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Old 08-06-2015, 09:29 PM
 
Location: San Diego CA
4,920 posts, read 3,413,253 times
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What's your point? North Korea started a war by invading South Korea. They did enormous damage to the countryside and the cities. Hundreds of S. Koreans who fell under their control where rounded up and summarily executed.

The U.S. intervened on behalf of the South using all the weapons at their disposal including air power. The North was driven back across the border. South Korea is now an economic power house with one of the highest standards of living in the world. North Korea is an isolated impoverished dictatorship where people regularly starved to death.

The US has made a lot of mistakes militarily after WW2 but Korea wasn't one of them.
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Old 08-06-2015, 09:40 PM
 
Location: Elysium
6,617 posts, read 3,667,201 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 415_s2k View Post
Another part of it is that the Korean war ended in a stalemate rather than the decisive victory that WW2 was for the US and its allies. Most people would rather remember their nation's resounding victories than anything less.
Come to think of it since the Philippines Insurrection is also a current topic there is an example of a forgotten victory. Even with The US reestablishing contact with Cuba its forgotten even if everything that happened in the Philippines can be considered collateral damage from the effort to get Spain out of Cuba.
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Old 08-07-2015, 02:19 AM
 
Location: Asia
2,761 posts, read 1,108,166 times
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Meh...

The North Koreans started the war by invading the South. The world had just gone through a decade or more of brutal, horrible war and nobody was perticularly interested in fighting more. The US had learned in WWII that the best way to win and win quickly was to be merciless in punishing the enemy and crushing its will to fight.

Had the North not invaded, there would not have been any war in the first place.

Too much navel-gazing in that article for my taste.

The US is not to blame for the bat-poo crazy policies and actions of the North Koreans.

Last edited by Salmonburgher; 08-07-2015 at 03:31 AM..
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Old 08-07-2015, 02:49 AM
 
110 posts, read 66,747 times
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We did the exact same thing on German cities, just as the Germans did the exact same thing to French, Dutch, Belgian, Brit, Russian, ... cities.

The only reason Korea ended in a stalemate is because we didn't want to risk war with China (and thus Russia). It was also agreed that North Korea would be in the Russian influence zone and South in the US influence zone. If you look at it that way, it was a resounding allied victory.

War is hell. And as always, it's the weakest who pay the entirety of the price. But it's not different. We got bogged down in Vietnam, Afghanistan and Iraq because we were too nice. We should have nuked the commies in Vietnam and razed Afghanistan and Iraq to the ground. Then you can rebuild it as you like, just like we did with Germany and Japan, who are complete successes.
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Old 08-09-2015, 11:15 PM
 
1,379 posts, read 1,819,477 times
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Originally Posted by beachrr View Post
We did the exact same thing on German cities, just as the Germans did the exact same thing to French, Dutch, Belgian, Brit, Russian, ... cities.

The only reason Korea ended in a stalemate is because we didn't want to risk war with China (and thus Russia). It was also agreed that North Korea would be in the Russian influence zone and South in the US influence zone. If you look at it that way, it was a resounding allied victory.

War is hell. And as always, it's the weakest who pay the entirety of the price. But it's not different. We got bogged down in Vietnam, Afghanistan and Iraq because we were too nice. We should have nuked the commies in Vietnam and razed Afghanistan and Iraq to the ground. Then you can rebuild it as you like, just like we did with Germany and Japan, who are complete successes.
This mentality seems common among conservatives. In any case, it is thankfully impossible for America to achieve unconditional surrender a la Japan and Germany with hostile Asian countries these days thanks to the rise of the PRC. It appears that the US will just have to live with a hostile China and North Korea and just deal with it since there will be no US enforced Japanese style democratization will ever happen with those countries.
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Old 08-10-2015, 12:24 PM
 
12,375 posts, read 18,472,442 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X14Freak View Post
Can the Japanese justify the Nanking Massacre using this justification as well?
No, there is no similarity or comparison. The Nanking Massacre was not done when war was occurring, but during military occupation of Nanking after the city capitulated. A time of war vs. a time of peace. Same with the thousands of atrocities committed to millions of non-Japanese by the Japanese Imperial Army in occupied territories in Asia.

Last edited by Dd714; 08-10-2015 at 12:59 PM..
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Old 08-10-2015, 12:32 PM
 
12,375 posts, read 18,472,442 times
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Originally Posted by X14Freak View Post
It appears that the US will just have to live with a hostile China and North Korea and just deal with it since there will be no US enforced Japanese style democratization will ever happen with those countries.
Putting China and North Korea in the same boat is about as silly as can be. China is not hostile - that's just political rhetoric. They are competitors with the US and differ on policy, they engage in some cyber attacks, they steal technology, yeah. But - I mean I can and do jump on a plane to China several times a years. My coworkers are Chinese. My company has operations there. The US has tens of thousands of expats living there, China has tens of thousands of students and expats living in the US.
Now let's look at North Korea - do I need to note the difference?
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Old 08-10-2015, 11:43 PM
 
Location: Guangzhou, China
9,790 posts, read 13,391,394 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dd714 View Post
Putting China and North Korea in the same boat is about as silly as can be. China is not hostile - that's just political rhetoric. They are competitors with the US and differ on policy, they engage in some cyber attacks, they steal technology, yeah. But - I mean I can and do jump on a plane to China several times a years. My coworkers are Chinese. My company has operations there. The US has tens of thousands of expats living there, China has tens of thousands of students and expats living in the US.
Now let's look at North Korea - do I need to note the difference?
Yup, I'm one of em

The US and China obviously have many vast differences and they are competitors, but they are also economic partners who are having to learn to share the world stage together.

If the two nations were hostile to one another, there would be a hell of a lot less trade between the two, or the trade would come with massive taxes and fines to create a disincentive. They wouldn't be offering eachothers' citizens 10 year visas.

It's funny to read people making comments about "enforced democratization" when in absence of US support, neither Japan nor South Korea would dump democracy. Neither democracy nor nationalism preclude one another. Some people get so caught up in criticising the US that they seem to lose their ability to think about the situation critically. The US didn't force democracy on a number of the states it has partnered with in the past or present, nor on any one of a number of nations that it has declined to do business with. North Korea is simply a beligerent nation, nothing more and nothing less.

But, in any case, China has North Korea; the US has Israel. Both are controversial nations that are loathed by their neighbors, but that their governments support for ideological and pragmatic reasons - often, grudingly so. Both the US and China have done much more to reign in their temperamental cousins in recent years than they have in the past, and more and more people in the public and official sectors see them as liabilities rather than assets.
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Old 08-11-2015, 09:40 PM
 
Location: Asia
2,761 posts, read 1,108,166 times
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Originally Posted by 415_s2k View Post
Yup, I'm one of em

The US and China obviously have many vast differences and they are competitors, but they are also economic partners who are having to learn to share the world stage together.
This. Yes.

Despite all of the aggressive chest-thumping rhetoric (from both sides), the US has always hoped for and sought good relations with China. The US has always had an "open door" policy wrt China. I believe that China regards the US as important a partner as the US regards China.
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Old 08-15-2015, 05:50 AM
 
919 posts, read 606,048 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X14Freak View Post
Can the Japanese justify the Nanking Massacre using this justification as well?
How many people were killed by the way?
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