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Old 02-23-2014, 10:37 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiger Beer View Post
Unfortunately, many do move to suburbs. The trend of this generation of many Chinese and Asian emigrating to the U.S., is to go directly into the suburbs for the good schools, bigger houses, etc.

I don't necessary agree with that, as I've never lived in a suburb myself, and never had an interest in that. But, that's unfortunately where this generation of Chinese/Asian most often go when they move to the U.S.
unfortunately true.

The one thing I don't like American cities (aside for have too many crimes) is that people don't actually live in the city (a few exceptions like NYC). People work there and drive back to their dull suburban homes by 7pm and the cities become dead quiet after that.

The Chinese do love living in the cities, the more central, the better actually. Apartment price is Shanghai's core is about USD 1000/sf, which only Manhattan can match (San Francisco is at about 700-800). If Chicago were a Chinese city, the loop would be the most attractive place to live, and Lincoln Park would be considered a neighbourhood only less well-off people would choose to make their home. It is very much like Paris or New York.

When people live in the cities, streets become safer and more vibrant because due to the demand amenities including good schools are everywhere a lot within walking distance. You really can't expect that type of vibrancy in cities where the majority of people live in the 2 story homes with double garages and 1 acre of yard 50 miles away from the core.
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Old 02-23-2014, 10:38 AM
 
Location: Macao
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Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
unfortunately true.

The one thing I don't like American cities (aside for have too many crimes) is that people don't actually live in the city (a few exceptions like NYC). People work there and drive back to their dull suburban homes by 7pm and the cities become dead quiet after that.

The Chinese do love living in the cities, the more central, the better actually. Apartment price is Shanghai's core is about USD 1000/sf, which only Manhattan can match (San Francisco is at about 700-800). If Chicago were a Chinese city, the loop would be the most attractive place to live, and Lincoln Park would be considered a neighbourhood only less well-off people would choose to make their home. It is very much like Paris or New York.

When people live in the cities, streets become safer and more vibrant because due to the demand amenities including good schools are everywhere a lot within walking distance. You really can't expect that type of vibrancy in cities where the majority of people live in the 2 story homes with double garages and 1 acre of yard 50 miles away from the core.
I agree. That's one of my personal frustrations whenever I examine the possibility of ever going back to the U.S.

Unfortunately, in the U.S., you have to pay a lot of money for that magic combination of relative safety and close proximity to things. Whereas you just get that absolutely everywhere throughout almost all of Asia.
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Old 02-23-2014, 11:33 AM
 
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Actually the opposite is happening in America. More people are moving to city centers. In terms of new housing starts, population growth and investments in residential properties, American cities are outpacing the suburbs. Check out City Center in PA or Yorkville in Manhattan.

I don't know how it is in China specifically but I noticed that in east and SE Asia, people appear to be gravitating outwards (albeit in apartment buildings) in residential subdivisions. Worse, governments seem to be happy to oblige by building new miles of highways and subsidizing gasoline and electricity.

Last edited by Forest_Hills_Daddy; 02-23-2014 at 11:43 AM..
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Old 02-23-2014, 12:48 PM
 
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I know Chinese cities are completely different and difficult to compare, but I'm just looking at places that could remotely be considered as equivalents. They don't have to be exact.

One thing that annoys me most about cities here in the US is definitely the weak public transportation. I mean, I have a personal vehicle, but it's nice having options in the event you can't/don't want to drive. I'm still trying to narrow down places that offer a decent level of walkability, are close in proximity to interesting things, and aren't insanely expensive places to live.

Like I said, I have been looking at LA, but it seems living downtown is either too expensive or too riddled with crime. You have to live out in the suburbs, then drive 45 minutes through traffic because public transport sucks, to get to where the action is. In Chengdu, I lived on the 17th floor in a high rise in the middle of the city. The action came to me. As a single guy, transitioning back to the suburban lifestyle has been like taking all my favorite toys away from me.

I'm also considering the level of Chinese population as well so I have been looking closely at San Diego, San Fran and Houston.
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Old 02-23-2014, 01:27 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiger Beer View Post
I agree. That's one of my personal frustrations whenever I examine the possibility of ever going back to the U.S.

Unfortunately, in the U.S., you have to pay a lot of money for that magic combination of relative safety and close proximity to things. Whereas you just get that absolutely everywhere throughout almost all of Asia.
I thought a lot about this too. For the magical combination of convenience and safety, there are very limited number of options in the US, which are mostly very expensive places to live such as Manhattan and good parts of San Francisco and Boston. Chicago is cheap with good transit but the crime rate is way through the roof.

