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Old 01-27-2017, 05:46 PM
 
Location: In the heights
22,114 posts, read 23,627,108 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 415_s2k View Post
I'm back in my wife's hometown and so far have had four Chinese meals, which got me thinking about this thread. For all the derisive talk about how people have never had "real Chinese food" and thus can't appreciate it, the honest truth is that most people who didn't grow up with "real Chinese food" (as in, home-cooked or simple restaurant fare) would probably walk away leaving 3/4 of the plate untouched.
I think that's actually rapidly changing within US major urban areas now as a much greater variety of Chinese cuisines come in and larger regional Chinese communities have developed in the US in just the last several years (as massive amounts of well-to-do Chinese people have emigrated from China to the US). The kind of Chinese dishes you can see in the San Gabriel Valley back in LA have vastly expanded and it's not just people of Chinese descent going into these now.

The oddest thing is that some of the best Sichuan food I've ever had was not in Sichuan, but in Sydney, and while a slight majority of people eating there were Chinese, there were people from all kinds of ancestry chowing down on it including a huge variety of offal.
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Old 01-30-2017, 10:54 AM
 
1,011 posts, read 627,358 times
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I admit i am no expert in cuisines. but any ordinary chinese know that there is no such thing as Hong Kong cuisine. There are 8 major cuisines in China, one of which is Cantonese cuisine.

I have been to HK many times, and no resturants in HK serve HK cuisine, they just serve cantonese cuisine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
It's weird that you're criticizing an entire massive group of people about not having any idea about culinary culture, but at the same time are explicitly showing how little you actually know of culinary culture. It's very impressive!

strad was talking about the perception of Chinese food in America from a larger sociological perspective, but that doesn't mean he's saying that Chinese food doesn't do fancy or isn't diverse or isn't good--he's making an observation that an uninformed perspective on Chinese food is similar to your perspective on other cuisines which makes for great irony.

Honestly, what's the difference between someone in the US arguing that Chinese cuisine is just msg and soy in an oily brown sauce with stir-fried miscellanea over some rice and someone from China arguing that US cuisine is just fast food burgers, hot dogs, and fries or that Italian cuisine rests on pizza? These are all pretty silly and come from the same place of making large statements about another culture without much experience or knowledge.

The oddest part is that you're not even that aware of Chinese culinary culture and aren't aware of any differences in Hong Kong cuisine versus other Chinese cuisines and you've also somehow never run across a restaurant in China touting itself as serving Hong Kong cuisine. It might just be that regardless of what country you're talking about including your own, your culinary knowledge is pretty limited.
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Old 01-30-2017, 10:57 AM
 
1,011 posts, read 627,358 times
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your understanding of chinese food is from your experience in american chinese food. LOL. how stupid is that?

American chinese food is not chinese food. just like Mcdonald's is not representive of western cuisines.

Quote:
Originally Posted by strad View Post
Yes, Italians only eat Pizza, that is the entirety of their cuisine. Thank you for your valuable contributions to this topic.
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Old 01-30-2017, 12:13 PM
 
Location: In the heights
22,114 posts, read 23,627,108 times
Reputation: 11606
Quote:
Originally Posted by gen2010 View Post
I admit i am no expert in cuisines. but any ordinary chinese know that there is no such thing as Hong Kong cuisine. There are 8 major cuisines in China, one of which is Cantonese cuisine.

I have been to HK many times, and no resturants in HK serve HK cuisine, they just serve cantonese cuisine.
Who in Paris says they serve Parisian cuisine or in Buffalo say they serve Buffalo wings? You don't need the extra modifier when you're at the location.

It'd be more understandable if the comparison in the title was Hong Kong cuisine versus Cantonese cuisine since it's like one subsection of a cuisine being compared to a larger whole that it's a part of (like it's similar analogue one step up the hierarchy is also silly if it's Chinese cuisine versus Cantonese cuisine). However, the title wasn't that--it was Guangzhou versus Hong Kong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gen2010 View Post
your understanding of chinese food is from your experience in american chinese food. LOL. how stupid is that?

American chinese food is not chinese food. just like Mcdonald's is not representive of western cuisines.
He never said any of that--he said that it is was equally silly to have an understanding of Italian cuisine as pizza (and who know what pizza you're accustomed to). He's actually agreeing with you on the same principle that judging Chinese food on the basis of American Chinese cuisine is inaccurate, but you're having a difficult time with reading. When he said you should "look in the mirror", that's a colloquial phrase for noting what you said is ironic because you seem to be making the same logical error that you're trying to argue against. Does that make more sense now?
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Old 01-30-2017, 12:42 PM
 
1,011 posts, read 627,358 times
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well, it is you who have reading difficulty. That guy said this: I hate to spoil your food superiority complex but for the vast majority of Americans Chinese food is also fast food. Nobody says "I want to go to a fancy restaurant, how about Chinese?" No, fancy is Italian, Japanese, French, or upscale American--Chinese is not something American would typically consider upscale.


So he is understanding chinese food from american perspective. For me, i would definitely consider many chinese resturants upscale. and for me, italian food means pizza and american food means Mcdonald's.

Two countries/cuisines that are best in the world are Chinese and French



Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
Who in Paris says they serve Parisian cuisine or in Buffalo say they serve Buffalo wings? You don't need the extra modifier when you're at the location.

It'd be more understandable if the comparison in the title was Hong Kong cuisine versus Cantonese cuisine since it's like one subsection of a cuisine being compared to a larger whole that it's a part of (like it's similar analogue one step up the hierarchy is also silly if it's Chinese cuisine versus Cantonese cuisine). However, the title wasn't that--it was Guangzhou versus Hong Kong.



