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Old 02-06-2019, 01:17 AM
 
1,099 posts, read 1,667,688 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by payutenyodagimas View Post
lack of vision (yes leadership)

lets take the Dutertes or the Pimentels..i cant think of any reason why they could not attract foreign investors in their jurisdictions. they have cheap and abundant land, cheap electricity (before the population exploded, now its not even enough)

instead of crying for Federalism, why not persuade the capitalists in Manila or Asia to invest in their cities?

lack of infra? they have congressmen to lobby for projects. they have IRA too.

but you know what? During the Ramos presidency, when he was promoting the Philippines left and right..i never read that they accompanied him to promote their own cities to investors.

as if Federalism will solve the lack of jobs in their jurisdictions..it is lack of vision..and this is true to all local executives



You can't promote Mindanao to foreign investors now. Because of the Marawi siege, the whole Mindanao is still under Martial Law, and foreigners have a travel advisory not to go to Mindanao. I knew some foreigners who were very scared because they have to visit Mindanao. Although they were finally convinced to go ahead with their plans to go, and realized after the visit that it's really OK to go, there's no way that foreign companies will bring in new investments there now.


Even with that, Davao and Cagayan de Oro are major ports that export containers of bananas, pineapples and other agricultural products. Davao City and Cagayan de Oro City are not poor. They are considered high-income within the Philippines. Unfortunately, many towns that surround them are poor.


The budget for the infrastructure is largely not from the LGU. The national government is responsible for national highways. A small town or city cannot just build something and hope investments will come. The authority to create export processing zones and register companies that can avail of these incentives lie with PEZA. In fact, PEZA-registered companies are exempted from local taxes and they don't need to interact as much with the city government they are located in. So, no, LGUs don't have authority to create export processing zones and don't have much power or incentive to do so.


Cebu is a good place for export-processing zones as it's densely populated, is strategically located with a good harbor, but has poor agricultural output and few natural resources. As good as Cebu's infrastructure now, most are not built with national government funds. Mactan Cebu International Airport is often regarded as an alternative airport to the heavily congested one in Manila. But do you know that the runway was constructed by the Americans before? Terminal 1 (the domestic airport terminal now), the second Mactan bridge and the tunnel that goes to the southern part of Cebu City all have plaques that said they're projects from Japan's financial aid! Which leads us to think, what did the national government pay for?
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Old 02-06-2019, 04:16 AM
 
621 posts, read 381,929 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by payutenyodagimas View Post
i dont know of a federal govt system that distributes its own money to their states/provinces.

pls cite a federal system that does what you are thinking?
Was actually referring to federal states rather than the main fed govt if you will check the statements context.
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Old 02-06-2019, 01:36 PM
 
3,339 posts, read 2,074,964 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoldenTiger View Post
The budget for the infrastructure is largely not from the LGU. The national government is responsible for national highways. A small town or city cannot just build something and hope investments will come. The authority to create export processing zones and register companies that can avail of these incentives lie with PEZA. In fact, PEZA-registered companies are exempted from local taxes and they don't need to interact as much with the city government they are located in. So, no, LGUs don't have authority to create export processing zones and don't have much power or incentive to do so.

they dont have authority but they can build Industrial/Export Zones and ask PEZA to extend the incentives to this Zones.

thats why we have private Zones in Laguna, Tarlac.

so again i say? what is stopping them from doing so? they can ask the Ayalas to build one for them if they dont have the money

you know what? our local politicians know only how to pave roads, build schools, basketball courts, attend fiesta,



i dont think they even pay attention to statistics how many are working in their jurisdictions, how many businesses opened and how many they employ etc.
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Old 02-06-2019, 01:49 PM
 
3,339 posts, read 2,074,964 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoldenTiger View Post
Federal governments don't distribute money back to the states/provinces, but rather leave the states/provinces to collect their own taxes to spend within their own jurisdictions. Like in the USA, each state or even county has different tax systems. Sales taxes are collected and spent locally. VAT in the Philippines are all remitted to the central government.
and how many regions/provinces do you think have the tax base to fund their own operations?

