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Old 12-19-2012, 02:33 PM
 
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Between Each Country.

The title easily says the basic purpose of this topic.

When I say “relations between different countries” that also refers to the views/impressions/opinions the people in a certain country have for the other specific countries.

Try to keep the discussion sophisticated with being honest but also saying a lot of positive, optimistic, respectful opinions. The negative, pessimistic opinions can be said too but without too much insults and saying it in a non-personal way.

Any Asian country pairs can be talked about related to the topic. However, I’ll start with three possible country pairs that can be talked about first:

Thailand vs. Vietnam

South Korea vs. Taiwan

China vs. India

Last edited by Thepastpresentandfuture; 12-19-2012 at 02:55 PM..
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Old 12-19-2012, 07:40 PM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
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I don't think Thais and Vietnamese actually think of each other a great deal. I don't think there's any bad blood between the too these days.

Didn't see any Koreans in Taiwan but saw lots of Japanese. I think Japan and Taiwan might be more interesting, how each views the other. Taiwanese seem to have an admiration for Japan and Japanese culture, Japanese food is uber-common and quality sushi is cheap. There is a part of Taipei that seems dominated by Japanese 'clubs', restaurants, where I saw many Japanese people.

China vs India would be interesting, the two giants. People forget they share a border, and India has had disputes with China along with Pakistan. Chinese food is pretty popular in India, although I'm not sure how often each thinks of the other. Thailand is a nation with a lot of influences from both places.
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Old 12-19-2012, 10:50 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
Didn't see any Koreans in Taiwan but saw lots of Japanese. I think Japan and Taiwan might be more interesting, how each views the other. Taiwanese seem to have an admiration for Japan and Japanese culture, Japanese food is uber-common and quality sushi is cheap. There is a part of Taipei that seems dominated by Japanese 'clubs', restaurants, where I saw many Japanese people.

Japan and Taiwan have a more positive rather than negative relationship i'd say, stemming from political, economical and historical links.


Both are democracies who share a common adversary - China. That was partly why Japan unofficially supports Taiwanese independence and at one point of time, even sponsored a visa for former pro-independence Taiwanese president Lee Teng Hui.


And of course, Taiwan benefited immensely from Japanese colonialization as Japan implemented an intensive infrastructure reformation policy that included the construction of railways and communication networks.
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Old 12-24-2012, 02:12 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
I don't think Thais and Vietnamese actually think of each other a great deal. I don't think there's any bad blood between the too these days.

Didn't see any Koreans in Taiwan but saw lots of Japanese. I think Japan and Taiwan might be more interesting, how each views the other. Taiwanese seem to have an admiration for Japan and Japanese culture, Japanese food is uber-common and quality sushi is cheap. There is a part of Taipei that seems dominated by Japanese 'clubs', restaurants, where I saw many Japanese people.

China vs India would be interesting, the two giants. People forget they share a border, and India has had disputes with China along with Pakistan. Chinese food is pretty popular in India, although I'm not sure how often each thinks of the other. Thailand is a nation with a lot of influences from both places.
I thought the Thai and Vietnamese would think of each other more and feel more connected.

I used to think they were almost twin countries, at least for some first impressions, but over time I noticed more they do have a separate character from each other with a noticeable amount of differences and being their own unique nations with Thailand vs. Vietnam.

I guess I am not surprised for the way Taiwanese and Japanese view each other. Some people say the social and economic success of Taiwan partly came from Japan.

However, Taiwan certainly keeps a prominent, separate national identity compared to Japan. I also see the country of Taiwan more of a leader in lifestyle compared to Japan in some ways, and with school education/economy competition not quite as intense in Taiwan.

There is so many intriguing combinations of Asian countries to talk about with this.
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Old 12-24-2012, 02:14 PM
 
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Originally Posted by fellowjoe View Post
Japan and Taiwan have a more positive rather than negative relationship i'd say, stemming from political, economical and historical links.


Both are democracies who share a common adversary - China. That was partly why Japan unofficially supports Taiwanese independence and at one point of time, even sponsored a visa for former pro-independence Taiwanese president Lee Teng Hui.


And of course, Taiwan benefited immensely from Japanese colonialization as Japan implemented an intensive infrastructure reformation policy that included the construction of railways and communication networks.
I remember you said you are from Singapore and recently moved to Vancouver Canada for college! How did that move go? That is such a balanced, invigorating, magnificent move to make.