He never said any of that--he said that it is was equally silly to have an understanding of Italian cuisine as pizza (and who know what pizza you're accustomed to). He's actually agreeing with you on the same principle that judging Chinese food on the basis of American Chinese cuisine is inaccurate, but you're having a difficult time with reading. When he said you should "look in the mirror", that's a colloquial phrase for noting what you said is ironic because you seem to be making the same logical error that you're trying to argue against. Does that make more sense now?
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Old 01-30-2017, 12:46 PM
 
1,011 posts, read 627,358 times
Reputation: 283
If you understand a little bit Chinese history, you would know Guangzhou is called Canton. so cantonese cuisine is pretty much equal to Guangzhou cuisine. Not a long ago, HK is a just village, and most of its residents are descendents of villagers in Canton province, who don't really understand much about cuisine

Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
Who in Paris says they serve Parisian cuisine or in Buffalo say they serve Buffalo wings? You don't need the extra modifier when you're at the location.

It'd be more understandable if the comparison in the title was Hong Kong cuisine versus Cantonese cuisine since it's like one subsection of a cuisine being compared to a larger whole that it's a part of (like it's similar analogue one step up the hierarchy is also silly if it's Chinese cuisine versus Cantonese cuisine). However, the title wasn't that--it was Guangzhou versus Hong Kong.



He never said any of that--he said that it is was equally silly to have an understanding of Italian cuisine as pizza (and who know what pizza you're accustomed to). He's actually agreeing with you on the same principle that judging Chinese food on the basis of American Chinese cuisine is inaccurate, but you're having a difficult time with reading. When he said you should "look in the mirror", that's a colloquial phrase for noting what you said is ironic because you seem to be making the same logical error that you're trying to argue against. Does that make more sense now?
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Old 01-30-2017, 07:18 PM
 
Location: In the heights
22,114 posts, read 23,627,108 times
Reputation: 11606
Quote:
Originally Posted by gen2010 View Post
well, it is you who have reading difficulty. That guy said this: I hate to spoil your food superiority complex but for the vast majority of Americans Chinese food is also fast food. Nobody says "I want to go to a fancy restaurant, how about Chinese?" No, fancy is Italian, Japanese, French, or upscale American--Chinese is not something American would typically consider upscale.


So he is understanding chinese food from american perspective. For me, i would definitely consider many chinese resturants upscale. and for me, italian food means pizza and american food means Mcdonald's.

Two countries/cuisines that are best in the world are Chinese and French
Did you try reading the whole post? He is saying you have the same perspective as them--you're just reiterating it. The logic here is straightforward. You know full well that Chinese cuisine isn't confined to what perhaps an average American without much experience to the large variety Chinese cuisine offers thinks. That's obviously silly. However, you're admitting yourself that your experience of another nation's cuisine is extremely limited while making the statement that what you know must encompass what there actually is, hence the phrase, take a look in the mirror.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gen2010 View Post
If you understand a little bit Chinese history, you would know Guangzhou is called Canton. so cantonese cuisine is pretty much equal to Guangzhou cuisine. Not a long ago, HK is a just village, and most of its residents are descendents of villagers in Canton province, who don't really understand much about cuisine
I know that. Cantonee cuisine is used in place of Yue cuisine in English. Guangzhou certainly has an important role, but things shift. Hong Kong hasn't been a small village for a very long time now, and has in the meantime developed some of its own local dishes and eating habits different from Guangzhou though the continued emigration from Guangzhou and other nearby regions has continued to play a large role.
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Old 01-30-2017, 07:18 PM
 
Location: Guangzhou, China
9,779 posts, read 13,347,718 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gen2010 View Post
If you understand a little bit Chinese history, you would know Guangzhou is called Canton. so cantonese cuisine is pretty much equal to Guangzhou cuisine. Not a long ago, HK is a just village, and most of its residents are descendents of villagers in Canton province, who don't really understand much about cuisine
... And now its one of the world's top cities. Its been a metropolis for over a century. And in that time, empires have shifted, world wars have happened... And it has left a cultiral imprint no matter whether anyone likes it or wants ro recognize it, or not.

Come to GZ, go into a HK restaurant, tell them that there's no such thing as HK food....
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Old 01-31-2017, 05:57 AM
 
10,847 posts, read 11,250,780 times
Reputation: 7578
Quote:
Originally Posted by 415_s2k View Post
... And now its one of the world's top cities. Its been a metropolis for over a century. And in that time, empires have shifted, world wars have happened... And it has left a cultiral imprint no matter whether anyone likes it or wants ro recognize it, or not.

Come to GZ, go into a HK restaurant, tell them that there's no such thing as HK food....
HK is a large city, of course it will have somewhat distinct food scene from food from Guangzhou.

That being said, it is still fair to say HK food can still be put under the broad category of "Cantonese food" in general. That's the whole point. It is not distinct enough to claim there is a thing called "Hong Kong food", just a variation of Cantonese food.
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Old 01-31-2017, 07:32 AM
 
Location: In the heights
22,114 posts, read 23,627,108 times
Reputation: 11606
Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
HK is a large city, of course it will have somewhat distinct food scene from food from Guangzhou.

That being said, it is still fair to say HK food can still be put under the broad category of "Cantonese food" in general. That's the whole point. It is not distinct enough to claim there is a thing called "Hong Kong food", just a variation of Cantonese food.
I think the argument might be better made for HK food being a subset of a general regional Cantonese cuisine (the cuisine of traditional Guangdong province and places that speak Cantonese), and to consider what's in Guangzhou as another subset of Cantonese cuisine. It's pretty reasonable that the food in Hong Kong and Guangzhou would be extremely similar since they are both subsets of Cantonese cuisine, of course, but the question was what are the differences.

The question was pretty straightforward, but somehow went pretty off into the wilderness.
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