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Old 02-19-2013, 08:01 AM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,683 posts, read 45,455,894 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyh View Post
The fact that the Chinese immigrants came much later to Singapore (and bringing with them a strong Chinese culture, traditions, and beliefs that are hard to forgo, unlike the noticeably weaker indigenous cultures which can suffer at the face of foreign cultural imperialism), and the fact that British colonization came much later to the city state compared to 4 centuries of Hispanicization of the Filipino people and culture certainly provide extra weight to the total Europeanization of the people. The Spanish influence on Filipinos permeates in almost every aspect of traditional life. And yes, even by 'traditional', Filipinos are Hispanic at the core, what more about the modern ones.

I wouldn't say Malays and Indonesians are vivacious as a whole. Friendly yes, but most are very shy, more so with their Islamic roots which generally frown on Western values and the unrestricted mixing of sexes, no Asian race can match the level of vivacity of the Christian, Hispanic Filipino peoples and their acceptance of Western culture and values. Balinese are only a tiny 3 million out of 240 million Indonesians, so they are the exception more than the norm. Even so, traditional Balinese culture is definitively Asian.

You can have an English name yet be culturally and socially Asian, like many Taiwanese and mainland Chinese who give themselves English names yet remain very Chinese. Also, do note that English-speaking Singaporeans are only a quarter of the Singaporean populace, and the Christians are only 1/5 of the population. These figures are certainly nowhere representative of the majority of the Singaporeans. But when 91% of Filipinos are Christian, and almost all of them are Hispanicized, you don't need to guess which one is more European/Western!
Yes maybe you have a point there, most of the Singaporean population wasn't that Westernised until after 1963. I'm not sure how pervasive the Spanish influence was in the Philippines outside Manila.etc though. I haven't been and don't know too many Filipinos so I can't say for sure, it's subjective. It'd be close though.

Many of the Singaporeans were given their names by their parents, which is different to someone giving themselves an English name. Some of the wealthy Chinese and Eurasian and the odd few British Singaporean seem almost like British people abroad in the way they speak, behave. It's not as common now but a lot of them used to ape 'received pronunciation', play polo and that sort of thing. It's the same in India.

Yes Indonesian women do seem sort of shy, come to think of it. So you find Filipino women a lot more extroverted?

 
Old 02-19-2013, 08:18 AM
kyh
 
Location: Malaysia & Singapore
383 posts, read 1,063,629 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
Yes maybe you have a point there, most of the Singaporean population wasn't that Westernised until after 1963. I'm not sure how pervasive the Spanish influence was in the Philippines outside Manila.etc though. I haven't been and don't know too many Filipinos so I can't say for sure, it's subjective. It'd be close though.

Many of the Singaporeans were given their names by their parents, which is different to someone giving themselves an English name. Some of the wealthy Chinese and Eurasian and the odd few British Singaporean seem almost like British people abroad in the way they speak, behave. It's not as common now but a lot of them used to ape 'received pronunciation', play polo and that sort of thing. It's the same in India.

Yes Indonesian women do seem sort of shy, come to think of it. So you find Filipino women a lot more extroverted?
It's now a raging trend among Chinese Singaporeans (as well as Malaysians) to give their kids English names. I'd say it's got to do with trend than the adoption of Western culture. Many think having English names are cool and hip, hence they give their children English names too. And many tell me that having English names make their names easier to be remembered by other races and foreigners, especially in a multicultural country like Singapore and Malaysia. So I don't think it has much to do with Westernization personally.

I generally find the Filipino people a vivavious lot. Women are not as shy as the Malays/Indonesians. Most are receptive of foreigners and are keen to know them. And Filipino women, especially urbanites, are not shy to wear bikinis on beaches. Singaporean girls are quite liberal in this stance (of donning bikinis and etc), but certainly not at the level of the Filipinas.
 
Old 02-19-2013, 08:19 AM
 
Location: In the heights
22,194 posts, read 23,719,114 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyh View Post
The fact that the Chinese immigrants came much later to Singapore (and bringing with them a strong Chinese culture, traditions, and beliefs that are hard to forgo, unlike the noticeably weaker indigenous cultures which can suffer at the face of foreign cultural imperialism), and the fact that British colonization came much later to the city state compared to 4 centuries of Hispanicization of the Filipino people and culture certainly provide extra weight to the total Europeanization of the people. The Spanish influence on Filipinos permeates in almost every aspect of traditional life. And yes, even by 'traditional', Filipinos are Hispanic at the core, what more about the modern ones.

I wouldn't say Malays and Indonesians are vivacious as a whole. Friendly yes, but most are very shy, more so with their Islamic roots which generally frown on Western values and the unrestricted mixing of sexes, no Asian race can match the level of vivacity of the Christian, Hispanic Filipino peoples and their acceptance of Western culture and values. Balinese are only a tiny 3 million out of 240 million Indonesians, so they are the exception more than the norm. Even so, traditional Balinese culture is definitively Asian.

You can have an English name yet be culturally and socially Asian, like many Taiwanese and mainland Chinese who give themselves English names yet remain very Chinese. Also, do note that English-speaking Singaporeans are only a quarter of the Singaporean populace, and the Christians are only 1/5 of the population. These figures are certainly nowhere representative of the majority of the Singaporeans. But when 91% of Filipinos are Christian, and almost all of them are Hispanicized, you don't need to guess which one is more European/Western!
Though the sheer poverty of the Philippines sort of precludes that discussion in a lot of ways. Christianity as a heritage is a defining feature of Western nations, but the sort of widespread devout practice and conservatism that comes with it isn't all that strong in the West save for some Latin American countries (which sometimes are counted as distinct from the West). In that regard, the sort of secular and even atheistic/irreligious aspect of Singapore is actually closer.
 
