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Old 04-14-2015, 06:52 AM
 
2 posts, read 1,300 times
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There were an exodus of people and capital from HK, both local and foreign, after UK agreed to hand over HK to China in 1984 and after the Tiananmen Sqaure crackdown on protestors in Beijing in 1989.

However, HK's economy continued to grow in the 1990s until the Asian financial crisis of 1997, which happened shortly after the handover to China.

A lot of money have returned to HK this century, with new money from Mainland China. Westerners have became poorer like the depreciation of the Euro, Rich Mainland Chinese now replaces Westerners as the major investors and shoppers.
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Originally Posted by tigerbalm1985 View Post
Hhhm, I think a lot of westerners placed a lot of money in HK and macau; still, I wonder how it would turn out in the long run.
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Old 04-14-2015, 07:01 AM
 
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The Chinese love gambling.Mahjong gambling is a favourite past time for many Chinese people. Chinese Singaporean also love gambling including horse racing. Mainland Chinese are high-rollers in Macau's and other cities' casinos.

HK's financial, property markets and smartphones trading are also full of "investors", increasingly from Mainland China.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tigerbalm1985 View Post
I always think of Hong Kong and Horse Racing as something that goes together.

I am not sure how many Americans are in this thread, but here are some figures to consider, for Hong Kong has a population of 7 million, which barely makes a splash in the US population size:

1) In 2014, the Hong Kong Jockey Club's total turnover was $13.4 billion, much of it coming from the betting made by Hong Kongers, out of a population of 7 million, compare that to the NFL's total turnover.

2) During the 2014 Chinese New year, 92,000 packed the Sha Tin Racecourse, compared to the 72,000 that packed the US's 72,000 for Superbowl 2015.

Monaco and Zurich are both not relevant. Both are not on the same level as London and Paris, or Shanghai and Beijing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 415_s2k View Post
HK is also more concisely international than Monaco or Zurich, which are much smaller in size and scale. Monaco is little more than a playground for the super rich and is really not a very dynamic place. Zurich is a fairly sleepy, small city in the grand scheme of things. Not that these are bad things, and of course, the people there like them for this reason.

The elites in these cities spend much of their time cavorting around the rest of Europe for cultural events and young people will make extended trips to Paris, London, Ibiza, Berlin, etc for nightlife. In HK, all these amenities are in the city already. You can hop in your Ferrari and go to see your favorite performers rather than getting on your private jet.
Both Toronto and Vancouver are not as vibrant as HK. Only those HK people who like a more quiet life enjoy living in Canada, and most of them do not like the cold weather. Around half of those HK people who lived or studied in Canada have left for China or HK as they did not quite like living in Canada. UK weather is similarly bad for HK people. UK did not give full British citizenship to HK people because the HK population was too much and few of them are really good in English. HK is not third world, there is no reason for them to leave HK forever for a first world country.
Quote:
Originally Posted by strad View Post
I like Hong Kong. I like Cantonese. I like Vancouver too.

Last edited by whartbip; 04-14-2015 at 07:23 AM..
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Old 04-14-2015, 08:19 AM
 
Location: New York, NY
46 posts, read 26,561 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 415_s2k View Post
you've also made it very well known that you despise HK for not pledging its allegiance to PRC policies and social mores and have expressed your dislike of Cantonese culture, so I think that your opinions are more rooted in being a young, nationaliatic overseas Chinese whose primary exposure to mainland China is the wealthier and more modern/international element of Shanghai.

If HK had joined the PRC during the revolution, but somehow retained all that it has now in economy and culture, I have no doubt you would hold it up as a paradigm of Chinese superiority.


There you go again...
Well said, repped!
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Old 04-14-2015, 08:58 AM
 
10,847 posts, read 11,265,341 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 415_s2k View Post
you've also made it very well known that you despise HK for not pledging its allegiance to PRC policies and social mores and have expressed your dislike of Cantonese culture, so I think that your opinions are more rooted in being a young, nationaliatic overseas Chinese whose primary exposure to mainland China is the wealthier and more modern/international element of Shanghai.

If HK had joined the PRC during the revolution, but somehow retained all that it has now in economy and culture, I have no doubt you would hold it up as a paradigm of Chinese superiority.
You had me all figured out, haven't you?

