nauseatingly obvious that Hispanic activists, church leaders who aid and abet illegals, many politicians and anyone else that has a vested interest in the illegals for their benefit, really have no desire whatsoever to solve the problem. Their rhetoric about how sincere they are is so redundant and hypocritical it defies logic. I have yet to hear one proposal by anyone sincerely interested in dealing with illegal immigration that isn't blasted to the core. Stupid, shameful, won't work, too expensive, unfair, etc. When are people going to realize that behind these people's rhetoric of claiming to want to solve the problem are their own ulterior motives? These include, but are not limited to, their attitude that they could give a rat's behind about our laws, our sovereignty, and what the American citizens would want. When is the news media going to wake up and realize that there is never going to be a solution as long as many people keep fighting any suggestion every step of the way and never have any of their own, other than those which openly defy the laws and sovereignty of the United States?
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Old 10-22-2006, 11:53 AM
 
2,255 posts, read 5,061,397 times
Reputation: 788
Default Effects on our Clean State of Arizona

Hi Guys

My son and I last went to Sedona about 3 years ago and drove up to Slide Rock for some fun in the sun so to speak. We got up there and as usual it was a challenge to park. We made it down to the Slide and Pool areas and about 80% were hispanic. No problem there , but the the place was almost completely trashed with filth. There were Beer Bottles and Cans and hundreds of Rolled up Baby Pampers , Huggies , etc, in the bushes.

I asked the Ranger about this and he said there was nothing they could do but a few times a week go out and pick up the trash and try to keep it clean even if the people don't . Many citizens up there volunteer as well to pick up the trash and filth and they were as disgusted as I was. They said when they try to point these things out to these people , they are met with biligerence and filthy language. In fact by afternoon there were several Rangers with trash bags up above the slide and down below the bridge even picking up garbage. Junk was even in the water and my son and I were handing it to them. Needless to say we were pretty disappointed.

The problem is that these folks come from Third world Toilet Countries where this is common. Not just Mexico , but any country south of there and they bring that part of their culture with them. I have absolutely no problem with as many legal hard workers as needed. Later if they want to become citizens , that's fine if they do it properly. I grew up around Mexican Americans and other Native hispanics and I miss alot about the good part of the culture. I'm over here in Sweden now and really miss their friendliness and hospitality. But these new generations coming across illegally have brought with them the negative aspects of their countries with them.

Take a look at any neighborhoods that the illegals have taken over and you'll see how even their own enviorenment is now run down. This has nothing to do with being poor and having no opportunities. It also has nothing to do with race. It's just Culture. Nobody forces anybody to be filthy and live like a pig. These folks have a golden opportunity to change for the better in so many ways and not just economically , but also in safe and clean neighborhoods and not like what they left behind.

Before I left the USA there were so many of the groups in the news like MECHA who advocate the Southwest being given back to Mexico. I would run across so many waving their Mexican Flags and yelling Viva Mexico. I would ask them if they really liked living here and do they really want Mexico to take control and run these Southwestern States ?? Do they want run down filthy discusting neighborhoods with Drug Lords in charge, No Jobs , Corrupt Police force and Government ?? The answer was always , 'This use to be Mexico's land. I could never get thru.

My point is if something serious isn't done soon , then Mexico won't have to get it back. It will just become Mexico and that's sad because that would be the very thing that they were wanting to leave behind. Education and good leadership are what is needed and I just don't think that you'll ever get either when all politicians are concerned with is Votes. They never see what most of us see away from their own Pristine nieghborhoods and make believe culture. Hopefully many will wake up before it's too late.

Cheers , Blue
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Old 10-22-2006, 12:10 PM
 
84 posts, read 131,068 times
Reputation: 54
Default Good post Blue.

I wasn't able to address those things because I had ten thousand words of what I sent my Congressmen(Hispanic ones too) and I had to cut out a bunch here to post.
You are exactly right about the trash. There is trash everywhere they gather. Outside the check cashing places I have seen are nasty. People need to wake up, as you said, because they are coming from a third world toilet country, and that is what happens. I was going down Main Street in Mesa and I thought a fire was up ahead. It was a Hispanic chicken place billowing out big wafts of smoke from their vents. I had never seen it to that degree before. I also don't appreciate the all night parties and their boom boom bass music. Now before some get started saying that is a generational thing, let me remind you that the big, big majority of it is is Hispanic. To put it bluntly I really don't think they know any better. BTW, stating facts about any group of people is NOT racism or bigotry. I have my faults too. I just don't have these kinds of trashy behavior.
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Old 10-22-2006, 12:29 PM
 
2,301 posts, read 2,066,932 times
Reputation: 317
Has anyone noticed how pro-illegal that broken down corrupted rag of a newpaper we have is?
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Old 10-22-2006, 01:45 PM
 
84 posts, read 131,068 times
Reputation: 54
Default You guessed it Alm.

