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Old 05-15-2019, 09:48 PM
 
226 posts, read 52,585 times
Reputation: 34

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Quote:
Originally Posted by manolopo View Post
Which CBD of Jakarta? Because there are several. Are you comparing all of BGC to all of the CBDs of Jakarta (which aren't all combined in one area)? That doesnt seem fair.


SCBD is only 45 hectares. Mega Kuningan is another 54 hectares. Rasuna Epicentrum is another 54 hectares, Kuningan Persada is 17 hectares. These would all be considered small/medium CBDs in Manila. Even if you combined all of them together, that's still only 170 hectares, which is smaller than BGC.

BGC is 200+ hectares. And then there’s another separate part of BGC which is McKinley Hill/McKinley West, that’s another 80 hectares.

Makati CBD (including all the walkable areas like Salcedo Village, Legazpi Village, Greenbelt, and Ayala Avenue) is 150+ hectares. And if you include all the surrounding wealthy residential areas in Makati, it goes up to 700 hectares. Makati also has poor areas, a redlight district, and a large golf course, but I’m not including those areas in the numbers.

And there are other small CBDs in the north part of Makati which are Rockwell, Century City, and Circuit Makati. They're going to eventually be connected. Combined they're about 40 hectares and they're going to continue to expand because its the new part of Makati.

Ortigas has traditionally been the second major CBD- it’s 100 hectares and continually expanding. And like Makati, it’s surrounded by a lot of wealthy residential areas. It goes up to 600+ hectares when you include those neighborhoods.

Eastwood City is 17 hectares. Newport City is 25 hectares

Bay City is 500+ hectares of completely newly developed land. A lot of stuff is already built, but there’s still a lot more to come. This will be the next major CBD

Alabang is 240 hectares and if you include the wealthy residential areas around it, it comes out to almost 1,000 hectares.

Some old minor CBDs include Downtown Manila, Binondo (Chinatown), and Cubao but I wouldn’t consider these areas as nice areas.

There are more CBDs currently being built like Arca South, Circuit Makati, Vertis North, Greenfield District, etc etc. There are tons coming up all over the place.

Outside of the CBDs, it’s not all poverty. The largest city in Metro Manila is Quezon City and it’s mostly just suburban residential areas. Same with Marikina, Las Pinas, and Muntinlupa. They're all mostly clean, middle-class areas.
Just cut it short.
If you make long @ss story like that, people who never actually visit will think that MetroManila is as big as ginormous Shanghai, while in fact it's NOT. CBDs in MetroManila are located close to one another. The distribution of tall buildings is concentrated in this relatively small area.






And this is Jakarta

If you judge based on mere data of SCBD is only 45 hectares. Mega Kuningan is another 54 hectares. This is what they look like in real life.



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Old 05-15-2019, 10:02 PM
 
393 posts, read 103,724 times
Reputation: 93
Um, SCBD and Mega Kuningan are closer to each other than BGC and Makati are. So how are you going to say that Manila's CBDs are too concentrated? Ortigas is close to them but a little further North. Eastwood is further north, and so is Cubao. Binondo, downtown Manila, Newport City, and Bay City are all along Manila Bay. And Alabang is way far south.

The only difference I see is that Jakarta's skyscrapers are more stretched out along highways (like Dubai), while Manila's skyscrapers are clustered.

And the CBDs of Manila are still separate CBDs. Some of them are growing close to each other and will probably connect in the near future, like Makati, BGC, Ortigas, and maybe even Bay City. They could become one huge CBD in the middle of Manila. I dont see how this is a bad thing though. It would be nice to have one big developed area in the middle of the city.


Also, people who know how big hectares are should clearly understand that im not trying to say Metro Manila's CBDs are as big as Shanghai. If they know how big hectares are, they would realize
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Old 05-15-2019, 10:10 PM
 
226 posts, read 52,585 times
Reputation: 34
This one will be the 5th U/C Supertall in Jakarta.

Sudirman Place
Currently is still in land clearing and preparation stage.



progress


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Old 05-15-2019, 10:13 PM
 
393 posts, read 103,724 times
Reputation: 93
And this pic is taken from an interesting angle.