latest estimate says only 3 regions..ok lets be generous..lets say 4, am not sure if thats Cebu or Davao

it all boils down to tax base.

no matter how autonomous a region is, if there is no tax base to get the money..it will remain poor..autonomy wont solve that

if you read their proposals, they just want to create their own legislatures, more representation in the senate but the services being provided by the national govt now will still be provided in a federal set up

bakit nag federal pa kung parehas din lang pala? you only want autonomy or more money but no obligation to take over services being provided by the national govt?
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Old 02-06-2019, 05:25 PM
 
1,099 posts, read 1,667,688 times
Reputation: 966
Quote:
Originally Posted by payutenyodagimas View Post
they dont have authority but they can build Industrial/Export Zones and ask PEZA to extend the incentives to this Zones.

thats why we have private Zones in Laguna, Tarlac.

so again i say? what is stopping them from doing so? they can ask the Ayalas to build one for them if they dont have the money

you know what? our local politicians know only how to pave roads, build schools, basketball courts, attend fiesta,



i dont think they even pay attention to statistics how many are working in their jurisdictions, how many businesses opened and how many they employ etc.

There are many PEZA-accredited buildings in Iloilo City, Bacolod City and Dumaguete City, doing BPO and other services. There's no economies of scale to ship containerized cargo to/from these islands. As of the moment, it costs more to ship a 40' container from Bacolod to either Manila or Cebu, compared to shipping a 40' container from Manila or Cebu to Japan. The additional shipping cost is just ridiculously expensive that labor-intensive factories with lots of imported raw materials are not feasible at all in these places. Mindanao is pretty much blacklisted as an investment location due to the Muslim insurgency, even if it's just in a small part.


There are only six major international ports that make it worthwhile for international shipping lines to maintain regular operations. These are Manila, Subic, Batangas, Cebu, Davao and Cagayan de Oro. From Luzon or Mindanao, you can at least truck the containers to the nearest port. In the Visayas, it costs too much.
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Old 02-06-2019, 05:51 PM
 
1,099 posts, read 1,667,688 times
Reputation: 966
Quote:
Originally Posted by payutenyodagimas View Post
and how many regions/provinces do you think have the tax base to fund their own operations?

latest estimate says only 3 regions..ok lets be generous..lets say 4, am not sure if thats Cebu or Davao

it all boils down to tax base.

no matter how autonomous a region is, if there is no tax base to get the money..it will remain poor..autonomy wont solve that

if you read their proposals, they just want to create their own legislatures, more representation in the senate but the services being provided by the national govt now will still be provided in a federal set up

bakit nag federal pa kung parehas din lang pala? you only want autonomy or more money but no obligation to take over services being provided by the national govt?

In most federal governments, there are still taxes paid to the national government and taxes paid to the states/provinces. Then there are services that are provided by the national government, as well as services provided by states/provinces. There are also federal governments like Canada and Australia, who have more self-governing states/provinces and territories that have less autonomy.


For the record, am not even a proponent of federalism for the Philippines. There are many problems that come from both national and local politicians alike. I am just explaining that the central government is sometimes really not doing enough to help solve or listen to the problems from Visayas and Mindanao. And lots of things that might work in Luzon might not even be applicable to Visayas or Mindanao.



Tax base is irrelevant. Some places might choose to be autonomous or independent if they want to. Like East Timor chose to be independent, even if it is still dirt poor.
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Old 02-06-2019, 06:05 PM
 
621 posts, read 381,929 times
Reputation: 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by payutenyodagimas View Post
and how many regions/provinces do you think have the tax base to fund their own operations?

latest estimate says only 3 regions..ok lets be generous..lets say 4, am not sure if thats Cebu or Davao

it all boils down to tax base.

no matter how autonomous a region is, if there is no tax base to get the money..it will remain poor..autonomy wont solve that

if you read their proposals, they just want to create their own legislatures, more representation in the senate but the services being provided by the national govt now will still be provided in a federal set up

bakit nag federal pa kung parehas din lang pala? you only want autonomy or more money but no obligation to take over services being provided by the national govt?
Well as of the moment, Metro Manila is a region where the amount of money it is getting is more than what its capable of its weight; Central Luzon is one getting that momentum lately though that which is somehow good as it would help decongest the metro.

