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Old 10-04-2014, 10:24 PM
 
Location: Taipei
6,776 posts, read 5,128,008 times
Reputation: 4566

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dangerous-Boy View Post
This is why i'm more scared of a rearmed Japan. The Japanese were cutting off heads before the Muslims made it mainstream. They used longer and sharper blades too. They raped all of Asia litterly. the PRC keeps poking them in the eye about the islands. You don't poke a tiger in the eye! Just because the PRC has a bigger population, doesn't mean they can defeat Japan. The Japanese are a ferocious people. They are like the British of Asia. They are better off on America's leash. It took 2 nuclear strikes just to make the submit!
Another reason to love Japan.
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Old 10-05-2014, 01:46 AM
 
6,726 posts, read 6,611,101 times
Reputation: 2386
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camlon View Post
Are you kidding me? That is your excuse for the pathetic performance of North Korea. Actually North Korea got more support than South Korea ever received from the US. South Korea never received the same kind of trade deals that North Korea got. Still, North Korea got crushed by South Korea.

In fact hadn't they been so reliant on trade with Soviet, then the crisis in the 90s would never been an issue. South Korea would not have seen millions of people starve to death, because US stop trading with them.






Those countries are hardly capitalist. For instance in the ease of doing business ranking
Pakistan: 110
Yemen: 133
India: 134

China is 96 in the ease of doing business ranking.
Do you know what "collapsed" means? It means turning bad in a sudden. If the Soviet Union had not collapsed, N Korea's economy would not have collapsed in early 1990s. I am not saying it is sustainable in a long term.

Suppose there are only a few capitalist countries in the world, and all other major countries are in another system (no matter what it is) and always try to repress them, those few capitalist countries can hardly survive either.

In addition, GDP data of a country without free market is not quite useful. The system is totally different.

So you label all successful countries as capitalist and all failed ones as non-capitalist? That's smart.
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Old 10-05-2014, 02:47 AM
 
3,123 posts, read 2,704,582 times
Reputation: 1713
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bettafish View Post
Do you know what "collapsed" means? It means turning bad in a sudden. If the Soviet Union had not collapsed, N Korea's economy would not have collapsed in early 1990s. I am not saying it is sustainable in a long term.
Noth Korean economy was not sustainable in the short term either. Why do you start making excuses, and talk about how North Korea collapsed in the 90s? It is hardly relevant, North Korea would have been poor even if Soviet didn't collapse.

Quote:
Suppose there are only a few capitalist countries in the world, and all other major countries are in another system (no matter what it is) and always try to repress them, those few capitalist countries can hardly survive either.
There are not a few capitalist countries in the world, but the countries who get 130 in ease of doing business ranking are hardly capitalist.

How can the economy flourish when the government makes it almost impossible to do business?

Quote:
So you label all successful countries as capitalist and all failed ones as non-capitalist? That's smart.
Another excuse from you. There are poorer countries who have high rankings in ease of doing business, such as Malaysia, Georgia, Mauritius.

But yes, capitalism is a superior model, and hence those three countries are growing fast.
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Old 10-05-2014, 03:39 AM
 
6,726 posts, read 6,611,101 times
Reputation: 2386
When you make an argument, you always jump out of the logic chain and claim something else, which makes the discussion hard the boring.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camlon View Post
Noth Korean economy was not sustainable in the short term either. Why do you start making excuses, and talk about how North Korea collapsed in the 90s? It is hardly relevant, North Korea would have been poor even if Soviet didn't collapse.
First of all, I am not making "excuses", as I said N Korea has a failed system. EVEN IF I am making excuses, you should focus on the arguments instead of making assumptions about my motives and so on.
We were talking about the "collapse" as you said something about it too, not whether N Korea has a sustainable economy or not. Why do you keep changing topics? You just admit N Korea's economy collapsed in the early 1990s and then we can move on.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Camlon View Post
There are not a few capitalist countries in the world, but the countries who get 130 in ease of doing business ranking are hardly capitalist.
Ease of doing business does not directly determine whether a country is capitalist or not. If you are giving your own definitions or proposing your own theories, do not use them as axioms in your arguments.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Camlon View Post
Another excuse from you. There are poorer countries who have high rankings in ease of doing business, such as Malaysia, Georgia, Mauritius.

But yes, capitalism is a superior model, and hence those three countries are growing fast.
Again, stay with the arguments instead of talking about other participants' motives, especially when you have very poor judgements. Whether capitalism is a superior model or not cannot change the fact that many capitalist countries are still very poor, so it proves my point that "many things are involved".
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Old 10-05-2014, 04:03 AM
 
6,726 posts, read 6,611,101 times
Reputation: 2386
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camlon View Post
In fact hadn't they been so reliant on trade with Soviet, then the crisis in the 90s would never been an issue. South Korea would not have seen millions of people starve to death, because US stop trading with them.
What were you trying to say here?

