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Old 03-04-2009, 10:34 PM
 
Location: So. of Rosarito, Baja, Mexico
6,652 posts, read 18,673,644 times
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Nihonkitty: I was in Japan (1951) for a year with the US military. Nothing bad to say or bad experiences in the country. Learned a few words...had a real nice girlfriend while there...even thought of marriage. The military was real negative towards any thoughts in that direction.

Reading your posts is informative in a way that I never fully understood while being there. Of course it was after the war and we were occupation in a sense. None of the men I was with ever looked down on anyone...in fact things were educational.(won't go into detail)

One thing I remember being in Tokyo...Mt Fuji...Yoshida...Yaminaka...Kumagiya to Hachanoe (Sendei) was the problem some people not understanding a few words I learned. Was told that there were seven dialects in the country. Is this true? Reason I ask is due to your comparison of someone coming to the house (maybe from another part of the island) and not understanding them even if they were Japanese.

Am I explaining myself correctly or am I off base?

Again it's been a long time. I looked up via Google map the places that I was at and do not recognize anything which is obvious considering the time lapse in years. Everything is built up or changed.

I still remember the basic phrases in Japanese...the usual good morning/afternoon/evening...take it easy...don't worry about it...come here etc...even the words and how to sing a real old Japanese song. How to count money (change) the list goes on. I enjoyed my time there and was called "Ichero-san".

Sure this post will give you a good laugh and seem a little ridicules which is okay with me...what the heck...life should be fun. Steve.

 
Old 03-05-2009, 05:53 AM
 
895 posts, read 2,145,413 times
Reputation: 358
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Bagu View Post
Nihonkitty: I was in Japan (1951) for a year with the US military. Nothing bad to say or bad experiences in the country. Learned a few words...had a real nice girlfriend while there...even thought of marriage. The military was real negative towards any thoughts in that direction.

Reading your posts is informative in a way that I never fully understood while being there. Of course it was after the war and we were occupation in a sense. None of the men I was with ever looked down on anyone...in fact things were educational.(won't go into detail)

One thing I remember being in Tokyo...Mt Fuji...Yoshida...Yaminaka...Kumagiya to Hachanoe (Sendei) was the problem some people not understanding a few words I learned. Was told that there were seven dialects in the country. Is this true? Reason I ask is due to your comparison of someone coming to the house (maybe from another part of the island) and not understanding them even if they were Japanese.

Am I explaining myself correctly or am I off base?

Again it's been a long time. I looked up via Google map the places that I was at and do not recognize anything which is obvious considering the time lapse in years. Everything is built up or changed.

I still remember the basic phrases in Japanese...the usual good morning/afternoon/evening...take it easy...don't worry about it...come here etc...even the words and how to sing a real old Japanese song. How to count money (change) the list goes on. I enjoyed my time there and was called "Ichero-san".

Sure this post will give you a good laugh and seem a little ridicules which is okay with me...what the heck...life should be fun. Steve.
Hmm i dont find it ridiculous at all. 7 Dialects? Well it might be more then that, ever since the meiji restoration the standard japanese became the kanto dialect. But everysingle dialect is understandable, i for example speak one of the most "different" japanese dialect on the mainland which is from wakayama/kansai region, but everybody understands me even in tokyo, but they can tell where i am from though. The only places where its truely not understandable are some of the ryukyuan islands (in okinawa they speak standard now) but even they speak standard nowadays, even though i have an "accent" compared to kanto speech it doesn't really make me any different than somebody from tokyo since i have the same religion language culture food customs etc with them. And all japanese learn when they are little about japanese regions/history etc so these dialects aren't foreign, especially if they are understandable.

The only exception i know of is Okinawa/ryukyuan islands, though their languages are related to japanese and are in same family they were their own kingdom for many years, so they might be the only "foreign" "japanese" in japan. But even then their religion is basically the same, their language is related (its like spanish-italian), alot of the customs/food are the same etc.

Actually now that i think of it my dialect is really unique, Osaka which is the major cultural center for my region, while it is the main "kansai dialect" and the representative of my region in japan, my city while it's dialect is very close to Osaka is very isolated. My city was a small village for a long time and hadn't really opened up to the rest of japan in a cultural sense until post-ww2, so the way i speak for kanto speakers is interesting for them . By the way even my city would probably be "xenophobic" if a ton of tokyo-ites moved into it lol, but not the same if it were "gaijins" though for the reasons above.

