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Old 12-28-2018, 08:08 PM
 
Location: Taipei
6,773 posts, read 5,119,529 times
Reputation: 4565

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Why are you guys even engaging in conversations with the OP? He's like a broken record. Just ignore him.
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Old 12-31-2018, 11:00 AM
 
1,011 posts, read 628,280 times
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there is just one chinese language, which is Chinese. Cantonese is not a language. no different than local dialects in Shangdong, dongbei, beijing, etc. So i don't get it when people want to specify which chinese language they speak


Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler View Post
Those kinds of postings are using in written Chinese, but your topic is about the use of the term "Mandarin" in the English language. When it comes to jobs that has some level of interpreting and/or translating which can be higher-paying jobs, then yes, it's very important to make that distinction because that distinction has semantic value and you're communicating in the job posting that you need a specific skillset.



This is really simple--it depends on context.

Again, this isn't something specific to Chinese/Mandarin as there are other parts of the world that are nation-states with different and often related languages and there is no real hard cut-off for when something is a dialect versus a closely related language.

People have patiently explained all of the above to you, but you seem to be really stuck. What exactly is your difficulty here? Is it possibly stemming from being on an English language forum, but not being a proficient English speaker?

Do you speak any Chinese languages aside from Putonghua?
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Old 12-31-2018, 11:03 AM
 
Location: State of Transition
78,615 posts, read 70,508,089 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gen2010 View Post
Only when you apply for a restaurant job in Chinatown.
Nope. If you apply for a job that involves partners in Hong Kong, for example.
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Old 12-31-2018, 11:05 AM
 
Location: State of Transition
78,615 posts, read 70,508,089 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gen2010 View Post
there is just one chinese language, which is Chinese. Cantonese is not a language. no different than local dialects in Shangdong, dongbei, beijing, etc. So i don't get it when people want to specify which chinese language they speak
Because some linguists classify them as separate languages. Norwegian and Swedish are really just dialects, but they're classified as separate languages, even though easily mutually intelligible. Mandarin and Cantonese aren't mutually intelligible.

But I imagine this could be debated ad infinitam.
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Old 12-31-2018, 11:21 AM
 
1,011 posts, read 628,280 times
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so it is the same if you are in Shanghai or in Sichuan. What's so special about Guangdong hua?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
Nope. If you apply for a job that involves partners in Hong Kong, for example.
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Old 12-31-2018, 11:24 AM
 
1,011 posts, read 628,280 times
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there are a hundred local dialects in China which are not intelligible with Mandarin. there is a large number of Overseas chinese who speak cantonese. that's why it receives so many attention. but to average chinese people, cantonese is just another local dialect. actually there are more Wu dialect speakers than cantonese speakers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
Because some linguists classify them as separate languages. Norwegian and Swedish are really just dialects, but they're classified as separate languages, even though easily mutually intelligible. Mandarin and Cantonese aren't mutually intelligible.

But I imagine this could be debated ad infinitam.
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Old 12-31-2018, 02:20 PM
 
Location: Outside US
1,195 posts, read 471,357 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gen2010 View Post
where is that term coming from? i think it is the only case where you have a national language called a completely different name in English
It's very common to have a language called something different in English (or any language) than it's actual language.

As for the name of countries, "China" is not called china in Mandarin or Cantonese.


Same with English as an example.
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Old 12-31-2018, 04:00 PM
 
6,725 posts, read 6,602,936 times
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Whether Cantonese is a "language" is a matter of convenience and sometimes politics. In China it is never called a language.
However, some foreigners asked me "do you speak Mandarin or Cantonese", it is also a little awkward. Only 5% people in China speak Cantonese. All (under 50) can speak Mandarin as a second "language" at least. And there are many more other dialects.
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Old 01-02-2019, 06:48 AM
 
Location: Elysium
6,580 posts, read 3,634,743 times
Reputation: 4568
Quote:
Originally Posted by gen2010 View Post
there are a hundred local dialects in China which are not intelligible with Mandarin. there is a large number of Overseas chinese who speak cantonese. that's why it receives so many attention. but to average chinese people, cantonese is just another local dialect. actually there are more Wu dialect speakers than cantonese speakers
So little different than Tagalog politically becoming Filipino as Marcos tried to bond the country under a language other than first Spanish and then English. However with many Filipinos up to the current President Duterte are said to speak better English than they do Filipino/Tagalog most English speakers will say Tagalog instead of Filipino because many of the Pinoys that they run into do not speak much of the local dialog of the capital region, Tagalog

It comes back to the semi joke that the difference between a language and a dialect is that a national army demands the use of a language. Now Mandarin being separate from Chinese in English instead of being like Castilian becoming Spanish is due to the extensive ties with Chinese who like the Pinoys who don't speak 'Filipino" don't speak the Mandarin dialect of Chinese.
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Old 01-02-2019, 07:49 AM
 
6,725 posts, read 6,602,936 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Taiko View Post
So little different than Tagalog politically becoming Filipino as Marcos tried to bond the country under a language other than first Spanish and then English. However with many Filipinos up to the current President Duterte are said to speak better English than they do Filipino/Tagalog most English speakers will say Tagalog instead of Filipino because many of the Pinoys that they run into do not speak much of the local dialog of the capital region, Tagalog

It comes back to the semi joke that the difference between a language and a dialect is that a national army demands the use of a language. Now Mandarin being separate from Chinese in English instead of being like Castilian becoming Spanish is due to the extensive ties with Chinese who like the Pinoys who don't speak 'Filipino" don't speak the Mandarin dialect of Chinese.
It's not exactly the same. All of China share the same written language, which is based on Mandarin de facto.
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