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Old 07-01-2017, 11:00 PM
 
Location: Tulsa
1,800 posts, read 804,562 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyh View Post
Foochow?
He was probably referring to Minnanhua.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Min
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Old 07-01-2017, 11:02 PM
 
Location: State of Transition
78,546 posts, read 70,455,727 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoodHombre View Post
There are probably hundreds of hua(local dialect) in China. Maybe he was referring to guanhua, which means "officials language reserved for government officials". Before WWI, most people only spoke their regional dialect, but government officials had to report to the emperor, they had to resort to guanhua. However, guanhua with local influence became the local language for some parts of China. That's why nanjinghua and chongqinghua are at least half intelligible because modern nanjinghua originated from huainan guanhua and modern chongqinghua originated from xinan(southwest) guanhua.
Thank you very much! Very interesting. I'm sure that was it.
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Old 07-01-2017, 11:12 PM
 
Location: Tulsa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clodius et Claudius. View Post
I have heard that Shanghainese is somewhat intelligible with Mandarin, and that it is the closest related Chinese dialect to Mandarin.

However, I speak Mandarin (as a 3rd language, and with an accent) but I can't understand a word of Shanghainese. It might as well be Japanese or Korean. After all, they speak very rapidly, like Japanese or Korean, to the point that the words sound polysyllabic, and certainly much more rapidly than other Chinese dialects foreign to me, e.g. Hokkien.

I have heard that Shanghainese and Japanese have virtually the same pitch-accent, two-tone system, and that Japanese Go-on Kanji reading originated from the region of Wu, which is where Shanghai is. I've also heard that Shanghainese has more polysyllabic words than any other Chinese dialect.

BTW, I speak Cantonese as a 1st language.
Mandarin is closely related with Beijing dialect. In fact, Mandarin was based on Beijing dialect with some minor modifications to comply with the writing system.

Just like Cantonese, Shanghainese isn't quite intelligble with Mandarin.
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Old 07-01-2017, 11:28 PM
 
Location: Tulsa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
Thank you very much! Very interesting. I'm sure that was it.
You are welcome.

The cultural diversity in China is overwhelming, but it's being undermined like anywhere else in the world.

When I visited Shanghai for the first time in the 90s, Shanghainese was the primary language in Shanghai, many people didn't speak much Mandarin.
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Old 07-03-2017, 03:29 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
Sort of related, I don't speak Mandarin but noticed while travelling around China some of the dialects. There was one dialect in Fujian province which sounded very much like Thai or Cambodian to me, I think it's a variant of Min. I also noticed the dialect around Beijing distinct, very rhotic (all 'r's' are pronounced).
Rhotic vowels are not only found in Beijing, but also in most of north China and Sichuan/Chongqing.
Most overseas Chinese are not from north China though (but it is changing).
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Old 07-11-2017, 05:31 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bettafish View Post
Rhotic vowels are not only found in Beijing, but also in most of north China and Sichuan/Chongqing.
Is the reason it exists in Chongqing because of the population migration before/during WWII, or is that unrelated.

I spend most of my time in Henan, and there are a surprising amount of people from Harbin, at least in the city I live in. I don't really understand why, but I have multiple friends whose families were relocated from there. Maybe that also had to do with WWII and Chinese people trying to get away from the war?

My wife grew up in Shanghai (not born there) and speaks some Shanghainese, but I've never heard her speak it. The only time I've been to Shanghai was about 5 years ago when I spoke very little Chinese and couldn't tell the difference anyway. But she tells me, when she first moved to Shanghai, it was quite difficult, because she couldn't understand much. Her native dialect is Zhongyuan Mandarin, which i similar to standard Mandarin.
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Old 07-12-2017, 01:49 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattks View Post
Is the reason it exists in Chongqing because of the population migration before/during WWII, or is that unrelated.

I spend most of my time in Henan, and there are a surprising amount of people from Harbin, at least in the city I live in. I don't really understand why, but I have multiple friends whose families were relocated from there. Maybe that also had to do with WWII and Chinese people trying to get away from the war?

My wife grew up in Shanghai (not born there) and speaks some Shanghainese, but I've never heard her speak it. The only time I've been to Shanghai was about 5 years ago when I spoke very little Chinese and couldn't tell the difference anyway. But she tells me, when she first moved to Shanghai, it was quite difficult, because she couldn't understand much. Her native dialect is Zhongyuan Mandarin, which i similar to standard Mandarin.
The whole Sichuan Basin pretty much has the same dialect, so the feature of Chongqing dialect is not a consequence of WWII migration.

In the 1950s, China moved a lot of factories to inland China. Maybe that's why there are a lot of Harbin people in your town. Is it Luoyang? The Japanese and Russians built industries in the Northeast, and China government moved some of them. There were WWII migrants too, but not really so many people went to Henan. In fact many Henan people moved to Shaanxi in 1942.

Last edited by Bettafish; 07-12-2017 at 02:05 AM..
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Old 12-02-2017, 02:20 AM
 
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Southern Chinese dialects have their origins partially from the Bai Yue people speaking many different languages originally living in the region. Han Chinese from the Yello River region conquered Southern China and intermarried with the local population. The differences in look, height and dialects of diiferent Chinese regions are still obvious today.
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Old 12-03-2017, 07:49 PM
 
Location: HoCo, MD
4,343 posts, read 7,984,165 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JL View Post
Interesting...sounds so different..
heh. Thanks for posting these. This brought back memories. My mom's side of the family is Shanghainese. My mom was born there and their family 'escaped' to Taiwan after WWII. I grew up listening to them an loved that dialect. I remember being at my grandmother house when she would have Mahjong parties with all of their Shanghainese friends.
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Old 12-04-2017, 03:58 AM
 
47 posts, read 26,354 times
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it belong to Wu chinese, which is a indistinct language, not a dialect.
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