Wow Alm. You have noticed that too. To me it is blatantly obvious and I have never seen anything like it. Maybe they have illegals delivering their papers. Wouldn't surprise me.
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Old 10-22-2006, 02:00 PM
 
Location: Scottsdale, AZ
126 posts, read 500,127 times
Reputation: 90
Artice on the subject from todays Republic:


Governor candidates differ on border solutions

Matthew Benson
The Arizona Republic
Oct. 22, 2006 12:00 AM

Three candidates for governor. Three wildly different plans to address illegal immigration.

There's Len Munsil, the GOP challenger with an ambitious plan to spend $515 million on border security during his first term. He'd deploy hundreds of additional Arizona National Guard soldiers to the border, form a new Arizona Border Patrol and build a radar fence running the state's length with Mexico.

Democratic Gov. Janet Napolitano takes a more understated approach. She has gone after cross-border trafficking in humans and stolen vehicles and plans additional initiatives to expand state law enforcement and increase cooperation between border states and Mexico. More than anything, though, Napolitano has always stressed that border enforcement remains a federal responsibility to be supported by federal dollars.
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While Munsil has a half-billion-dollar plan and Napolitano has an ongoing strategy, Libertarian Barry Hess has a deadline: 60 days. That's how long he'd give Congress, once sworn in early next year, to put forth an immigration package. If it failed, he'd assert state sovereignty.

"When they have so abdicated their responsibility on this issue, we have the right to self-help," Hess said. "This is a matter of self-preservation at this point."

Perhaps no issue looms larger in the Nov. 7 race for governor than illegal immigration. It's the kind of issue, especially in a border state, that can turn votes and conventional wisdom on its head.

But their diverging plans reflect candidates who view the border in different ways.

Munsil doesn't believe the state can afford to wait on Congress. In addition to the half-billion dollars in state resources he'd devote to the problem, Munsil has pledged to sign legislation reclassifying all undocumented immigrants in Arizona as trespassers and going after the employers who knowingly hire them.

Munsil calls it "the strongest approach taken by any state" and said, "The goal is to cut (the number of illegal border crossings) from 5,000 a day to a trickle."

Napolitano, meanwhile, touts her efforts to improve Arizona's ports of entry and intercept funding for human smugglers. She called this year for sanctions to penalize businesses that hire undocumented workers but vetoed a bill she said would have provided amnesty to such employers.

She notes that after she pressured the federal government to pay for more National Guard troops at the border, President Bush agreed to send troops there at federal expense. But critics have questioned whether enough soldiers have been deployed to make a difference.

In a second term, she hopes to expand the Guard's drug interdiction program and improve international communication between law enforcement along the entire Arizona-Mexico border. But, when it comes to securing the border, she believes in leaving the heaviest lifting to the federal government.

"We should not let Congress off the hook," she urged late last month. "They need to pass comprehensive immigration reform."

Not surprisingly, Munsil and Napolitano have exchanged political fire on the issue.

The governor's campaign says Munsil's immigration proposal outstrips both the state's jurisdiction on such matters as well as its finances. Napolitano spokeswoman Jeanine L'Ecuyer called it "voodoo budgeting" and said that it would amount to a double tax on Arizonans who already pay for federal border enforcement.

Munsil, who plans to simultaneously phase out the state income tax, said his plan would pay for itself with savings from reduced demand for state services.

For this year, he estimated that illegal immigration cost the state $1.3 billion, a figure he attributes to the Federation for American Immigration Reform "and other published reports."

Napolitano has taken criticism of her own on immigration.

Republicans have cast her as obstructionist in light of her vetoes of border bills, and Munsil said, "We have a governor who continues to have no plan to address illegal immigration other than to blame Washington, D.C."

Said Napolitano: "It's not about being tough. It's about being smart and taking real action on the ground."

Three candidates, three border plans. One big decision for voters.
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Old 10-22-2006, 07:19 PM
 
78 posts, read 393,266 times
Reputation: 56
I cannot add much except to agree with 99.9% of what's already been posted.

Come here, work hard, and better your life. But the collective audacity to come here and DEMAND rights and privelages etc just make my blood boil.
I get so ticked off when I hear the sympthathizers and activists talk about where we'd all be without Mexicans doing the 'service' jobs. You know, the busboys, hotel maids, fruit-pickers, etc.

I'd suggest they take a look at the overcrowded jails, classrooms, and hospital emergency rooms to see the other side of that coin. Especially the schools and emergency rooms, where they hardly pay any taxes toward the schools, and never have any insurance, but the hospitals HAVE to treat them. And from what I've seen, they flock there for every little tummyache/hangnail because they KNOW they can't be turned away. Manipulating the system, again.

Oh, and it's not just Arizona. Illegals have infested this country in practically every state. Many other states seem to be overflowing with them, too.
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