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Old 04-17-2011, 11:00 PM
 
Location: Terra firma
1,374 posts, read 1,356,980 times
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What a sad and contemptible creature man would be if he were not capable of an intrinsic morality unmotivated by fears of burning in ever lasting hell fire. The problem with Christians is that their "faith" does not extend to man himself.
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Old 04-18-2011, 02:43 AM
 
7,802 posts, read 5,286,683 times
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I have heard, for example, Militant Christian Homophone Dinesh D'Souza tell people in Live debates that he could not even think of a single reason for giving his seat to an Old Woman on a bus if he were not religious.

That is the standard of people on the debating circuit alas.

To play devils advocate however, most theists do not actually say we could not be moral without a god. That is just a strawman many Atheists build up about Theists... which is not surprising given the existence of amoral people like Dinesh.

To be accurate... what they say (which is just as wrong, but at least it is what most of them actually say) is that while being moral we have no BASIS for arguing what is good and bad morality unless we ground that morality in an objective moral law giver.

I have on many occasions argued as to why they are wrong here.
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Old 04-18-2011, 02:58 PM
 
16,300 posts, read 24,981,174 times
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Religion Gave us our Morals

Oh, I agree, religion has given many people morals. Not necessarily good morals, or morals that make society a safer or better place, but morals like their god, rooted in hatred, selfishness and revenge.
Lie, cheat steal, kill and discriminate are all christian morals.
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Old 04-18-2011, 03:10 PM
 
8,468 posts, read 13,659,754 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peregrine View Post
If it wasn't for religion we would have no morals.
Statements like this always frighten me. They imply that without religion, people would be immoral. I'm often told that without God, people wouldn't know right from wrong. Really? So you need someone else to tell how to treat others? You can't figure out on your own that murder, rape, etc. are wrong? Now that's truly scary. That ranks right up there with "do good things and you'll be rewarded in heaven." In other words, you need to be bribed to do the right thing. And if that weren't bad enough, you won't actually get that reward until after you die. How cruel.
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Old 04-18-2011, 03:49 PM
 
Location: Cincinnati
638 posts, read 1,034,276 times
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Here in America, it used to be against the law to marry outside of your race, and churches wouldn't marry a black/white couple. What's moral about that?
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Old 04-18-2011, 04:23 PM
 
Location: NC, USA
7,088 posts, read 13,053,872 times
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"You realize that it takes more faith to believe that we came from pond scum than to believe that God created us."


I do have faith in science and mathematics, they are real, provable, science really has no serious argument with religion, any more than any rational adult would have an argument with "The Cat in the Hat" It serves no function to argue with fiction.
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Old 04-18-2011, 07:35 PM
 
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Old 04-20-2011, 12:02 AM
 
5,733 posts, read 4,642,063 times
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More like Morals gaves us Religion
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Old 04-20-2011, 07:10 AM
 
8,468 posts, read 13,659,754 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peppermint View Post
"You realize that it takes more faith to believe that we came from pond scum than to believe that God created us."
This statement just shows the person has no clue what science is about. I don't need to have faith in something that I can prove. That's like saying I need faith to prove the Earth is round. No, anytime I have doubts that the Earth is round, I can go out and prove to myself that I was right. This is the problem with debating people of faith. They don't have a clue about how we think. It ranks up there with asking "why do you hate God?" How can you hate something you don't believe in?
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Old 04-20-2011, 08:56 AM
 
16,300 posts, read 24,981,174 times
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