Last time I check Shanghai is still three times the size of Hong Kong. All this HK vs China talk is meaningless, it is like you don't compare Toronto to the entire United States. And if people can talk based on their primarily HK-only exposure, I don't see why I can't talk based on my knowledge of Shanghai? It is not like HK is its own country like Singapore. It never was and never will be.

I dislike HK because it is now trying desperately to be someone non-Chinese, to the extent that they don't want Chinese shoppers, Chinese tourists when countries like the UK, Canada, Greece, Korea are doing all they can to woo Chinese visitors, to the extent someone claims to be living in British HK, how pathetic! and this nostalgic allegiance to the former colonizer is what sickens me (similar to many Taiwanese trying to be more Japanese), not the fact that it doesn't pledge allegiance to the PRC (I don't even). You want to be British again? Too bad that will never happen and blame your parents for not being white and pale. HK is China's experiment, yet some people all of sudden thought they are so superior to everyone else. You know what, the experiment is over, and whatever advantage HK has over cities like Shanghai, it will vanish faster than they think. Ask anyone in Shanghai, who the hell gives a damn about Hong Kong any more except luxury products are cheaper?
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Old 04-14-2015, 10:44 AM
 
6,726 posts, read 6,607,688 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
You had me all figured out, haven't you?

Last time I check Shanghai is still three times the size of Hong Kong. All this HK vs China talk is meaningless, it is like you don't compare Toronto to the entire United States. And if people can talk based on their primarily HK-only exposure, I don't see why I can't talk based on my knowledge of Shanghai? It is not like HK is its own country like Singapore. It never was and never will be.

I dislike HK because it is now trying desperately to be someone non-Chinese, to the extent that they don't want Chinese shoppers, Chinese tourists when countries like the UK, Canada, Greece, Korea are doing all they can to woo Chinese visitors, to the extent someone claims to be living in British HK, how pathetic! and this nostalgic allegiance to the former colonizer is what sickens me (similar to many Taiwanese trying to be more Japanese), not the fact that it doesn't pledge allegiance to the PRC (I don't even). You want to be British again? Too bad that will never happen and blame your parents for not being white and pale. HK is China's experiment, yet some people all of sudden thought they are so superior to everyone else. You know what, the experiment is over, and whatever advantage HK has over cities like Shanghai, it will vanish faster than they think. Ask anyone in Shanghai, who the hell gives a damn about Hong Kong any more except luxury products are cheaper?
Most of the anti-China HKers are young people in their early 20s. It is an age with a lot of hormones but not enough ways to release their anxiety. Also it is an age of arrogance.
They may change when they get older. HKers younger than them may be different too.
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Old 04-14-2015, 07:14 PM
 
Location: Singapore
653 posts, read 540,412 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whartbip View Post
There were an exodus of people and capital from HK, both local and foreign, after UK agreed to hand over HK to China in 1984 and after the Tiananmen Sqaure crackdown on protestors in Beijing in 1989.

However, HK's economy continued to grow in the 1990s until the Asian financial crisis of 1997, which happened shortly after the handover to China.

A lot of money have returned to HK this century, with new money from Mainland China. Westerners have became poorer like the depreciation of the Euro, Rich Mainland Chinese now replaces Westerners as the major investors and shoppers.
Is Hong Kong really a safe tax haven then? How does putting money in Hong Kong as a location, say, compares to a location like Switzerland and such?
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Old 04-14-2015, 07:20 PM
 
501 posts, read 461,912 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tigerbalm1985 View Post
Is Hong Kong really a safe tax haven then? How does putting money in Hong Kong as a location, say, compares to a location like Switzerland and such?
Hong Kong is a good place to put money because they do not tax interest and capital gains and because the HK dollar has a fixed exchange rate against the U.S. dollar. For actively trying to hide money, then Switzerland might be better because of their stronger privacy laws.
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Old 04-14-2015, 07:38 PM
 
Location: Singapore
653 posts, read 540,412 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by strad View Post
Hong Kong is a good place to put money because they do not tax interest and capital gains and because the HK dollar has a fixed exchange rate against the U.S. dollar. For actively trying to hide money, then Switzerland might be better because of their stronger privacy laws.
That is very interesting; I was once at a finance conference and overheard a conversation next to my table at the dining area that while many wealth mainland Chinese move their money to Hong Kong and Singapore, but where possible, the truly ultra-wealthy mainland Chinese would move their wealth to places like Switzerland and Monaco.

