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Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
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Our city of 50,000 is about 15% Indian now, and they are all well educated, working in high paying tech jobs, most buying homes costing $600k or more and bringing the parents/in-laws with them to babysit. The younger kids seem to be brats when we see them in stores, but the older ones, once in school, are among the highest achieving students
and very well behaved. My only complaint is that the number of Indian restaurants popping up in the nearby cities (none here, just one Indian grocery) that take the place of restaurants we might go to. Neither my wife or I can stand curry.
I'm not a fan of Indian food that I've tried in the US ... it always seems really greasy and overcooked.
It is not easy to get Visas for Chefs or even trained assistants from India. Thats why the kitchens of Indian Restaurants are full of either those immigrants, relatives who learned cooking here and some Mexicans who are trained in making Indian Food.
In India, restaurants cook in huge volumes with fresh ingredients. Here they do not have that luxury as market is limited.
I personally find Indian food overpriced in USA and is surviving only because locals do not know much about Indian Food and fresh supply of immigrants from India who do not have anywhere else to go / they do not want to eat Meat.
Judging by a lot of comments on various forums and websites, it seems to have become fashionable to talk negative about India and Indians in the wake of reports of various social problems the country has (which I'm fully aware of and need to be resolved or addressed), such as rape, poverty, caste system, etc. So much so that the most popular opinions often seem to be ones which have a contemptuous or even hostile view of the country and people. Even though there are some things I don't like about Indian culture (as well as some things I like), I still find such comments disheartening. People seem to make blanket judgments, with others agreeing with them (this can easily be seen through upvotes vs. downvotes on websites such as reddit and Yahoo! News).
To that end, does anyone still have a mostly positive opinion? Also, as this is the Asia forum, how do you view India in comparison to countries such as China, Japan, Thailand, or Pakistan?
And in your experience do you find Indians different in behavior when compared to other ethnicities?
Again, I'm asking this purely out of curiosity and wanted to get this off my chest.
Your reference to comparisons with Pakistan is notable. I would argue, not without some sadness, that very few Americans would be able to differentiate between individual Indians and Pakistanis. Having said that, I would add that most Americans probably feel more positive about Indians collectively -- if only because of Pakistan's current plague of violence and political corruption.
Indians are still somewhat racist, there is a Bollywood slot on Portuguese TV now. Gee, all those actresses look like Europeans, not real Indians. I have friends in India, normal people, none of them looks like those Bollywood stars. But darker-skinned people, especially women, don't seem to be welcome in Bollywood.
Progressive thinkers are in danger these days as the Hindu radicals have created a rather tense atmosphere. Govind Pansare for instance was killed earlier this year because he advocated things conservative Hindus don't like, for instance marriage across different castes.
And of course there is the sexual violence problem, with regard to which even some politicians make absurd statements defending rapists.
My mother is British Indian but my father isn't, and I grew up in London. I've visited India several times and everytime I come back feeling so thankful that my mother married a non-Indian man and that we live in the UK. I can't imagine how horrible it would be to be a young woman growing up in India!
Indian men complaining of racist assumptions against them is a supreme irony given that every advert, film and music video in the country features scantily clad white women being fetishised, groped and generally degraded by horrid, sexually predatory Indian men! It's the single most racist country I have ever been to and it was incredibly embarrassing how much creepy fawning and harassment my blonde friend was subjected to when she decided to visit.
Many of the Indian men you encounter on the streets will spit, empty their noses and excrete on the roads which is just grotesque and uncouth and not something I've encountered in any other countrymen, no matter how poor. I've been stalked, groped and cat called more times each day I spent on the the Indian streets/ in public transport than my entire life in London, which is hardly the safest of cities in itself! There is also a BIG problem with alcoholism amongst working class Indian men and nearly every affluent household will have a maid who is forced to work under in humane conditions (with no formal contract or worker rights) to support her abusive husband's drinking habit.
Indian culture raises men to be dowry gold-diggers (all other patriarchal cultures have the opposite, a bride price, to compensate women for their domestic labour and their sacrifice in moving into and caring for the husband's family) and social life for the upper classes revolves around gaudy, obscenely ostentatious wedding paid for by the bride's family, where the groom proudly accepts jewellery, cars, expensive watches from his bride! And so much of the daily gossip I've witnessed revolves around how much to save and spend for a daughter's wedding or how much a son's new wife is going to be 'worth'. This is especially distasteful when juxtaposed with the obvious and crippling poverty in the country.
