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Old 02-26-2014, 11:24 PM
 
Location: Melbourne, Australia
9,781 posts, read 16,269,689 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiger Beer View Post
I should clarify, I just see the skimpy miniskirts out in Bukit Bintang from 10pm-1am on a weekend night, when pretty much everyone is out to SEE and BE SEEN. Not any different than any other nightlife place in the world actually. It's just interesting to see Middle Eastern women all dressed up to the nines as well though.

Occassionally at Petrona Tower's food court / shopping mall, I'd occassionally see a very dolled up Middle Eastern women dressed up to the nines as well. But, I also see plenty of Chinese or Korean or other nationalities do that as well. I'm thinking its the same vein that an American women goes topless on a European beach. Not because they are 'looking for something', but solely because its a bit of freedom and feels good, and no other motivation behind it.

Outside of those two places, its quite doubtful I'd see that so much though anywhere else in KL/Malaysia with the Middle Easterners.
Well yes, just saying it's probably still a minority of Middle Eastern women. Most Malay Muslim women wear the hijab and cover up, although there are exceptions. I remember watching a Malay drama series on TV in Malaysia (with English subtitles). The 'bad' daughter dressed like Western (or non Muslim) women, not covering her hair, wearing short skirts, heels.etc, and wasn't filial to her parents. You'll see some Malay (as well as other Muslim) women dressing up like that but it's not the majority.
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Old 02-26-2014, 11:26 PM
 
Location: Melbourne, Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goshio22 View Post
Well the precise word would probably moderate? and most of the secular are concentrated in the big city, but most Indonesians aren't as Islamic as the middle-east, pakistan or even brunei.
I don't know how serious most Javanese are, I feel the ones in Sumatra are more religious (more cultural ties with the Malays on the peninsula too). Aceh in northern Sumatra is actually the only administrative region in South-East Asia with sharia law. Kelantan in Malaysia is quite Muslim too. Much of Eastern Indonesia is either Christian or practices traditional religion. I would say Malaysians vary in how devout they are, I mean most are true believers I would say, but he overall climate isn't as strict the Middle East or even Pakistan. Also if you're non Muslim a lot of laws don't apply to you (sort of de-facto religious laws). Also Islam is the official religion of Malaysia but not Indonesia). In terms of being a liberal Muslim country, they're probably similar to Indonesia, Bangladesh (not that Bangladesh is liberal, just not as totalitarian) and a bit moreso than Turkey and Central Asia. Saudi Arabia, Iran, Egypt is a whole nother level.

Last edited by The Postman; 02-26-2014 at 11:37 PM..
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Old 02-27-2014, 12:54 AM
 
Location: Jakarta, Indonesia
1,022 posts, read 3,148,875 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Postman View Post
I don't know how serious most Javanese are, I feel the ones in Sumatra are more religious (more cultural ties with the Malays on the peninsula too). Aceh in northern Sumatra is actually the only administrative region in South-East Asia with sharia law. Kelantan in Malaysia is quite Muslim too. Much of Eastern Indonesia is either Christian or practices traditional religion. I would say Malaysians vary in how devout they are, I mean most are true believers I would say, but he overall climate isn't as strict the Middle East or even Pakistan. Also if you're non Muslim a lot of laws don't apply to you (sort of de-facto religious laws). Also Islam is the official religion of Malaysia but not Indonesia). In terms of being a liberal Muslim country, they're probably similar to Indonesia, Bangladesh (not that Bangladesh is liberal, just not as totalitarian) and a bit moreso than Turkey and Central Asia. Saudi Arabia, Iran, Egypt is a whole nother level.
Actually Indonesia is more liberal than Malaysians Malay, there are way more Muslims with Hijab in KL than Jakarta too, dress codes of Indonesians ladies also tend to be much more open. daring and even more fashion concious compared to Malaysians liberals. I also feel that Sumatra is more religious but mainly in the northern sides and getting less serious as it goes south (Medan city is exceptional), central sulalwesi also seems quiet religious but then its Christian counterpart in north sulawesi are even more religious.

i thought Kelantan also have shariah right?

Last edited by Goshio22; 02-27-2014 at 01:43 AM..
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Old 02-27-2014, 05:55 AM
 
Location: Melbourne, Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goshio22 View Post
Actually Indonesia is more liberal than Malaysians Malay, there are way more Muslims with Hijab in KL than Jakarta too, dress codes of Indonesians ladies also tend to be much more open. daring and even more fashion concious compared to Malaysians liberals. I also feel that Sumatra is more religious but mainly in the northern sides and getting less serious as it goes south (Medan city is exceptional), central sulalwesi also seems quiet religious but then its Christian counterpart in north sulawesi are even more religious.

i thought Kelantan also have shariah right?
Yes, I think like in countries like Egypt, there was a resurgence, partly engineered by the government, which led to a re-radicalisation of Islam. This didn't seem to happen in Indonesia where there was a greater commitment to a secular democracy. No Kelantan does not have sharia, only Aceh.
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Old 02-27-2014, 06:48 AM
 
Location: Jakarta, Indonesia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Postman View Post
Yes, I think like in countries like Egypt, there was a resurgence, partly engineered by the government, which led to a re-radicalisation of Islam. This didn't seem to happen in Indonesia where there was a greater commitment to a secular democracy. No Kelantan does not have sharia, only Aceh.
Oh right Kelantan is ruled by pas, the most islamic party in malaysia. that's why.