Canadian cities do much better. Downtown Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver and both vibrant and safe with good public transit. I don't know why Americans just let their big cities grow like that.
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Old 02-23-2014, 01:31 PM
 
10,847 posts, read 11,260,811 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Forest_Hills_Daddy View Post
Actually the opposite is happening in America. More people are moving to city centers. In terms of new housing starts, population growth and investments in residential properties, American cities are outpacing the suburbs. Check out City Center in PA or Yorkville in Manhattan.

I don't know how it is in China specifically but I noticed that in east and SE Asia, people appear to be gravitating outwards (albeit in apartment buildings) in residential subdivisions. Worse, governments seem to be happy to oblige by building new miles of highways and subsidizing gasoline and electricity.
both are true, but when you really compare the status quo, the difference is huge.

And also in America those who actually live in city centers are mostly single people or couples with no kids. The second they have their first born, they move back to the boring suburbs starting their 100% car dependent life as if a backyard is more important than anything. On the contrary, people from all walks of live in downtown Asian cities. It is never a default choice for families to move to the suburbs.

When you see big numbers of families with 2 kids live in downtown LA, Washington DC and Chicago, then that's real change.
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Old 02-23-2014, 01:37 PM
 
10,847 posts, read 11,260,811 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guawazi View Post

Like I said, I have been looking at LA, but it seems living downtown is either too expensive or too riddled with crime. You have to live out in the suburbs, then drive 45 minutes through traffic because public transport sucks, to get to where the action is. In Chengdu, I lived on the 17th floor in a high rise in the middle of the city. The action came to me. As a single guy, transitioning back to the suburban lifestyle has been like taking all my favorite toys away from me.

I'm also considering the level of Chinese population as well so I have been looking closely at San Diego, San Fran and Houston.
I feel you.

I have a close friend who move to Shanghai to work about 10 years ago from LA. I asked her if she is interested in moving back, she says definitely no, and that she just hates the idea of going back to the suburban life where you don't see a single soul walking by for hours. The energy in Shanghai keeps her there although cost of living is quite high. You walk everyone, and 16 subways lines make sure she doesn't ever have to drive.

What's the point of having a big two story house when you life is extremely boring and commute takes 2+ hours every day? Quality of life plummets and it is simply not worth it.

I love Chengdu too. It really has a big city feel with all the urban amenities without the big price tag like Shanghai. Someone actually compared Chengdu to Milwaukee and I LMAO. Chengdu beats the vibrancy of Boston and Seattle any day is at par with cities like San Francisco.
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Old 02-23-2014, 01:49 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
both are true, but when you really compare the status quo, the difference is huge.

And also in America those who actually live in city centers are mostly single people or couples with no kids. The second they have their first born, they move back to the boring suburbs starting their 100% car dependent life as if a backyard is more important than anything. On the contrary, people from all walks of live in downtown Asian cities. It is never a default choice for families to move to the suburbs.

When you see big numbers of families with 2 kids live in downtown LA, Washington DC and Chicago, then that's real change.
There were some trends cited by books like "End of the Suburbs" and "Suburban Nation" showing that more families are moving into inner cities than the suburbs. Ghettos have already been gentrified and old, delapidated rowhouses have been gut renovated. I think the people in the CA forums have said that downtown LA has experienced a boom in families moving in, as well as the Georgetown, Arlington and Alexandria districts of DC/NoVA and Brooklyn in NYC. Granted majority of middle class Americans still live in the suburbs but fewer families are moving there. At current urban migration rates, the suburbs are expected to become the next Florida - home to aging baby boom retirees. Millenials are now preferring areas within or closer to cities:

http://www.nextavenue.org/blog/what-...-means-boomers

Last edited by Forest_Hills_Daddy; 02-23-2014 at 02:04 PM..
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Old 02-23-2014, 03:59 PM
 
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You can try Boston. Not the downtown but Cambridge or Somerville.

Cambridge/Somerville has thousands of students (Harvard, MIT, Tufts). Harvard Square, Davis Square and Porter Square have some places open 24/7. You cannot compare it with Chengdu (not to mention Shanghai) but it somehow resembles the style of major Chinese cities in that aspect. Plus you don't need to own a car in Boston area.
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Old 02-23-2014, 07:30 PM
 
Location: Melbourne, Australia
9,781 posts, read 16,241,785 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiger Beer View Post
Unfortunately, many do move to suburbs. The trend of this generation of many Chinese and Asian emigrating to the U.S., is to go directly into the suburbs for the good schools, bigger houses, etc.

I don't necessary agree with that, as I've never lived in a suburb myself, and never had an interest in that. But, that's unfortunately where this generation of Chinese/Asian most often go when they move to the U.S.
That's odd...I associate Chinese concentrating in the inner city, although there are a few suburban areas where they move due to cost. But I think many prefer the more urban inner city environments where there are also more Chinese grocery shops and restaurants.
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