That is very interesting, because I keep hearing of Chinese whom wish to move to the US, UK, and Canada, and transferring their wealth along as well. Then there are also others including like St Kitts and Nevis and the British Virgin islands.

Aren't the mainland Chinese worried that their money are not safe in locations like St Kitts and the British Virgin islands? What happens if the bank collapses and such?
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Old 04-14-2015, 10:54 PM
 
6,726 posts, read 6,607,688 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tigerbalm1985 View Post
That is very interesting; I was once at a finance conference and overheard a conversation next to my table at the dining area that while many wealth mainland Chinese move their money to Hong Kong and Singapore, but where possible, the truly ultra-wealthy mainland Chinese would move their wealth to places like Switzerland and Monaco.

That is very interesting, because I keep hearing of Chinese whom wish to move to the US, UK, and Canada, and transferring their wealth along as well. Then there are also others including like St Kitts and Nevis and the British Virgin islands.

Aren't the mainland Chinese worried that their money are not safe in locations like St Kitts and the British Virgin islands? What happens if the bank collapses and such?
Their money is everywhere, not in a single basket.
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Old 04-15-2015, 02:04 AM
 
Location: Guangzhou, China
9,779 posts, read 13,359,093 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
You had me all figured out, haven't you?
I know what you say here...

Quote:
Last time I check Shanghai is still three times the size of Hong Kong.
Point being? Guangzhou has five million more people than HK, so does Rio de Janeiro. Does that mean that suddenly mean that these cities have more amenities ans global importance and importance than HK?

Quote:
All this HK vs China talk is meaningless, it is like you don't compare Toronto to the entire United States.
you can compare anything to anything really, and I Dobt see many people comparing HK to China, so much as I see them discussing HK and the virtues and perks it may offer for fiscal freedom. If Toronto was a city-state whose laws were different from those of the rest of its parent country, I imagine similar conversations would take place and that'd be fine all the same.

Quote:
And if people can talk based on their primarily HK-only exposure, I don't see why I can't talk based on my knowledge of Shanghai?
I think people are primarily speaking based off their knowledge of multiple places... I'm speaking from my knowledge and time in HK, Shanghai, Guangzhou, LA, NYC, Boston, SF, London... you're just sharing your prejudiced opinions about HK, which are inaccurate at best and absurd at worst, all of which are fairly emotional.

Quote:
It is not like HK is its own country like Singapore. It never was and never will be.
Which of course tickles you pink, and yet, here HK is on the global stage, mentioned in the same breath as other global cities.

I dislike HK because it is now trying desperately to be someone non-Chinese, to the extent that they don't want Chinese shoppers, Chinese tourists when countries like the UK, Canada, Greece, Korea are doing all they can to woo Chinese visitors, to the extent someone claims to be living in British HK, how pathetic! and this nostalgic allegiance to the former colonizer is what sickens me (similar to many Taiwanese trying to be more Japanese), not the fact that it doesn't pledge allegiance to the PRC (I don't even). You want to be British again? Too bad that will never happen and blame your parents for not being white and pale. HK is China's experiment, yet some people all of sudden thought they are so superior to everyone else. You know what, the experiment is over, and whatever advantage HK has over cities like Shanghai, it will vanish faster than they think. [/quote]
Thank you for proving my point. you don't dislike HK for what it is as a global megacity, you dislike it because of your perceptions about its people and its culture... so hownor why should anyone listen to your angsty growlings over its irrelevance? Wealthy mainlanders sure aren't...

Quote:
Ask anyone in Shanghai, who the hell gives a damn about Hong Kong any more except luxury products are cheaper?
Its a popular destination for mainlanders, including Shanghainese, for shopping, nightlife, cultural events, dining... oh, and international banking and business!! These peoples' opinion of the place is borne of reality and not some cartoonish, frustrated nationalism.
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