U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Atheism and Agnosticism
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 09-15-2011, 08:19 PM
 
705 posts, read 943,324 times
Reputation: 320

Advertisements

Christopher Hitchens is right, religion does poison eveything.

Eight Amish Men Jailed Over Orange Safety Triangles - ABC News


Only a very ignorant person would go to jail because their religous beliefs preclude them from complying with laws. That's sad. I can't help but pity religous zealots Moderator cut: deleted

Last edited by june 7th; 10-01-2011 at 01:38 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 09-16-2011, 04:03 AM
 
39,020 posts, read 10,812,637 times
Reputation: 5080
While one likes to leave people to their opinions where it does not affect others, one cannot expect the law to be waived in deference to religious foibles. The tail cannot wag the dog, but too often religious demands is placed ahead of man - made law.

We had this with a registrar refusing to marry same - sex couples and a muslim demanding that she be excused from handling bacon. There was also a BA employee wanting the dress - code changed to accommodate her religious trinket.

While one is suspicious of setting precedents, straining at gnats does seem petty, but where the law is concerned, we have to decide whether it can be waived in view of religious objections, or not.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-16-2011, 04:12 AM
 
Location: North Beach, MD on the Chesapeake
33,876 posts, read 42,076,783 times
Reputation: 43276
Thoreau was ignorant, then?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-16-2011, 08:35 AM
 
39,020 posts, read 10,812,637 times
Reputation: 5080
Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
Thoreau was ignorant, then?
No. His stand was on a moral basis. While one might take issue with the reasoning, it was not done simply because of some rather pointless religious tradition.

"It is Thoreau’s extremely personal response to being imprisoned for breaking the law. Because he detested slavery and because tax revenues contributed to the support of it, Thoreau decided to become a tax rebel. There were no income taxes and Thoreau did not own enough land to worry about property taxes; but there was the hated poll tax – a capital tax levied equally on all adults within a community." (a pretty standard Bio -quote)

An abolitionist atheist could well have done the same.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-16-2011, 02:54 PM
 
705 posts, read 943,324 times
Reputation: 320
Quote:
Originally Posted by kiggy View Post
Moderator cut: Orphaned
Totally hysterical. Reminds me of the fools that complained at Jacob Riis Park ans started a riot because the park officials wouldn't allow them in with their long head scarves. I can't fathom why people like this can't seem to understand that this is America, there are laws, we all have to abide by them. If we don't like them we have elections every certain November where we speak through the voting booth. The majority rules. There are plenty of other places and countries to live in if they can't seem to live within the statutory boundaries of this one.

Last edited by june 7th; 10-01-2011 at 01:41 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-16-2011, 02:59 PM
 
Location: North Beach, MD on the Chesapeake
33,876 posts, read 42,076,783 times
Reputation: 43276
Quote:
Originally Posted by AREQUIPA View Post
No. His stand was on a moral basis. While one might take issue with the reasoning, it was not done simply because of some rather pointless religious tradition.

"It is Thoreau’s extremely personal response to being imprisoned for breaking the law. Because he detested slavery and because tax revenues contributed to the support of it, Thoreau decided to become a tax rebel. There were no income taxes and Thoreau did not own enough land to worry about property taxes; but there was the hated poll tax – a capital tax levied equally on all adults within a community." (a pretty standard Bio -quote)

An abolitionist atheist could well have done the same.

And morals evolved from?

As a note I'm not religious but threw in here because of the unnecessary abuse that the Amish receive from people. Did they get arrested for disobeying a law? Yes. Will they complain about it? Likely not. They took a stand based on their beliefs, something that 90% of people in this country will not do unless it's safe to do so.

In other words, to reference partially Tom Hagen in The Godfather, they're Sicilians.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-16-2011, 06:57 PM
 
1,112 posts, read 1,024,715 times
Reputation: 414
Since when does a bright orange safety reflector have anything to do with modesty? Where in the bible does it say that bright orange safety reflectors are immodest? Wouldn't god consider the safety and saving of lives more important than how an orange triangle looks on a buggy? People who think like this scare me....
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-16-2011, 07:18 PM
 
39,020 posts, read 10,812,637 times
Reputation: 5080
Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
And morals evolved from?
I'd suggest from evolved instinct and reasoning. Not from God before any theist suggests it.

Quote:
As a note I'm not religious but threw in here because of the unnecessary abuse that the Amish receive from people. Did they get arrested for disobeying a law? Yes. Will they complain about it? Likely not. They took a stand based on their beliefs, something that 90% of people in this country will not do unless it's safe to do so.

In other words, to reference partially Tom Hagen in The Godfather, they're Sicilians.
I agree they took a stand and accepted the jail (their religion would not allow them to pay a fine) with dignity. That does not alter the fact that they placed their religious convictions above the law. It's admittedly a religious - skeptical view that the law was broken for pointless reasons so (as I see it) it had no worthwhile point.

I generally do not agree with breaking the law even for good reasons. If the law is wrong, change it, don't ignore it. I can see that where a nation's view is wrong and one is forced to make a choice, one might have to stick with moral principles. The way I see it is that you can't have little religious states in a country where the law of the land doesn't run.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-16-2011, 07:41 PM
 
16,300 posts, read 24,947,967 times
Reputation: 8282
This is a prime example of ancient superstition over ruling even common sense.

To drive a black buggy at 5 MPH without something to enhance its visibility especially near dawn/dusk or in the rain, to traffic overtaking at 10+ times their speed, of 50+ MPH is just stupid.

Everyone has the right to be a stupid as they wish, but not when they have their children in that buggy, and an innocent horse pulling it. Part of the privilege of using the highways is not only to follow the rules, but to also not to be a hazard to others.

The bad haircuts should also rate at least a fine.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-16-2011, 08:29 PM
 
16,083 posts, read 17,876,536 times
Reputation: 15867
Quote:
Originally Posted by AREQUIPA View Post
I generally do not agree with breaking the law even for good reasons. If the law is wrong, change it, don't ignore it. I can see that where a nation's view is wrong and one is forced to make a choice, one might have to stick with moral principles. The way I see it is that you can't have little religious states in a country where the law of the land doesn't run.
How did we change the laws? Often a protest and doing jail time was the way to get the laws changed. Or are you forgetting the lessons of the civil rights movement.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Atheism and Agnosticism
Similar Threads
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top