They are almost like completely different worlds in a lot of ways, but they actually have some surprising similarities with Vancouver vs. Singapore. I bet you encountered some Singaporeans in Vancouver because Vancouver is around 50% Asian and gets people from places such as Hong Kong and Singapore.


For the countries you said in particular, Japan and Taiwan do seem to have mostly positive/optimistic/respectful relations.

However, I say Taiwan has very mixed paradox relations with China. Taiwan did separate from China, but both countries managed to deal with that in a relatively peaceful way. That shows they have a level of respect with each other because for a long time Taiwan was part of China, and does still have some original Chinese influence because of that, but over time did get more of a national Taiwanese character/identity/lifestyle.

A lot of Taiwanese and Chinese people I met seem to love and hate each other’s countries at the same time, but showing some level of respect.
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Old 12-24-2012, 04:15 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Thepastpresentandfuture View Post
I thought the Thai and Vietnamese would think of each other more and feel more connected.

I used to think they were almost twin countries, at least for some first impressions, but over time I noticed more they do have a separate character from each other with a noticeable amount of differences and being their own unique nations with Thailand vs. Vietnam.

I guess I am not surprised for the way Taiwanese and Japanese view each other. Some people say the social and economic success of Taiwan partly came from Japan.

However, Taiwan certainly keeps a prominent, separate national identity compared to Japan. I also see the country of Taiwan more of a leader in lifestyle compared to Japan in some ways, and with school education/economy competition not quite as intense in Taiwan.

There is so many intriguing combinations of Asian countries to talk about with this.
Thailand is very Indian-influenced, Vietnam is very Chinese-influenced. So they're very different, although they seem similar to people who aren't familiar with the region
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Old 12-24-2012, 05:26 PM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thepastpresentandfuture View Post
I thought the Thai and Vietnamese would think of each other more and feel more connected.

I used to think they were almost twin countries, at least for some first impressions, but over time I noticed more they do have a separate character from each other with a noticeable amount of differences and being their own unique nations with Thailand vs. Vietnam.

I guess I am not surprised for the way Taiwanese and Japanese view each other. Some people say the social and economic success of Taiwan partly came from Japan.

However, Taiwan certainly keeps a prominent, separate national identity compared to Japan. I also see the country of Taiwan more of a leader in lifestyle compared to Japan in some ways, and with school education/economy competition not quite as intense in Taiwan.

There is so many intriguing combinations of Asian countries to talk about with this.
Have you heard of the 'Indosphere' and the 'Sinosphere'? Apparently most of SE Asia is part of the 'Indosphere' while Vietnam is part of the 'Sinosphere', largely due to historical Indianized kingdoms in SE Asia. However, over the last 1,000 years in particular I'd say Sinitic influence in South-East Asia has been the more prominent.

I think Laos is Thailand's 'twin'. Much of Northeastern Thailand, Isaan province, was part of the Lao homeland and is culturally Lao. The peoples have a similar origin in Southern China and speak Tai-Kadai languages. They are very culturally similar. Khmer is also closer to Thailand, they share a similar script (derived from an Indic script), even though Khmer is an Austro-Asiatic language closer to Vietnamese. Culturally, however, Khmers/Cambodia seem a lot closer to Thailand than Vietnam. Their architecture is more of the Thai style, as is their food, and they practice Theravada rather than Mahayana Buddhism.

1,000 years of Chinese rule and subsequent influence has left a deep imprint on Vietnam. From Confucian-Daoist values and beliefs, the food and formerly the script (Vietnam used to use Chinese characters for their language like Japan). Vietnam itself feels more like China, partly because of the socialism, a mixture of austere socialism and hero worship of Ho Chi Minh, and the chaos of a developing nation and bustling economy.
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Old 12-28-2012, 07:06 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
Have you heard of the 'Indosphere' and the 'Sinosphere'? Apparently most of SE Asia is part of the 'Indosphere' while Vietnam is part of the 'Sinosphere', largely due to historical Indianized kingdoms in SE Asia. However, over the last 1,000 years in particular I'd say Sinitic influence in South-East Asia has been the more prominent.