Last edited by Bibi12; 03-05-2009 at 06:04 AM..
 
Old 03-05-2009, 10:04 AM
 
419 posts, read 1,162,791 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NihonKitty View Post
Do you have a degree in japanese history/studies/culture or something? Xenophobia does not equal superiority, look it up yourself, english isn't even my main language and i know that. Japanese don't think they're superior, and if you think so you don't understand japanese mentality at all. My grandparents always ask me about US and tell me how "its better" than japan (without having even been to US alot of the older generation thinks this is of the US since ww2) yet, they still wouldnt want americans moving to japan. Does that mean japanese think they are superior or inferior to americans then? There is no superiority involved here at all. It has to do with being unacustomed to other people/races/cultures, not with japanese thinking they are "raised to think they are #1 in everything" where in gods name did you get that from? Japanese are raised to think they're #1 in everything? Give me a break. Japan was isolated from the world for hundreds of years, and even today it still isolates itself. Japanese are not used to other people, and people tend to fear things they are not used to.


By the way japanese are just as xenophobic as south koreans and chinese, but patriotism is almost non existant in japan compared to the US.


Were you raised in japan, do you have japanese parents? Grandparents? How would you know this? Have you atteneded japanese school?
2003-2006 lived in Tokyo (Toshima)...

i think we will have to agree to disagree...

patriotism in the US is... real and fake. It didn't exist in its current form until 9/11. I was surprised how when I was in Canada all the flags i saw.. now it's the opposite.
 
Old 03-05-2009, 11:21 AM
 
Location: East of the Sun, West of the Moon
15,504 posts, read 17,728,729 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NihonKitty View Post
it's not about being superior or hating, since its probably easy to make friends and we will be polite to you, it's just the general attitude is japan is for japanese only.
And the general attitude in many parts of America is that America is for Whites only, not out of a sense of superiority, just good old-fashioned racism.


ABQConvict
 
Old 03-05-2009, 08:30 PM
 
2,449 posts, read 4,812,170 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skrazzle View Post
2003-2006 lived in Tokyo (Toshima)...

i think we will have to agree to disagree...

patriotism in the US is... real and fake. It didn't exist in its current form until 9/11. I was surprised how when I was in Canada all the flags i saw.. now it's the opposite.
The US has been ultra-patriotic way before 9/11. Perhaps you are from a particular area, but people in the US have long thought everything in our country is the best. Polls have shown this. The US is pretty consistently patriotic. There was a spike after 9/11, but arguments over flag-burning and such have been going on longer than that. This shows a constancy from 1999- before 9/11. I'm sure there are others if you bother to find them.

Pew Research Center: Who Flies the Flag? Not Always Who You Might Think
 
Old 03-05-2009, 08:50 PM
 
Location: Las Vegas, NV
700 posts, read 2,333,568 times
Reputation: 398
Quote:
Originally Posted by skrazzle View Post
The fantasy is easy a reality in tokyo... japanese girls love americans. Not for a relationship... but just for pickin em up.. its easyyy.

For a relationship their parents will prob look down on them getting serious with anyone who is not the same nationality.

Thats the other thing... you will be treated differently... thats not to say people wont like you when they get to know you... but you are pretty much... well inferior in their mind, and not in a racist way... just how japanese are raised, to believe japan is #1 in everything.

Also be prepared to give up big spaces.... you can get by and live comfortable if you don't try to live like an american. People also keep to themselves a lot...

The economy is down worse then the US, if you want a job there your best bet is to get one teaching english as there are companies that will pay you to move there and put you up in a place for a year....
This I know, I'm in Roppongi quite a bit for my business...
It may be easyyyyyy....but it costs moneyyyyyy.
But with all the bankers gone, this guy might stand a chance.

Its really quite sad to watch the punters in R6 hunting for the girl du jour....
But picking up girls is just as easy in America and the advantage is that you speak the same language.

And still my point is the reality is usually different from the fantasy in ones mind....moving to Japan for girls is about the stupidest thing. Visiting?....well thats different.
I have lived here for 3 years and I have seen many come and go....quite the poorer for it.

5
 
Old 03-06-2009, 02:08 AM
 
Location: Va Beach
3,508 posts, read 12,158,764 times
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5chevin5, you are absolutely correct in your last paragraph.
 
