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Old 06-01-2013, 03:36 PM
 
1,434 posts, read 2,121,244 times
Reputation: 772

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Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
There is not an obvious sign that the other countries are growing closer. There's no great love between India and its neighbors. North Korea and South Korea aren't holding hands and neither of them want to play with Japan (which has had its far right become increasingly vocal and has really pissed a lot of people off). Really though, no one likes North Korea. Taiwan is also involved in the dispute with Senkaku/Diaoyu Islands along with China and Japan, and also in disputes with the Philippines (and the Philippines really made great allies by shooting and killing a Taiwanese fishermen this month). The Philippines are in various maritime disputes with not just China, but Taiwan, Vietnam, and Malaysia as well.

Mongolia does what exactly?

Russia will go with whatever is most profitable for itself.

All the while many of these countries supposedly in dispute with China are still in strong economic and sometimes other links with China.

What kind of coherent pact of any kind do you feel is coming out of this?


ActuallY, I think there are signs that these nations are getting closer. Initially, it started of with military to military relations but now it has spread to other areas as well. Soon, you will people to people interactions ona larger scale via tourism and the development of trans international highway that will be built between India, Burma, Thailand and may be extended further.
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Old 06-01-2013, 03:52 PM
 
1,434 posts, read 2,121,244 times
Reputation: 772
China is the main culprit here. It will keep bringing up outdated maps from 100's to 1000's yrs old to justify their points. It is meaningless in today's world when ppl, culure and nations have been established now. As the ppl of Sikkim and Arunchal Pradesh (Tawang) how they feel about China? Ask them why they voted to joing Indian Statehood? Ask Tibetan ppl who don't live in Tibet about their faith? How do you justify China invading Tibet for no reason and still holding onto it to this day.



North Korea and Pakistan both received missile and nuke tech from China. Is this a sign of a responsible power? As for the border incursion, there was an agreement between China and India that made it a point to avoid such transgressions. What you guys failed to notice, is this was right before the new Chinese Premier visited India. This tactic is sort of a bullying tactic for many reasons but nobody is quite certain. Whatever it is, it leave a bad impression on ppl all over. How do you encourage peaceful relations when your actions speak otherwise? You don't.

I'll give you a point. Kashmir has been divided into 3 parts. China obtained its part after Pakistan occupied a stretch during a previous war with India and immediately signed it away to China. Yet, in the media all you ever hear about is India's Kashmir not the rest. You hear about unproven atrocities committed by India forces which is played up by the opposition but they conveniently silence crimes by their own. China has sent military engineers to Pakistan occupied Kashmir (POK) to engage in some construction which is still not clear yet. Look up the String of Pearls theory. China is faking this peaceful rise BS to gather time.




As for a Chinese source, sorry anything from a govt controlled media has zero credibility.
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Old 06-01-2013, 11:03 PM
 
Location: Czech Republic
2,384 posts, read 5,862,101 times
Reputation: 797
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mistertee View Post
China is the main culprit here. It will keep bringing up outdated maps from 100's to 1000's yrs old to justify their points. It is meaningless in today's world when ppl, culure and nations have been established now. As the ppl of Sikkim and Arunchal Pradesh (Tawang) how they feel about China? Ask them why they voted to joing Indian Statehood? Ask Tibetan ppl who don't live in Tibet about their faith? How do you justify China invading Tibet for no reason and still holding onto it to this day.



North Korea and Pakistan both received missile and nuke tech from China. Is this a sign of a responsible power? As for the border incursion, there was an agreement between China and India that made it a point to avoid such transgressions. What you guys failed to notice, is this was right before the new Chinese Premier visited India. This tactic is sort of a bullying tactic for many reasons but nobody is quite certain. Whatever it is, it leave a bad impression on ppl all over. How do you encourage peaceful relations when your actions speak otherwise? You don't.

I'll give you a point. Kashmir has been divided into 3 parts. China obtained its part after Pakistan occupied a stretch during a previous war with India and immediately signed it away to China. Yet, in the media all you ever hear about is India's Kashmir not the rest. You hear about unproven atrocities committed by India forces which is played up by the opposition but they conveniently silence crimes by their own. China has sent military engineers to Pakistan occupied Kashmir (POK) to engage in some construction which is still not clear yet. Look up the String of Pearls theory. China is faking this peaceful rise BS to gather time.




As for a Chinese source, sorry anything from a govt controlled media has zero credibility.