You blame N Korea for trading with the Soviets? Do you know the whole western world refused to trade with N Korea? What else could they do? How can a country be rich if the whole western world puts a sanction there?

It's like the US and many European countries refused to trade with Iran, and then blame Iranians for their bad economy. A little ironic.

Yes, N Korea picked a bad system/ally and they paid the price. But it is just naive to attribute "everything" to their system immediately. That is just propaganda.
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Old 10-05-2014, 05:42 AM
 
4,694 posts, read 3,618,305 times
Reputation: 7390
The students have made their point. They want candidates who can be at least 50% for China and 50% for HK. China is also right that it has not violated any terms of the 97 agreement. HK police have been very restrained.

Now it’s time for these students to disperse before public opinion turns against them (already has begun), and China gets painted into a corner and “loses face”. Once that happens, China will have much more to worry about, like its legitimacy and sovereignty, and the PLA may be called in. That would be a disaster for all in HK.

So, it is time to go while you are still seen as heros, kids.
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Old 10-05-2014, 05:55 AM
 
5,096 posts, read 8,072,332 times
Reputation: 3066
Although I've realized the protesting going on in Hong Kong, I had no real idea about the scale of it. The number of people involved is rather massive. The video below are of views looking at the crowds as seen from a camera drone. Best viewed in full screen from the link.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q919bQOThvM
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Old 10-05-2014, 06:08 AM
 
4,694 posts, read 3,618,305 times
Reputation: 7390
Quote:
Originally Posted by NightBazaar View Post
Although I've realized the protesting going on in Hong Kong, I had no real idea about the scale of it. The number of people involved is rather massive. The video below are of views looking at the crowds as seen from a camera drone. Best viewed in full screen from the link.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q919bQOThvM

Yes, but there are 6.8 million people in HK.

Check out thye same street scene today. The protesters have largely dissipated. Sorry to disappoint many of you....
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Old 10-05-2014, 07:51 AM
 
5,096 posts, read 8,072,332 times
Reputation: 3066
Quote:
Originally Posted by pennyone View Post
Yes, but there are 6.8 million people in HK.

Check out thye same street scene today. The protesters have largely dissipated. Sorry to disappoint many of you....
Not sure if anyone is disappointed. Such events do eventually thin out. That's no surprise. They looked like a countless swarm of ants in the video though. The video is dated about 5 days ago. Good business for any local food vendors.

True, HK is a large city. However, the population size of a city doesn't always determine how large a protest gathering is likely to be. Bangkok has around ~14 million people in the overall metro area. People also came in from other parts of the country, but at the peak of the protests there didn't seem to be anywhere near as large in numbers as this one in HK.
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Old 10-05-2014, 08:22 AM
 
3,123 posts, read 2,704,582 times
Reputation: 1713
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bettafish View Post
When you make an argument, you always jump out of the logic chain and claim something else, which makes the discussion hard the boring.
What you mean I don't give you the answer you like to get. If you claim some countries are capitalist, and ask us why those countries are not doing well, then you expect me to accept your claim and make excuses for how those countries are different.

Instead I will tell you they are not capitalist, and you don't like that because it destroys the basis of your argument.

Quote:
First of all, I am not making "excuses", as I said N Korea has a failed system. EVEN IF I am making excuses, you should focus on the arguments instead of making assumptions about my motives and so on.
We were talking about the "collapse" as you said something about it too, not whether N Korea has a sustainable economy or not. Why do you keep changing topics? You just admit N Korea's economy collapsed in the early 1990s and then we can move on.
But no one here talked about the collapse. You started talking about it when he said
And did N. Korea and Vietnam not receive any support from the Soviets and China?
And then you said
The reason why N Korea's economy collapsed in the 1990s is that their economy was tied with the Soviet Union, which collapsed.
Yes, it is not relevant to the failure of North Korean economy. That is why I am saying you are making excuses.

Quote:
Ease of doing business does not directly determine whether a country is capitalist or not. If you are giving your own definitions or proposing your own theories, do not use them as axioms in your arguments.
I never said it directly determines. I said a country which is at place 130 in ease of doing business, is hardly a capitalist country.

The idea of capitalism is free transactions, not overregulated transactions.

Quote:
Again, stay with the arguments instead of talking about other participants' motives, especially when you have very poor judgements. Whether capitalism is a superior model or not cannot change the fact that many capitalist countries are still very poor, so it proves my point that "many things are involved".
You haven't proved a thing. You have listed countries which hardly are capitalists, often with a socialist history, and asked us why those countries are not rich.
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