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Old 10-26-2011, 03:28 PM
 
Location: Chicagoland
417 posts, read 311,744 times
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I'm a Catholic but prefer elected officials that base their policies off of rational reasoning that isn't based off religion. You can be an atheist and be for or against abortion without using religion, just as you can be Christian and be for or against abortion without using religion. Same with all other issues.
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Old 10-27-2011, 04:38 PM
 
Location: Metromess
11,798 posts, read 22,045,226 times
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That is a good way of looking at it, all right.
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Old 10-28-2011, 01:05 AM
 
Location: KYLE TEXAS
431 posts, read 399,630 times
Reputation: 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by cpsTN View Post
So, what you are saying is that is OK for the atheists to remove - by the courts - Christianity from our lives, but it would be wrong for someone to hear the word God everyday? If you don't believe, what difference should it make? As far as forced ideas, the ACLU likes to force the "freedom FROM religion" ideals on all the rest of us. Can't have prayer in schools (although the Constitution doesn't say you can't), can't have Bibles or crosses, many times even on private property...

Charles Sands
37129
prayers should not be said in school religion is a private matter
and if we allowed prayer in school which prayer would it be ?? I bet you would object strongly if a wigan prayer was chosen

I as a atheist certianly dont see any *wrong * or would complain if a religious symbal ( any faith ) were constucted on private property as long as it was not funded by public money .

if there is *public money * involved you have a problem

Last edited by JohnA151; 10-28-2011 at 01:43 AM..
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Old 10-28-2011, 01:30 AM
 
Location: KYLE TEXAS
431 posts, read 399,630 times
Reputation: 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by 007.5 View Post
Our present Culture promotes atheistic philosophies (moral relativism, truth is relative, entitlement attitudes, sexual relativism, pornography, killing of developing Americans while in the womb, wider spread Adultery / Swinging / and other desired perversions, et al..) which are constructs based on the assumption that 'there is no God' to whom we are morally accountable toward and thus we are totally autonomous to live as we like according to the dictates of our will . The cultural shift clearly became evident to all when we as a nation abandoned our Nations founding Christian principles of objective moral laws and values required for the maintenance of a civil society ...in favor of Post Modernism / secularism which promoted distinct forms of hedonism for maximized narcissism , with devastating measurable consequences. It didnt take long did it ?
What crap.
who is to ditate the morals of others? and if we should let it be that the catholics choose shall we then have sexual abuse of minors in our society , if we choose the mormans shall we then have multiple wives. if we choice islam shall we then be able to beat or kill our wives legally . seems to me the looseness or lack there of of morals sits squarely on the shoulders of the holier than thou religious groups .
nothing wrong with pornography( of which the definition varies with each person ) swinging ,perversions (whatever that means )etc if you dont care for any of the above dont participate .

abortion should be and will remain a legal choice .
if and i say IF there is a god let him decide on the punishment if he so decrees that abortion is not exceptable to him

where in the bible does he 'god 'give you or anybody else the power to act on his behalf second quess him and punish those who in your opinion disobey his word
if he is supreme let him judge not you .
you are no better or more qualified to judge other humans than i am ...
by the way in the foundling fathers objective moral principles which were NOT founded on chrisitanity does slavery become acceptable
they also commited adultery and other *immoral* acts
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Old 10-28-2011, 03:35 PM
 
Location: KYLE TEXAS
431 posts, read 399,630 times
Reputation: 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by AKrunner88 View Post
I'm a Catholic but prefer elected officials that base their policies off of rational reasoning that isn't based off religion. You can be an atheist and be for or against abortion without using religion, just as you can be Christian and be for or against abortion without using religion. Same with all other issues.
Well said some folks use rational thinking instead of just following dogma .
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Old 10-29-2011, 12:11 PM
 
4,067 posts, read 7,703,981 times
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I would be opposed to an Athiest. It would be great not to have a Christian right wackjob like Perry not around, but a leader should have some sort of spirituality. An open minded person who observes various faiths and even believes in Aliens would get my vote.
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Old 10-30-2011, 05:35 AM
 
Location: Tampa, FL
2,637 posts, read 10,980,516 times
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I doubt I'll ever see it happen. Predjudice against atheists is just far too strong, just look at the post above mine. A leader must be spiritual. What a crock. There is no religious test for the office of the Presidency and no reason why an atheist could not do it as well as a spiritualist.

However, I honestly never thought I'd see a black President in my lifetime, and yet there he is. You never know what the future may hold.
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Old 10-31-2011, 11:01 PM
 
Location: Somewhere out there
9,616 posts, read 11,407,222 times
Reputation: 3735
Default Wow! This thread has produced serial loads of cr@p! Such as....

Quote:
Originally Posted by cpsTN View Post
So, what you are saying is that is OK for the atheists to remove - by the courts - Christianity from our lives, but it would be wrong for someone to hear the word God everyday? If you don't believe, what difference should it make? As far as forced ideas, the ACLU likes to force the "freedom FROM religion" ideals on all the rest of us. Can't have prayer in schools (although the Constitution doesn't say you can't), can't have Bibles or crosses, many times even on private property...

Charles Sands
37129
Yes, Charles, it WOULD be tragically wrong for our children and/or citizens to have to hear the word GOD every day, especially when it came to the transmission of The Daily Word of God show. Ever see that shouting dictatorial spiritual leader in the movie "1984"? Fit your bill?

Now, some short but very appropo comments from GSTroop's enviably clear mind....

Quote:
Originally Posted by GCSTroop View Post

√ First of all, show me an example of private property not allowed to bear a Bible or cross by its owners.