Old 03-06-2009, 05:51 AM
 
895 posts, read 2,145,413 times
Reputation: 358
Quote:
Originally Posted by 5chevin5 View Post
This I know, I'm in Roppongi quite a bit for my business...
It may be easyyyyyy....but it costs moneyyyyyy.
But with all the bankers gone, this guy might stand a chance.

Its really quite sad to watch the punters in R6 hunting for the girl du jour....
But picking up girls is just as easy in America and the advantage is that you speak the same language.

And still my point is the reality is usually different from the fantasy in ones mind....moving to Japan for girls is about the stupidest thing. Visiting?....well thats different.
I have lived here for 3 years and I have seen many come and go....quite the poorer for it.

5
Roppongi hills is the most foreigner friendly place in all of japan There are alot of expats there, did you meet alot of foreigners there too? I never lived there only visited but i heard there's alot of westerners there.

Last edited by Bibi12; 03-06-2009 at 05:59 AM..
 
Old 03-06-2009, 05:53 AM
 
895 posts, read 2,145,413 times
Reputation: 358
Quote:
Originally Posted by ABQConvict View Post
And the general attitude in many parts of America is that America is for Whites only, not out of a sense of superiority, just good old-fashioned racism.


ABQConvict
American racism (slavery and all of that) can't be compared to xenophobia. Koreans and chinese but especially koreans can be indistuinguishable from japanese, yet japanese are still "xenophobic" vs them, even if they are the same race. And this is true unfortunately, even japanese-brazilians, as in they are 100% ethnic japanese but born in brazil when they move back to japan are also treated as 'gaijin'. So in japans case race isnt involved. And japanese are polite and friendly to everybody, regardless of race.

Quote:
Originally Posted by skrazzle View Post
2003-2006 lived in Tokyo (Toshima)...

i think we will have to agree to disagree...

patriotism in the US is... real and fake. It didn't exist in its current form until 9/11. I was surprised how when I was in Canada all the flags i saw.. now it's the opposite.
Disagree about what? You haven't showed me a single thing showing japanese are raised to think they're #1 in everything, that is the most ridiculous thing i have ever heard. BTW Are you fluent in japan from those years?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluebeard View Post
The US has been ultra-patriotic way before 9/11. Perhaps you are from a particular area, but people in the US have long thought everything in our country is the best. Polls have shown this. The US is pretty consistently patriotic. There was a spike after 9/11, but arguments over flag-burning and such have been going on longer than that. This shows a constancy from 1999- before 9/11. I'm sure there are others if you bother to find them.

Pew Research Center: Who Flies the Flag? Not Always Who You Might Think
I did 1 year of foreign exchange in my high school in the US, and americans seemed just as patriotic as today, the only difference was the amount of flags on cars. My host family, kids (college aged) would always tell me how americans invented this, or did this first, or are #1 in this etc, in japan this doesn't happen. They were also super proud of their military . But other then that i loved my host family lol.

Last edited by Bibi12; 03-06-2009 at 06:03 AM..
 
Old 03-06-2009, 06:20 AM
 
895 posts, read 2,145,413 times
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This is just a blog entry, but its by my very very good japanese friend. She made this post during the olympics. I think it's pretty accurate on japanese nationalism/patriotism

Quote:
Recently i have been thinking about japanese nationalism...
After i saw an strong proudness from chinese people for their country and American people who is cheering American athletes so hard in olympic, i started to think if Japanese can be like that, If japanese have such a great prondness of our country.

The answer is "no"

Nowadays in Japanese society, we can't find any national flag easily. There is almost no occation to sing the national song during school life, nobody has prominence knowledge about our traditional culture especially in a young generation and most of people doesn't care about a religion so much.
How come can we have a strong bond of nationalism?
Why our nationalism had declined is originated to the way we grew up from World WarⅡ. We cut any nationalism out after the war because it was thought too dengerous and violent. Also The teacher union had discuss about how to teach nationalism to children and decided not to force children to sing the national song and not to show the flag so often except for formal accemblies or events concering about our horrorble behavior during the war.
Then... furtunately we had a huge growth for technology and economy and our life became very comfortable without great nationalism.
I think we should be proud more of our country with amazing technology, transportation, many kinds of delicious meal, cool fasion and a lot of things that was imported but convirted with our original way. If i started to explain about good aspect of japan, i couldn't stop it! However it is sad for the truth that many people in Japan doesn't have a strong nationalism.
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