I think Laos is Thailand's 'twin'. Much of Northeastern Thailand, Isaan province, was part of the Lao homeland and is culturally Lao. The peoples have a similar origin in Southern China and speak Tai-Kadai languages. They are very culturally similar. Khmer is also closer to Thailand, they share a similar script (derived from an Indic script), even though Khmer is an Austro-Asiatic language closer to Vietnamese. Culturally, however, Khmers/Cambodia seem a lot closer to Thailand than Vietnam. Their architecture is more of the Thai style, as is their food, and they practice Theravada rather than Mahayana Buddhism.

1,000 years of Chinese rule and subsequent influence has left a deep imprint on Vietnam. From Confucian-Daoist values and beliefs, the food and formerly the script (Vietnam used to use Chinese characters for their language like Japan). Vietnam itself feels more like China, partly because of the socialism, a mixture of austere socialism and hero worship of Ho Chi Minh, and the chaos of a developing nation and bustling economy.
I am actually not that familiar with the Indosphere and Sinosphere terms and what they specifically indicate.

Most of Southeast Asia established a prominent, unique cultural character and identity separate from China and India, so I wouldn’t easily categorize Southeast Asia with those 2 countries.

That is true only for the most Northeastern parts of Thailand border regions with having that connection with Laos. Most of Thailand is wealthier/higher income with money, more vibrant, offering more variety in entertainment options, has more cosmopolitan diversity, a higher amount of tourists, more impressive to people from other countries, so Thailand is overall not Laos in plenty of ways.

I bet some Thai people might view Cambodia and Laos a bit condescendingly, and maybe even feeling some superiority compared to them.

Vietnam does appear more similar to China compared to Thailand but I wouldn’t say Thailand is more similar to India.
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Old 12-28-2012, 07:51 PM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
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Originally Posted by Thepastpresentandfuture View Post
I am actually not that familiar with the Indosphere and Sinosphere terms and what they specifically indicate.

Most of Southeast Asia established a prominent, unique cultural character and identity separate from China and India, so I wouldn’t easily categorize Southeast Asia with those 2 countries.

That is true only for the most Northeastern parts of Thailand border regions with having that connection with Laos. Most of Thailand is wealthier/higher income with money, more vibrant, offering more variety in entertainment options, has more cosmopolitan diversity, a higher amount of tourists, more impressive to people from other countries, so Thailand is overall not Laos in plenty of ways.

I bet some Thai people might view Cambodia and Laos a bit condescendingly, and maybe even feeling some superiority compared to them.

Vietnam does appear more similar to China compared to Thailand but I wouldn’t say Thailand is more similar to India.
In terms of development and quality of life, sure, Thailand is more developed than Laos and Cambodia. Thailand modernised surprisingly early in Bangkok, being independent the King had good relations with the West. Laos and Cambodia were under the French, who didn't really develop those countries as much as the British did India. Fundamentally, the Thais are very similar to the Lao and some of the tribes of Laos.

Most of the Indian influence in Thailand is old. Things like loanwords, the script, some of the architecture, names.etc. A tourist would see more similarities with greater East Asia.
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Old 12-30-2012, 09:47 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
In terms of development and quality of life, sure, Thailand is more developed than Laos and Cambodia. Thailand modernised surprisingly early in Bangkok, being independent the King had good relations with the West. Laos and Cambodia were under the French, who didn't really develop those countries as much as the British did India. Fundamentally, the Thais are very similar to the Lao and some of the tribes of Laos.

Most of the Indian influence in Thailand is old. Things like loanwords, the script, some of the architecture, names.etc. A tourist would see more similarities with greater East Asia.
That is true about Thailand vs. Cambodia/Laos, but those 2 other countries offer a vibrant unique experience too, and some people might even prefer them compared to Thailand.

I easily prefer Thailand, but Cambodia and Laos are also nice for visiting.

Wow, I actually forget that Cambodia, Laos, and Vietnam had historical French influence and connections, but in recent times that influence is minimal.

Some people don’t realize France probably has almost as much Asian immigration/connections as UK/England. They seem to be some of the most Asian friendly countries in Europe.

Most of the time, I don’t use the “West” term and Asia in reality never needed influence from Europe to become wealthier, more modern, progressive, etc. Most areas of Asia can easily achieve that without help from Europe, or North America.
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