BGC on the left, Ortigas on the right closest to the camera, and Makati in the background in the middle. In the far distance you can kinda see Binondo and/or old downtown Manila. You cant see other CBDs like Alabang, Eastwood, Newport, Bay City, Cubao, etc. This pic is just the central part, the big three CBDs. If all three of those grew together, it would be a good thing. I dont see how its a bad thing that they're close together

Last edited by manolopo; 05-15-2019 at 10:57 PM..
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Old 05-15-2019, 10:25 PM
 
393 posts, read 103,724 times
Reputation: 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Landove View Post
This one will be the 5th U/C Supertall in Jakarta.

Sudirman Place
Currently is still in land clearing and preparation stage.



progress



I just dont see the appeal with the way they're set up. They're stretched out along the highway and not close to each other. A lot of empty space in between. Doesnt look cohesive at all.


Here's Makati CBD, and this pic is old already. But see how cohesive it is? This whole part of Makati is easily walkable



BGC is developing in the same way, but with more green spaces. Ortigas has developed in the same way but not as nice. Eastwood is like this, but miniature version. Same with Newport City. Manila doesnt just build skyscrapers just to look nice.
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Old 05-15-2019, 10:26 PM
 
Location: Singapore
27 posts, read 28,400 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manolopo View Post
And the CBDs of Manila are still separate CBDs. Some of them are growing close to each other and will probably connect in the near future, like Makati, BGC, Ortigas, and maybe even Bay City. They could become one huge CBD in the middle of Manila. I dont see how this is a bad thing though. It would be nice to have one big developed area in the middle of the city.


Also, people who know how big hectares are should clearly understand that im not trying to say Metro Manila's CBDs are as big as Shanghai. If they know how big hectares are, they would realize
That would be great, but I doubt it. The government is focusing more on New Clark City & Pampanga to alleviate Manila's woes more than anything else right now.
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Old 05-15-2019, 10:29 PM
 
25 posts, read 3,740 times
Reputation: 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by manolopo View Post
So all of Central-South Jakarta is one big CBD and it's all developed? That's like saying all of the central and southern part of Metro Manila (Makati, Mandaluyong, Pasig, Taguig, Muntinlupa, Parañaque, Pasay, San Juan, Las Piñas, Pateros) is one big CBD, but its obviously not all developed. I dont even say all of Makati is one big CBD. I only count the developed parts because Makati has some poor neighborhoods in the north and east parts.


Binondo is ok and it's still thriving because lots of Chinese businesses and condos are there and the land value is among the highest in the country. It just looks like a mess compared to the other CBDs. Of the old parts of Manila city, it's my favorite neighborhood. Ermita & Malate were largely destroyed during WW2 and they havent really recovered. Thats technically "downtown Manila"
That's not the point, he said BGC is bigger than Jakarta's cbd area. I don't even understand why bigger is better here.

Its pretty clear where the cbd of Jakarta is and how much area it covers, you can chose to not include the kampung area.. but it would still not make BGC any bigger.

Quote:
Originally Posted by manolopo View Post
Um, SCBD and Mega Kuningan are closer to each other than BGC and Makati are. So how are you going to say that Manila's CBDs are too concentrated? Ortigas is close to them but a little further North. Eastwood is further north, and so is Cubao. Binondo, downtown Manila, Newport City, and Bay City are all along Manila Bay. And Alabang is way far south.

The only difference I see is that Jakarta's skyscrapers are more stretched out along highways (like Dubai), while Manila's skyscrapers are clustered.

And the CBDs of Manila are still separate CBDs. Some of them are growing close to each other and will probably connect in the near future, like Makati, BGC, Ortigas, and maybe even Bay City. They could become one huge CBD in the middle of Manila. I dont see how this is a bad thing though. It would be nice to have one big developed area in the middle of the city.


Also, people who know how big hectares are should clearly understand that im not trying to say Metro Manila's CBDs are as big as Shanghai. If they know how big hectares are, they would realize
Well to be fair that makes the cbd not as clustered as you claim them to be, since they're built in "different cities". Not a bad thing at all. The difference is while Jakarta develop naturally along the major avenues, in Manila you have private developers building different cbd.

