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Old 03-17-2018, 10:34 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mattks View Post
abor rights (especially for women, things like extended time off for pregnant women),
Yes! Maternal leave is another good example (like universal healthcare) of something that pretty much every developed nation in the world except the US views as normal-- not "liberal."
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Old 03-18-2018, 05:27 AM
 
Location: Taipei
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkylarkPhotoBooth View Post
This. It makes no sense taking a US political framework and trying to apply it to another country, and especially not across the East/West cultural divide.

My experience is that East Asians can be very "conservative" (by western definitions) within their own families (though it varies from family to family), but generally take more of a live-and-let-live attitude ("liberal" or arguably "libertarian") toward those not within their family. They don't have the tendency to want to impose their morals on strangers the way many "conservatives" in the US do.

Taiwan has voted to legalize same sex marriage, and it's only a matter of time before Japan does, too. (Polls show the majority favor it.) Transgender identity has long been more acceptable in some SE Asian countries than it is in the US. Now would the average family approve of this in their own children? Probably not. But as far as it being illegal for others? They don't really care.

And of course, as in most of the world, the countries that can afford to do so have relatively strong social safety nets in East Asia when compared to the US, including universal healthcare. Americans would call this "liberal," but most of the world just calls it "being decent to each other."
Taiwan didnít vote to legalise SSM. The Grand Justices decided that the impossibility on SSM is unconstitutional. Thereís a quite a difference between the two. It will come into effect in a year precisely because the political climate is nowhere near liberal. There are still plenty of opposition going on and the legislature are too ballless to legalise it (actually their core values are pretty much anti-liberal so itís not at all a surprise that they are trying to stall it for as long as possible).

And Taiwan is the outlier on issues as such. Japan is not gonna legalise it any time soon. And the other countries arenít even remotely interested.
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Old 03-18-2018, 05:51 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Greysholic View Post
Taiwan didnít vote to legalise SSM.
Okay, a court ruled in favor of it, in line with public opinion. In other words, the same thing that happened in the US and is happening gradually all over the world. Japan will get on board soon if public opinion is any indicator (and it usually is, in democracies).
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Old 03-18-2018, 08:37 AM
 
Location: Macao
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Originally Posted by Bettafish View Post
The conservative vs liberal division does not fit East Asian society.
I agree.

The Liberal/Conservative US divide is ridiculous and contradictory. It wouldn't fit anywhere.

I hate the division, you say anything that fits either conservative/liberal, and than you have are expected to defend a half million other liberal/conservative things.

I also find it fascinating how when anything happens in the U.S., no one will share an opinion until they go to their side's sources to read/hear what they are supposed to say or think. You also hear contradictory things at times, because of how things shift so quickly with liberal/conservative leaders.

In short, I don't see how anywhere in Asia could fit into the U.S. liberal/conservative divide.
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Old 03-18-2018, 09:55 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Tiger Beer View Post
I agree.

The Liberal/Conservative US divide is ridiculous and contradictory. It wouldn't fit anywhere.
It barely even fits in the US anymore.
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Old 03-18-2018, 10:09 AM
 
Location: Taipei
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkylarkPhotoBooth View Post
Okay, a court ruled in favor of it, in line with public opinion. In other words, the same thing that happened in the US and is happening gradually all over the world. Japan will get on board soon if public opinion is any indicator (and it usually is, in democracies).
I think you're really overestimating LGBT acceptance in Asia. Germany and Australia's public opinion had been in favour of it for a decade before they finally legalised it last year. It's gonna take far longer for far more conservative societies like Japan.
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Old 03-18-2018, 10:58 AM
 
Location: DFW
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I can't speak for the other groups but traditional Chinese culture has some parallels to conservative American culture (think the South), mostly in the area of Family Values.

But they're also quite different in areas, like, say, religious values.

Most are either against or indifferent to welfare.. I don't think I've ever met any Chinese or Chinese American who welcomed welfare.
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Old 03-19-2018, 12:07 AM
 
Location: Macao
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Originally Posted by Greysholic View Post
I think you're really overestimating LGBT acceptance in Asia. Germany and Australia's public opinion had been in favour of it for a decade before they finally legalised it last year. It's gonna take far longer for far more conservative societies like Japan.
I agree. People in Asia just don't think about it...it's not even on the radar.

That being said, it's fascinating how OPEN it is in some parts of Asia - i.e. you have ladyboys and gay beauty pageants throughout Thailand and the Philippines...you even have teen gay beauty pageants which is more like gay teens in drag throughout even small towns in the Phils.

YET...you'll have guys like Manny Pacquaio publicly tell everyone how someone who is gay will go to Hell, etc. It's quite interesting how open and closed some of these Asian societies can be at the same time.

All that being said, the concept of GOVERNMENT being proactively creating law and policy for LGBT is not something that Asian societies think in terms off...they just don't about it at all.
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Old 03-19-2018, 12:14 AM
 
Location: Macao
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Originally Posted by ragnarkar View Post
I can't speak for the other groups but traditional Chinese culture has some parallels to conservative American culture (think the South), mostly in the area of Family Values.
I've always found that interesting. The majority of Asian immigrants to the U.S.A. definitely fall more in line with REPUBLICANS - strongly. But they vote Democrat.

Oddly enough the Republican Party does nothing to embrace them whatsoever. They tend to shun them, if anything, or fear them, or persecute them. It's fascinating how little awareness that Republicans have about immigrants, but it isn't their base anyway. So they just don't care.

But, in general, people from Asia are more about economics and money-making business opportunities. They have little interest in income equality, gay rights, or anything like that. U.S. Republicans seem to paint ALL immigrants as welfare-loving Democrat-voting lazy-ass types.

Last edited by Tiger Beer; 03-19-2018 at 12:32 AM..
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Old 03-19-2018, 12:21 AM
 
Location: Macao
15,945 posts, read 36,144,182 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkylarkPhotoBooth View Post
Yes! Maternal leave is another good example (like universal healthcare) of something that pretty much every developed nation in the world except the US views as normal-- not "liberal."
JAPAN is pretty amazing in that regard, by the way.

Actually insanely proactive about it. The government actively gives a ton of financial support and every other support to give Mom time with their kids and newborns. So much so, that it has a backlash that the Japan gov't seems to want Mom's at home more than in the workplace.

JAPAN also lead the world in PATERNAL rights, oddly enough. 30 weeks of PAID LEAVE for any Father in Japan. South Korea is #2 in paid Paternal Leave at 16. Nowhere comes close except for a small handful of European countries between 4-8 weeks.
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