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Old 06-01-2013, 11:33 PM
 
Location: Jersey
2,302 posts, read 3,404,147 times
Reputation: 2039
Chinese economic hegemony in Asia is inevitable. The question is whether or not they will use their economic clout and military power as weight to achieve political hegemony as well. Empirical evidence suggests they will. One can only hope vision and foresight overcomes indifference and old prejudices.
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Old 06-02-2013, 01:40 PM
 
Location: In the heights
22,228 posts, read 23,744,506 times
Reputation: 11678
Quote:
Originally Posted by pinai View Post
Taiwan is still under China and both have strong connection to each other. In Philippines part, we are just claiming the 200 Nautical Mile and not the entire Spratly. Not greedy as China as in the whole sea they want to occupy just because it's CHINA sea. Yeah, I remember some Taiwanese people blame the shooting incident to our OFW who are not part of the incident.

OFWs in Taiwan can't enter markets as they bear brunt of public outrage | Pinoy Abroad | GMA News Online
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermosaa View Post
Of course the Philippines was just defending their property. Why would they even fish outside of their territory ? They have their own sea, we also have ours. But they still always wanted to get more.
See, this misses the point being made entirely. There was nothing in what I said marking who was right or wrong in any of the disagreements among the different countries. If there was some kind of absolute right or wrong that everyone can abide by, then there wouldn't be a disagreement. There is no overarching coming together of other countries to counteract China--each of them has its own agenda.

These posts are illustrative of the fact of non-cooperation. Sure, Taiwan has strong anti-China sentiments and so does the Philippines--and basically none of their disagreements are going to go away just because they both hold these anti-China sentiments. Case in point are your posts completely glossing over the actual point being made because there's a reflexive response to ignore all that and to go straight into arguing about the one incident you guys are concerned about.

Last edited by OyCrumbler; 06-02-2013 at 02:07 PM..
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Old 06-02-2013, 01:49 PM
 
Location: In the heights
22,228 posts, read 23,744,506 times
Reputation: 11678
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mistertee View Post
ActuallY, I think there are signs that these nations are getting closer. Initially, it started of with military to military relations but now it has spread to other areas as well. Soon, you will people to people interactions ona larger scale via tourism and the development of trans international highway that will be built between India, Burma, Thailand and may be extended further.
Yea, I think these nations will get closer in some respects, but that also includes China which has developed trade and travel relations with all of these countries and often to a much greater extent than any other individual nation. I don't see how this relates to a specific isolation of China. Unfortunately, all that trade and travel hasn't really dispelled the many, many regional disputes among various combinations of all the nations in the area. The only territorial dispute among any of these nations in recent years has been a small one between Russia and China for some small river islands on their borders--and unfortunately for the idea of a pan-anti-China alliance, that was actually a quelling of a dispute with China rather than somehow against China.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mistertee View Post
China is the main culprit here. It will keep bringing up outdated maps from 100's to 1000's yrs old to justify their points. It is meaningless in today's world when ppl, culure and nations have been established now. As the ppl of Sikkim and Arunchal Pradesh (Tawang) how they feel about China? Ask them why they voted to joing Indian Statehood? Ask Tibetan ppl who don't live in Tibet about their faith? How do you justify China invading Tibet for no reason and still holding onto it to this day.



North Korea and Pakistan both received missile and nuke tech from China. Is this a sign of a responsible power? As for the border incursion, there was an agreement between China and India that made it a point to avoid such transgressions. What you guys failed to notice, is this was right before the new Chinese Premier visited India. This tactic is sort of a bullying tactic for many reasons but nobody is quite certain. Whatever it is, it leave a bad impression on ppl all over. How do you encourage peaceful relations when your actions speak otherwise? You don't.

I'll give you a point. Kashmir has been divided into 3 parts. China obtained its part after Pakistan occupied a stretch during a previous war with India and immediately signed it away to China. Yet, in the media all you ever hear about is India's Kashmir not the rest. You hear about unproven atrocities committed by India forces which is played up by the opposition but they conveniently silence crimes by their own. China has sent military engineers to Pakistan occupied Kashmir (POK) to engage in some construction which is still not clear yet. Look up the String of Pearls theory. China is faking this peaceful rise BS to gather time.




As for a Chinese source, sorry anything from a govt controlled media has zero credibility.
Who is that post supposed to be directed at? There might have been something screwed up with the quoting system or maybe my browser isn't displaying things properly.

Anyhow, how does this involve regional cooperation to contain China? It sounds like regional cooperation of China allying North Korea (historically true, but wikileaks and recent Chinese government responses to North Korea hint at the bond rapidly breaking down) and Pakistan which would be the exact opposite point being made.
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