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Old 05-11-2019, 02:50 AM
 
25 posts, read 14,310 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dangerous-Boy View Post

^this



pinoys need to talk giving themselves spanish and islamic names.


Indonesia still uses kafir names even though the majority follow the foreign bedoiun ways.


That's because prior to nationalism, religious identity and ethnic bulcrap (which was introduced by colonialism).. overwhelming majority of the population retained their indigenous religion. Similarly during the period of so called "Buddhist-Hindu" (which does not actually identify as religion back then), the population have remained indigenous, with only the aristocracy probably being more serious about it. Indonesian historical realms have almost NEVER forced religion upon their subjects (because to them its simply a "way of life"). Unlike traditional Muslim sultanates, Indonesian realms do not recognize currency.. hence Jaziya simply don't exist. Up to the 19th century overwhelming population of Java still doesn't have "money". Which means that conversion to Islam simply don't have push factor like in Medieval Egypt and Levant, nor there was major conflict among faiths. (Yes Indonesian didn't burn ancient temples, in fact some shrines in Java were still worshipped) In fact by the early 20th century, some 80-90% of the population never attended mosque and does not read Arabic (which the majority only barely do anyway).

As a result indigenous elements continued up till today. I've always wondered why the most populous Muslim country never had magnificent Mosques of Delhi or Damascus, nor there was that many historical mosques. So I studied them and found out that all I've been told in my schools were mostly lies.

Unfortunately during the new order era (under Suharto) people HAVE to chose 5 recognized religion of the state, so majority just identify with being labeled as "religion" that they're most familiar with. Like many old way practioner in Java identified as Catholicts, simply because they just happened to be attending Catholic schools. Or "Hindu" so they could have separate identity. But just because they HAVE identified with a religion, doesn't mean that they change their way of life that easily, hence the so called "kafir" names you said.
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Old 05-13-2019, 06:34 PM
 
Location: Earth
7,643 posts, read 6,468,224 times
Reputation: 5828
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mangadi View Post
That's because prior to nationalism, religious identity and ethnic bulcrap (which was introduced by colonialism).. overwhelming majority of the population retained their indigenous religion. Similarly during the period of so called "Buddhist-Hindu" (which does not actually identify as religion back then), the population have remained indigenous, with only the aristocracy probably being more serious about it. Indonesian historical realms have almost NEVER forced religion upon their subjects (because to them its simply a "way of life"). Unlike traditional Muslim sultanates, Indonesian realms do not recognize currency.. hence Jaziya simply don't exist. Up to the 19th century overwhelming population of Java still doesn't have "money". Which means that conversion to Islam simply don't have push factor like in Medieval Egypt and Levant, nor there was major conflict among faiths. (Yes Indonesian didn't burn ancient temples, in fact some shrines in Java were still worshipped) In fact by the early 20th century, some 80-90% of the population never attended mosque and does not read Arabic (which the majority only barely do anyway).

As a result indigenous elements continued up till today. I've always wondered why the most populous Muslim country never had magnificent Mosques of Delhi or Damascus, nor there was that many historical mosques. So I studied them and found out that all I've been told in my schools were mostly lies.

Unfortunately during the new order era (under Suharto) people HAVE to chose 5 recognized religion of the state, so majority just identify with being labeled as "religion" that they're most familiar with. Like many old way practioner in Java identified as Catholicts, simply because they just happened to be attending Catholic schools. Or "Hindu" so they could have separate identity. But just because they HAVE identified with a religion, doesn't mean that they change their way of life that easily, hence the so called "kafir" names you said.

bring back garuda
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