Aceh is the least desired province of Indonesia, majority of the population despise what they did to the population of Aceh, and some of the Acehnese themself didn't liked it and see it as insult to Islam. And you are right many countries in North Africa (Egypt and Libya) seems to be seeing resurgance of Islamic rules after the revolution, Indonesia had this 14 years ago but are going towards true democracy even more, Chinese minorities are much more treated equally. Also considering Islam tend to downgrade women's freedom (sorry to say and i didn't mean anything bad but it's true) Megawati managed to become the first women president in the country, though she didn't rule that long.

In Indonesia women managed to become more independent too more than most Muslim dominated country, even Malaysia, this should helped to indicate how Islamic Indonesia truly is as compared to many other nation: Ratio of female to male labor force participation rate (%) | Data | Table

The ratio is isn't that different though: 1:1 in Indonesia, in Malaysia it's 1.1:1

Surabaya also have a female mayor and she is beloved by its population.

Last edited by Goshio22; 02-27-2014 at 07:16 AM..
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Old 02-27-2014, 07:07 AM
 
Location: West Jakarta + Tangerang
376 posts, read 744,533 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Postman View Post
Yes, I think like in countries like Egypt, there was a resurgence, partly engineered by the government, which led to a re-radicalisation of Islam. This didn't seem to happen in Indonesia where there was a greater commitment to a secular democracy. No Kelantan does not have sharia, only Aceh.
Islam in Indonesia is different from the country that adherents of other Islamic countries, because we have the motto "Bhineka Tunggal Ika " which make Islam in Indonesia is more moderate and more open to all foreign influences. ^ ^
even at my place / komplex home,the peoples have many different religions, even atheis exist but we respect each other
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Old 02-27-2014, 08:52 AM
 
Location: Melbourne, Australia
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Originally Posted by stevania01 View Post
Islam in Indonesia is different from the country that adherents of other Islamic countries, because we have the motto "Bhineka Tunggal Ika " which make Islam in Indonesia is more moderate and more open to all foreign influences. ^ ^
even at my place / komplex home,the peoples have many different religions, even atheis exist but we respect each other
Yet at the same time Indonesia is the breeding ground for terrorists like Jamah Islamiah.
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Old 02-27-2014, 06:58 PM
 
Location: Jakarta, Indonesia
1,022 posts, read 3,148,875 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevania01 View Post
Islam in Indonesia is different from the country that adherents of other Islamic countries, because we have the motto "Bhineka Tunggal Ika " which make Islam in Indonesia is more moderate and more open to all foreign influences. ^ ^
even at my place / komplex home,the peoples have many different religions, even atheis exist but we respect each other
This is true many nationalist Indonesians believes in the motto, a reason why Indonesia keeps going forward equality is this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Postman View Post
Yet at the same time Indonesia is the breeding ground for terrorists like Jamah Islamiah.
Yeah and malaysia produces terrorist to bombed Bali, and few times Malaysians are caught in Minandao several times, also many Muslims in Malaysia support terrorism in Thailand.

Noordin Mohammad Top - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Malaysian Marwan believed to mastermind latest bomb attacks in south Philippines - Nation | The Star Online

Jamaah Islamayaah are remnant of Parti Islam Indonesia who wanted islamic state of Indoensia, formed after the government purged their party. It's also Malaysia that became their refuge after the government destroyed the party.

Last edited by Goshio22; 02-27-2014 at 07:20 PM..
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Old 02-28-2014, 12:13 AM
 
Location: Melbourne, Australia
9,781 posts, read 16,269,689 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goshio22 View Post
This is true many nationalist Indonesians believes in the motto, a reason why Indonesia keeps going forward equality is this.



Yeah and malaysia produces terrorist to bombed Bali, and few times Malaysians are caught in Minandao several times, also many Muslims in Malaysia support terrorism in Thailand.

Noordin Mohammad Top - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Malaysian Marwan believed to mastermind latest bomb attacks in south Philippines - Nation | The Star Online

Jamaah Islamayaah are remnant of Parti Islam Indonesia who wanted islamic state of Indoensia, formed after the government purged their party. It's also Malaysia that became their refuge after the government destroyed the party.
Where do you get that info?? The Bali bombers were Javanese.
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Old 02-28-2014, 02:05 AM
 
Location: Jakarta, Indonesia
1,022 posts, read 3,148,875 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Postman View Post
Where do you get that info?? The Bali bombers were Javanese.
Noordim M Top and azhari husein from malaysia is the one responsible for the bombing, all Indonesians know that, though he only assisted the first one. But he is definitely responsible for the second and Jakarta bombing. But you don't have to worry all of them are dead executed, the Javanese and Malaysians. The terrorist are from west java, so they are bantenese and sundanese not javanese, but the one from central java is.

After the death of noordin, the terrorist activity in indonesia had calmed by a lot but i fear his sons in malaysia is still alive, hopefully he wont have to grow the way his father did. The terorist is still active in indonesia but much on lower profile than before, and the funny thing is they try to recruit people through online last year. Indonesian government isnt willing to risk another bombing, all airport, hotels, major shopping malls are equipped with metal detectors and airport security is tighter than thailand or malaysia. Every Christmas churches are guarded by police too since the last bombing.

Last edited by Goshio22; 02-28-2014 at 02:38 AM..
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