I think this definitely makes South Asian countries the worst for women because not one other patriarchal culture (be it East Asia, Middle East or North Africa) would condone men shameless exploitating their wives financially instead of providing for them (it's so bad that thousands of women are killed each year for not giving their husbands enough gold / land / cash). So in my opinion the way in which India differs from Thailand and China (other than these obviously being far more economically and infrastructurally developed) is that it is a lot more unsafe for women (for example, even in the small towns in China and Thailand I regularly saw women in western clothes cycling and riding their scooters around at all hours without worry) and there is dowry rather than bride price, which alters social dynamics very significantly and makes it a much more misogynistic society.
So visiting India is an eye opening experience for me because it teaches me to be thankful for everything I have and to realise how very tough some women have it but it's just about my least favourite/ most uncivilised country in every imaginable way and it is without question the worst politically stable place for a woman to visit, especially a white woman.
Last edited by GirlFromDalston; 11-16-2015 at 04:06 PM..
Indian culture raises men to be dowry gold-diggers (all other patriarchal cultures have the opposite, a bride price, to compensate women for their domestic labour and their sacrifice in moving into and caring for the husband's family)
its good you mention about the dowry. I am at a loss how come Indian women "buy" their husbands only to end up as "servants". ironic isn't it? its just like you buy a rock to knock yourself with
I love Indian women, they seem to like me a lot. We have a lot in common even thou I am a Russian and German Jew. I love the Indian culture of education and family.
its good you mention about the dowry. I am at a loss how come Indian women "buy" their husbands only to end up as "servants". ironic isn't it? its just like you buy a rock to knock yourself with
Yes, it is so baffling to me that Indian men are culturally permitted to demand money/ gold/ expensive cars and yet they can still expect the respect of patriarchal providers and have women wait on them hand and foot (often women won't eat until they've finished serving men etc)!
I've had it explained to me that the woman traditionally didn't work so the dowry was her share of expenses. They don't realise how exploitative it is for a woman to leave her family and care for her husband's, to do all the housework and childcare, to respect and obey him as the leader in their marriage and yet receive nothing in return from him because it is her family who is subsidising his expenses! And many Indian women work now and still pay dowry.
While other highly patriarchal cultures obviously have their flaws at least the East Asian/ Middle Eastern women can expect a financial provider in return for looking after the home and children, so you do have a partnership. I don't understand how any self respecting woman can accept that her family incurs debts and borrows money to buy her a husband (or in this case, parasite).
Last edited by GirlFromDalston; 11-17-2015 at 05:30 AM..
Yes, it is so baffling to me that Indian men are culturally permitted to demand money/ gold/ expensive cars and yet they can still expect the respect of patriarchal providers and have women wait on them hand and foot (often women won't eat until they've finished serving men etc)!
I've had it explained to me that the woman traditionally didn't work so the dowry was her share of expenses. They don't realise how exploitative it is for a woman to leave her family and care for her husband's, to do all the housework and childcare, to respect and obey him as the leader in their marriage and yet receive nothing in return from him because it is her family who is subsidising his expenses! And many Indian women work now and still pay dowry.
While other highly patriarchal cultures obviously have their flaws at least the East Asian/ Middle Eastern women can expect a financial provider in return for looking after the home and children, so you do have a partnership. I don't understand how any self respecting woman can accept that her family incurs debts and borrows money to buy her a husband (or in this case, parasite).
Theoretically, everything you said makes sense. But you dorealize that change happens with each generation? No, I am not trying to defend‘buying’ a husband. But there is a change, there are more men standing up tothe fact that they don’t want dowry. Yes, a big percentage still want themoolah but this phenomena cannot change overnight. A lot of girls and herparents are learning to say No too.
India has progressed from an era where education for girlsmeant a mere stamp on their ‘marriage bio-data’ to actually opting for acareer. I don’t think a guarantee to receive financial support is considered a partnership.Like western countries a big chunk of Indian women work not because they are supposed to but because they want to.
I've had it explained to me that the woman traditionally didn't work so the dowry was her share of expenses.
isn't it the dowry goes to the groom's parents? so that if the groom is a doctor, the higher the dowry? this is to compensate the grooms' parents for their expenses in raising the groom and not as a seed/capital for the newly weds?
pardon if im ignorant of where the dowry goes
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