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Old 02-19-2014, 07:01 PM
 
Location: World
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Ethnic tensions in those countries is due to the reason that immigrants who came with the foreign colonial powers did not leave when their country became independent and foreign masters left.

1) Tamils did not leave when British gave independence to Ceylon (Sri Lanka)
2) Hindus and Bihari Muslims did not leave when Bangladesh became independent.
3) Indians and Chinese in Burma
4) Indians and Chinese is Malaysia and Indonesia.

Bumiputra is a Sanskrit word Bumi or Bhumi means Land and Putra means Son. Son of the Soil means they want to say that Malays are original inhabitants and Chinese and Indians are foreigners and should be kicked out. Why will they go? They are born and brought up there. Its there country too.
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Old 02-19-2014, 07:37 PM
 
Location: Earth
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There's only one problem here. No separation of church and state.
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Old 02-19-2014, 07:59 PM
 
Location: Jakarta, Indonesia
1,022 posts, read 3,144,102 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dangerous-Boy View Post
There's only one problem here. No separation of church and state.
The problems are ethnic superiority issue, they want to keep only malay in power and used religion as excuse to do so, Chinese form large part of Malaysia today but are given almost no power but economic.
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Old 02-19-2014, 08:22 PM
 
Location: Melbourne, Australia
9,781 posts, read 16,228,213 times
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Originally Posted by Goshio22 View Post
The problems are ethnic superiority issue, they want to keep only malay in power and used religion as excuse to do so, Chinese form large part of Malaysia today but are given almost no power but economic.
Yes, I think it's a backlash against the Chinese dominance of the economy. While I do agree colonial policies did favour the Chinese unfairly at times, that's in the past now. All Malaysians should be treated equally. If anything, barring them from university or government just pushes them to open businesses or get into business. Maybe the government and some Malays hope the Chinese population will dwindle, leave and be 'outbred' by Malays.
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Old 02-19-2014, 09:18 PM
Status: "Then everything change forever..." (set 11 days ago)
 
5,167 posts, read 8,017,583 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Postman View Post
Yes, I think it's a backlash against the Chinese dominance of the economy. While I do agree colonial policies did favour the Chinese unfairly at times, that's in the past now. All Malaysians should be treated equally. If anything, barring them from university or government just pushes them to open businesses or get into business. Maybe the government and some Malays hope the Chinese population will dwindle, leave and be 'outbred' by Malays.
Its not so easy for societies to forget the past when the evidence of the past are blatantly clear by simply looking around.

Look at the Balkans where tensions exist to this very day (although not as bad as during the Kosovo ordeal) with claims going back thousands of years (one group claims to had been there first and they are the rightful owners of the place while another group says they were there first and they are the rightful owners.) Look at the Middle East with the Palestine-Israel issue, the current crisis in Syria, and many other places. Even the situation that existed in Zimbabwe is similar to this (the blacks claimed that is their ancestral homeland and either killed or expelled those that were Zimbabweans of recent migrants -mostly the whites-.) We, from the outside, can say they are all Zimbabweans, but some Zimbabweans feel they are the legitimate ones and the rest are usurpers of an identity, country, and society that doesn't belongs to them.

Also the fact that ethnic Chinese and ethnic Indians (or Tamils) sort of have their ancestral land somewhere else and could technically move there (China, India, Sri Lanka, etc); the Malays' ancestral land is Malaysia.

Its quite clear to me that the Malays feel they were done wrong in the past and that it jeopardizes their control over their ancestral homeland with many of these other people that have flooded their country from somewhere else and now want to control it.

I'm not taking sides in this issue, just that I think the Malays have a point and we outsiders will never fully understand their position unless we were in their shoes, which we are not and probably never will be.

Malaysia isn't the only country facing this, some countries even close to the USA may be facing a similar issue in the near future. Belize with the flooding in of Guatemalans, Costa Rica with the flooding in of Nicaraguans, and Dominican Republic with the flooding in of Haitians are the three that comes to mind, but I'm sure there are others. These are countries that are inching towards a demographic crisis that will eventually lead to an identity crisis, and in the worst case scenario could degenerate to downright war or even attempts of genocide by the population that feels overwhelmed by the foreigners and their descendants.

Last edited by AntonioR; 02-19-2014 at 09:42 PM..
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Old 02-19-2014, 09:41 PM
 
Location: Melbourne, Australia
9,781 posts, read 16,228,213 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AntonioR View Post
Its not so easy for societies to forget the past when the evidence of the past are blatantly clear by simply looking around.

Look at the Balkans where tensions exist to this very day (although not as bad as during the Kosovo ordeal) with claims going back thousands of years (one group claims to had been there first and they are the rightful owners of the place while another group says they were there first and they are the rightful owners.) Look at the Middle East with the Palestine-Israel issue, the current crisis in Syria, and many other places. Even the situation that existed in Zimbabwe is similar to this (the blacks claimed that is their ancestral homeland and either killed or expelled those that were Zimbabweans of recent migrants -mostly the whites-.) We, from the outside, can say they are all Zimbabweans, but some Zimbabweans feel they are the legitimate ones and the rest are usurpers of an identity, country, and society that doesn't belongs to them.

Also the fact that ethnic Chinese and ethnic Indians (or Tamils) sort of have their ancestral land somewhere else and could technically move there (China, India, Sri Lanka, etc); the Malays' ancestral land is Malaysia.

Its quite clear to me that the Malays feel they were done wrong in the past and that it jeopardizes their control over their ancestral homeland with many of these other people that have flooded their country from somewhere else and now want to control it.