Last edited by Mangadi; 05-15-2019 at 10:39 PM..
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Old 05-15-2019, 10:30 PM
 
226 posts, read 52,585 times
Reputation: 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by manolopo View Post
Um, SCBD and Mega Kuningan are closer to each other than BGC and Makati are. So how are you going to say that Manila's CBDs are too concentrated? Ortigas is close to them but a little further North. Eastwood is further north, and so is Cubao. Binondo, downtown Manila, Newport City, and Bay City are all along Manila Bay. And Alabang is way far south.

The only difference I see is that Jakarta's skyscrapers are more stretched out along highways (like Dubai), while Manila's skyscrapers are clustered.

And the CBDs of Manila are still separate CBDs. Some of them are growing close to each other and will probably connect in the near future, like Makati, BGC, Ortigas, and maybe even Bay City. They could become one huge CBD in the middle of Manila. I dont see how this is a bad thing though. It would be nice to have one big developed area in the middle of the city.


Also, people who know how big hectares are should clearly understand that im not trying to say Metro Manila's CBDs are as big as Shanghai. If they know how big hectares are, they would realize
You said Makati is 700 bla bla bla, while SCBD is only 45 bla bla bla Mega Kuningan 54 bla bla bla. In other words Makati is larger than 7 times of SCBD-MegaKuningan. I just wanna clarify that this is MISLEADING. The real built up area of SCBD-Mega Kuningan is more than enough to swallow whole Makati.

Be objective and see the larger aerial view of Jakarta and MetroManila. You can still see clusters of tall buildings in Jakarta ouside and far away from SCBD-MegaKuningan. Even North Jakarta is still missing from that pic.

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Old 05-15-2019, 10:36 PM
 
393 posts, read 103,724 times
Reputation: 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by nutra View Post
That would be great, but I doubt it. The government is focusing more on New Clark City & Pampanga to alleviate Manila's woes more than anything else right now.
Have you been to Manila recently? BGC, Makati, Ortigas, and Bay City are still booming with construction everywhere. New Clark City will be a secondary capital but Metro Manila will still be the most important city for business. Just like when Indonesia builds its new capital, Jakarta will still be most important.
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Old 05-15-2019, 10:44 PM
 
393 posts, read 103,724 times
Reputation: 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Landove View Post
You said Makati is 700 bla bla bla, while SCBD is only 45 bla bla bla Mega Kuningan 54 bla bla bla. In other words Makati is larger than 7 times of SCBD-MegaKuningan. I just wanna clarify that this is MISLEADING. The real built up area of SCBD-Mega Kuningan is more than enough to swallow whole Makati.

Be objective and see the larger aerial view of Jakarta and MetroManila. You can still see clusters of tall buildings in Jakarta ouside and far away from SCBD-MegaKuningan. Even North Jakarta is still missing from that pic.

I'm only counting developed CBD areas. I mention when I'm counting extra wealthy residential areas that aren't CBD. So Makati CBD is about 170 hectares. The CBDs in northern Makati are another 40. BGC including McKinley Hill/McKinley West is 280 hectares. Ortigas is 100. Eastwood is 17. Newport is 25. Bay City is 500, but its not fully built yet. Alabang is 240, but it's more spread out like Jakarta's CBDs. It's in a more suburban part of Manila, like South Jakarta. I'm not counting Binondo or downtown Manila because they're a mess. Not counting Cubao either. So just CBD areas alone (not counting surrounding areas or areas in between) Manila’s CBDs are much bigger than Jakarta's CBD areas alone.

Just because SCBD and Mega Kuningan are spread out along highways and are kinda connected in that way doesnt mean that all the areas in between are part of the CBD. Some of those areas arent even developed or nice. Jakarta's CBDs will continue to spread out along highways but that doesnt really make them bigger. You're coming from a very Jakarta/Dubai perspective where you think more skyscrapers spread all over the place is better. Talk to me when you guys build a clustered, walkable city like Makati CBD.

Last edited by manolopo; 05-15-2019 at 11:18 PM..
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