The other regions wont need much to maintain their operations as they are already receiving low ceiling budget. ARMM wont need a tax base as NCR as the infrastructure can be maintained even with lower budget or tax collection. Same goes through with other regions. The good thing though is that they can allocate funds to their longing and can develop their place in a way they want it to be not just placing their hopes on the national govt.

You wont need so much food to maintain your body when you are already petite or skinny or even malnourished. Hence, a bigger tax base isnt needed when you have little to nothing to maintain at all. It's a false assumption that only bigger regions with higher tax or wealth base can survive in a federal form of government. Idk where you are getting all those assumptions.
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Old 02-06-2019, 07:12 PM
 
Location: Earth
4,509 posts, read 3,092,720 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoldenTiger View Post
In most federal governments, there are still taxes paid to the national government and taxes paid to the states/provinces. Then there are services that are provided by the national government, as well as services provided by states/provinces. There are also federal governments like Canada and Australia, who have more self-governing states/provinces and territories that have less autonomy.


For the record, am not even a proponent of federalism for the Philippines. There are many problems that come from both national and local politicians alike. I am just explaining that the central government is sometimes really not doing enough to help solve or listen to the problems from Visayas and Mindanao. And lots of things that might work in Luzon might not even be applicable to Visayas or Mindanao.



Tax base is irrelevant. Some places might choose to be autonomous or independent if they want to. Like East Timor chose to be independent, even if it is still dirt poor.

East timor isn't full of jihadis that could use their land as a launch pad for jihad. They are pacified by christianity.
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Old 02-07-2019, 03:48 PM
 
3,339 posts, read 2,074,964 times
Reputation: 2367
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoldenTiger View Post
There are many PEZA-accredited buildings in Iloilo City, Bacolod City and Dumaguete City, doing BPO and other services. There's no economies of scale to ship containerized cargo to/from these islands. As of the moment, it costs more to ship a 40' container from Bacolod to either Manila or Cebu, compared to shipping a 40' container from Manila or Cebu to Japan. The additional shipping cost is just ridiculously expensive that labor-intensive factories with lots of imported raw materials are not feasible at all in these places. Mindanao is pretty much blacklisted as an investment location due to the Muslim insurgency, even if it's just in a small part.


There are only six major international ports that make it worthwhile for international shipping lines to maintain regular operations. These are Manila, Subic, Batangas, Cebu, Davao and Cagayan de Oro. From Luzon or Mindanao, you can at least truck the containers to the nearest port. In the Visayas, it costs too much.
so do you still wonder why Manila and its environs gets the lion share of the money?

you said it..the islands are not just cost effective. we cant distribute precious money to where it doesnt generate returns..

its better to develop maybe 4 megalopolis and pour infra in these places than distributing it to the small islands..

and yet they are fighting for state hoods
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Old 02-07-2019, 03:52 PM
 
3,339 posts, read 2,074,964 times
Reputation: 2367
Quote:
Originally Posted by neMarL View Post
Well as of the moment, Metro Manila is a region where the amount of money it is getting is more than what its capable of its weight; Central Luzon is one getting that momentum lately though that which is somehow good as it would help decongest the metro.

The other regions wont need much to maintain their operations as they are already receiving low ceiling budget. ARMM wont need a tax base as NCR as the infrastructure can be maintained even with lower budget or tax collection. Same goes through with other regions. The good thing though is that they can allocate funds to their longing and can develop their place in a way they want it to be not just placing their hopes on the national govt.

You wont need so much food to maintain your body when you are already petite or skinny or even malnourished. Hence, a bigger tax base isnt needed when you have little to nothing to maintain at all. It's a false assumption that only bigger regions with higher tax or wealth base can survive in a federal form of government. Idk where you are getting all those assumptions.
read Golden Tiger post.. he said it correctly..most places especially the islands are not "worth" pouring money into

thats just a painful truth no one is talking about when they are advocating federalism
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