Old 02-19-2013, 08:24 AM
kyh
 
Location: Malaysia & Singapore
383 posts, read 1,063,629 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
Though the sheer poverty of the Philippines sort of precludes that discussion in a lot of ways. Christianity as a heritage is a defining feature of Western nations, but the sort of widespread devout practice and conservatism that comes with it isn't all that strong in the West save for some Latin American countries (which sometimes are counted as distinct from the West). In that regard, the sort of secular and even atheistic/irreligious aspect of Singapore is actually closer.
Yet Asians rarely relate secularism and irreligiousity with Western influence. China is mainly irreligious, Taiwan is secular, but we don't see them as Western the same way modern Western countries define themselves. Most Western/European leanings from the Asian perspective has got to do with the traditional views of the West, i.e. culture, religion, behaviour, way of life.
 
Old 02-19-2013, 08:26 AM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,683 posts, read 45,455,894 times
Reputation: 11862
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyh View Post
It's now a raging trend among Chinese Singaporeans (as well as Malaysians) to give their kids English names. I'd say it's got to do with trend than the adoption of Western culture. Many think having English names are cool and hip, hence they give their children English names too. And many tell me that having English names make their names easier to be remembered by other races and foreigners, especially in a multicultural country like Singapore and Malaysia. So I don't think it has much to do with Westernization personally.

I generally find the Filipino people a vivavious lot. Women are not as shy as the Malays/Indonesians. Most are receptive of foreigners and are keen to know them. And Filipino women, especially urbanites, are not shy to wear bikinis on beaches. Singaporean girls are quite liberal in this stance (of donning bikinis and etc), but certainly not at the level of the Filipinas.
It's not that recent a trend, I mean even among those my mother's age it's not uncommon. Although it definitely is a lot commoner now than before. It's a bit like Africans, they often tend to take English given names as well.
 
Old 02-19-2013, 08:27 AM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,683 posts, read 45,455,894 times
Reputation: 11862
Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
Though the sheer poverty of the Philippines sort of precludes that discussion in a lot of ways. Christianity as a heritage is a defining feature of Western nations, but the sort of widespread devout practice and conservatism that comes with it isn't all that strong in the West save for some Latin American countries (which sometimes are counted as distinct from the West). In that regard, the sort of secular and even atheistic/irreligious aspect of Singapore is actually closer.
That's true, although as kyh says China, Japan.etc are pretty secular. India still seems deeply religious, and SE Asia to a lesser degree.
 
Old 02-19-2013, 08:37 AM
kyh
 
Location: Malaysia & Singapore
383 posts, read 1,063,629 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
It's not that recent a trend, I mean even among those my mother's age it's not uncommon. Although it definitely is a lot commoner now than before. It's a bit like Africans, they often tend to take English given names as well.
During your mother's time, only those English-educated ones would adopt English names. Yes, the trend is not recent, but it's been exploding since the turn of the century and now almost every A and B on the streets will have an English name.
 
Old 02-19-2013, 08:47 AM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,683 posts, read 45,455,894 times
Reputation: 11862
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyh View Post
During your mother's time, only those English-educated ones would adopt English names. Yes, the trend is not recent, but it's been exploding since the turn of the century and now almost every A and B on the streets will have an English name.
Yes I saw one of my mother's old year books, maybe 1 in 7 would have an English given name, surprisingly low. Now it's probably at least 1 in 2.
 
Old 02-19-2013, 09:37 AM
 
Location: Macao
15,951 posts, read 36,206,900 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
I'm not sure how pervasive the Spanish influence was in the Philippines outside Manila.etc though.
It permeated pretty much everywhere through and through throughout the Philippines.

Even the most Islamic part of the Philippines...Zamboanga...their local language is the most similar to Old Spanish (like Old English)...but a type of Spanish that was widely spoken back at that time, and considered the closest Filipino language to Spanish with the most Spanish root words.

As I think about it, all the Filipino languages that I'm aware of, all share many of their Spanish words - numbers, months, etc. So, it's definitely way deeper than just the Manila and Tagalog-speaking region.
 
Old 02-19-2013, 11:12 AM
kyh
 
Location: Malaysia & Singapore
383 posts, read 1,063,629 times
Reputation: 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiger Beer View Post
It permeated pretty much everywhere through and through throughout the Philippines.

Even the most Islamic part of the Philippines...Zamboanga...their local language is the most similar to Old Spanish (like Old English)...but a type of Spanish that was widely spoken back at that time, and considered the closest Filipino language to Spanish with the most Spanish root words.

As I think about it, all the Filipino languages that I'm aware of, all share many of their Spanish words - numbers, months, etc. So, it's definitely way deeper than just the Manila and Tagalog-speaking region.
You mean the Chavacano language (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chavacano_language)? It is considered a Spanish creole, the only one in Asia.

Also, Zamboanga is predominantly Catholic, not Muslim. The Muslim parts are those that make up the ARMM (Autonomous Region of Muslim Mindanao), which include parts of Western Mindanao, Basilan Island, and the Sulu Archipelago.
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