I'm not taking sides in this issue, just that I think the Malays have a point and we outsiders will never fully understand their position unless we were in their shoes, which we are not and probably never will be.

Malaysia isn't the only country facing this, some countries even close to the USA may be facing a similar issue in the near future. Belize with the flooding in of Guatemalans, Costa Rica with the flooding in of Nicaraguans, and Dominican Republic with the flooding in of Haitians are the two that comes to mind, but I'm sure there are others. These are countries that are inching towards a demographic crisis that will eventually lead to an identity crisis, and in the worst case scenario could degenerate to downright war or even attempts of genocide by the population that feels overwhelmed by the foreigners and their descendants.
So you think they should just be kicked out? How would say, Americans of Irish or Italian ancestry were told they were no longer welcome in America because they have ancestral homelands to go to? America is there home, and Malaysia is their home too. Chinese have been in Malaysia longer than Europeans have been in North America. Actually some have indeed done just that, but most want to remain in Malaysia if they can. It's not like they can just get PRC citizenship anyway because of ancestral ties.

Well be careful to speak for all Malays. Many Malays don't support the government, and want a fairer Malaysia, and want to live in harmony. Recognising that people of any ethnicity are individuals will prevent blindly assigning thoughts/attitudes to certain groups. I don't think the solution is to further cause division or demand some sort of reparations, but to allow everyone born to have an equal chance.

If you wanna get technical the Malays actually displaced the orang asli, who lived in the Malay peninsula even before the Malays.

It is true that the Chinese and Indians played a very big role in building up modern Malaysia. Hard to say what Malaysia might be without them.
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Old 02-19-2014, 09:44 PM
Status: "Then everything change forever..." (set 11 days ago)
 
5,167 posts, read 8,017,583 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Postman View Post
So you think they should just be kicked out?
I said I'm not taking sides on this issue, just trying to understand the Malay's point of view.

Also, the USA is not the right example if you want to defend the right of the ethnic Chinese to stay in Malaysia, because if there is one thing the USA is a testament of is what happens when a place is flooded by foreigners. Remember that the USA was the ancestral homeland of the Native Americans and look who runs the show now, everyone except them! The foreigners have whipped the rightful owners in their own land and now the rightful owners need to live on the terms set by the invaders and their descendants. Its this precise issue that the Malays want to avoid, regardless if they even can avoid it.
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Old 02-19-2014, 09:47 PM
 
Location: Melbourne, Australia
9,781 posts, read 16,228,213 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AntonioR View Post
I said I'm not taking sides on this issue, just trying to understand the Malay's point of view.
Yes of course...I mean there were some colonial policies that placed the Chinese a bit above them/favoured them, but all in all, I think the British considered all orientals beneath them. The Chinese started out poor too, labourers, miners, farmers.etc and then started to open up shops first for their own community and later on for the country.

I'm sure some Malays feel it, but now with all the affirmative action policies, they have it better than ever.
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Old 02-19-2014, 10:56 PM
 
Location: Jakarta, Indonesia
1,022 posts, read 3,144,102 times
Reputation: 219
Quote:
Originally Posted by AntonioR View Post
Its not so easy for societies to forget the past when the evidence of the past are blatantly clear by simply looking around.

Look at the Balkans where tensions exist to this very day (although not as bad as during the Kosovo ordeal) with claims going back thousands of years (one group claims to had been there first and they are the rightful owners of the place while another group says they were there first and they are the rightful owners.) Look at the Middle East with the Palestine-Israel issue, the current crisis in Syria, and many other places. Even the situation that existed in Zimbabwe is similar to this (the blacks claimed that is their ancestral homeland and either killed or expelled those that were Zimbabweans of recent migrants -mostly the whites-.) We, from the outside, can say they are all Zimbabweans, but some Zimbabweans feel they are the legitimate ones and the rest are usurpers of an identity, country, and society that doesn't belongs to them.

Also the fact that ethnic Chinese and ethnic Indians (or Tamils) sort of have their ancestral land somewhere else and could technically move there (China, India, Sri Lanka, etc); the Malays' ancestral land is Malaysia.

Its quite clear to me that the Malays feel they were done wrong in the past and that it jeopardizes their control over their ancestral homeland with many of these other people that have flooded their country from somewhere else and now want to control it.

I'm not taking sides in this issue, just that I think the Malays have a point and we outsiders will never fully understand their position unless we were in their shoes, which we are not and probably never will be.

Malaysia isn't the only country facing this, some countries even close to the USA may be facing a similar issue in the near future. Belize with the flooding in of Guatemalans, Costa Rica with the flooding in of Nicaraguans, and Dominican Republic with the flooding in of Haitians are the three that comes to mind, but I'm sure there are others. These are countries that are inching towards a demographic crisis that will eventually lead to an identity crisis, and in the worst case scenario could degenerate to downright war or even attempts of genocide by the population that feels overwhelmed by the foreigners and their descendants.
Sumatra is actually the real Malay homeland, so they don't have real legitimate excuse to kickbut the chinese and indian since they aren't actually living in their ancestral land and could easily sent back to Sumatra too, but today's Malay in Malaysia isn't necesarily Malay from Sumatra since any Muslims there can be Malay.
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Old 02-20-2014, 12:13 AM
 
5,368 posts, read 5,148,120 times
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Everyone is talking about this being an ethnic issue when we all know the elephant in the room is that Malays are radical MUSLIMS! Muslims do not coexist peacefully with any other group on this whole planet. If the Malays were a Christian, Bhuddist, Jewish, or Hindu people I wold place my bottom dollar on them living quite peacefully with the ethnic Chinese community.
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