√ Second of all, Christianity should be removed from every aspect of government. It is a wretched, wasteful, demeaning, repugnant, and selfish religion full of hypocrisy, hatred, and demagoguery.

√ It is an offensive religion that asks that I must respect it, that refuses to listen to reason, that infects the minds of our children to make them think there is some magical being that must be worshiped and obeyed like we humans are nothing more than the dogs of a celestial dictator.

Our government should have no bias, no law and no regulation based on religious principles - Christianity included. Christianity asks that we limit the rights of individuals to suit the false moral fiber of religious societies because the biggest part of being a Christian is often about not being true to oneself.

√ Christianity will stop at nothing to infect itself as the mind-virus of the people.

√ It offers promises of eternal life for those who believe but eternal damnation to those who don't.

√ Christianity has milled itself into a platform of current right wing American politics that associates itself with "anti-socialism."

√ Yet, we have people who wish for this sort of thing to take center stage in our government... People who wish to pray in school; to let that zombified virus infect the minds of our children.

√ We have people who wish for the so-called "morality" of the Bible to take root in our lives as a people.

√ In reality, what these people are asking for is a state of hypocrisy whereby we can all point a finger at those who venture to defy the societal norms as immoral, bad, people.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThankUMayIHaveAnother? View Post
I wouldn't vote for anyone dumb enough that he identifies himself by his disbelief in God.
Now THAT'S really REALLY insulting to independent-thinking people everywhere. Olde-tyme stodgy, dull-edge Christian-Think on display. WE have a seemingly endless list of potential POTUS candidates who insist on identifying him or herself by the degree of their belief in the right God. Not that immoral Muslim god or those idiotic Mormon God believers. Just that one Abrahamic God will do.

What crap! Wholesale and cheaper by the square foot, apparently.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrummerBoy View Post
An atheist could be a fine President or a terrible one. I don't really see how his lack of belief could be construed as detrimental or advantageous to doing his job.

However, a religious fundmantalist, like, say, a Mike Huckabee could, in certain circumstances, actually pose a danger to us because of his strong Faith. The first example that comes to mind would be in the case of a Cuban Missile-type of a crisis. A fundy POTUS might just think that God will protect us in a nuclear war with China or Russia; so why not push that button? Or he might even go so far as to think that he's acting on God's orders in starting something that might end in what he would think of as Armageddon.
In all fairness, such a scenario is very unlikely; I would like to think that even a religious zealot would know better than that, and even if he did not, that Congress and his Joint Chiefs would reign him in.
But you never know.
But you do, in fact, never know, huh? I mean, since Dub-Yah did indeed insist he heard the word of his God to go to war against the Iraqis. Good thing he didn't have his pinkee on the Big Red Button.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 007.5 View Post
Many things...but certainly a Person who takes our Countrys Founding principles and values seriously without wavering under pressure from anti-Christian agendas ; someone who isnt afraid to restore America to a truly Christian Nation again by taking on the destructive influential giant of our Mass Media that relentlessly promotes atheistic philosophies of relative truth and moral relativism which have brought America to a new low level of widespread anarchy that harms so many . (I know...pretty intolerant isnt it ?) .
Oh puh-leeez.... Oh well... others here will deal with your pathological intolerance, and lack of common sense, and mis-directed ethics. such oddball determinations. I can't bother any longer with such unsubstantiatible nut-ball theories, that "if only we all had Christian standards force-fed down our collective social minds, it would all be a perfect union!! Maybe even public spankings in school if the little toadies didn't conform when they should be fervently praying? I'll just bet you'd go for that too, huh? Rubbish. Such total RUBBISH, and thank God we're protected from it. By our Constitution, BTW. Read it some time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 007.5 View Post
Our present Culture promotes atheistic philosophies (moral relativism, truth is relative, entitlement attitudes, sexual relativism, pornography, killing of developing Americans while in the womb, wider spread Adultery / Swinging / and other desired perversions, et al..) which are constructs based on the assumption that 'there is no God' to whom we are morally accountable toward and thus we are totally autonomous to live as we like according to the dictates of our will . The cultural shift clearly became evident to all when we as a nation abandoned our Nations founding Christian principles of objective moral laws and values required for the maintenance of a civil society ...in favor of Post Modernism / secularism which promoted distinct forms of hedonism for maximized narcissism , with devastating measurable consequences. It didnt take long did it ?
Actually it was a direct result of a headlong run from the constricts of outright and suffocating moral relativism in England and Europe! Christianity can be such a bloody plague; it dealt out death and cultural distress for so many centuries in Europe; it certainly cannot be trusted anymore to provide rational and ethical social leadership. Once in power, it always leads to disaster.

Or as John notes below:

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnA151 View Post
What crap.
who is to ditate the morals of others? and if we should let it be that the catholics choose shall we then have sexual abuse of minors in our society , if we choose the mormans shall we then have multiple wives. if we choice islam shall we then be able to beat or kill our wives legally . seems to me the looseness or lack there of of morals sits squarely on the shoulders of the holier than thou religious groups .
nothing wrong with pornography( of which the definition varies with each person ) swinging ,perversions (whatever that means )etc if you dont care for any of the above dont participate .

abortion should be and will remain a legal choice .
if and i say IF there is a god let him decide on the punishment if he so decrees that abortion is not exceptable to him

where in the bible does he 'god 'give you or anybody else the power to act on his behalf second quess him and punish those who in your opinion disobey his word
if he is supreme let him judge not you .
you are no better or more qualified to judge other humans than i am ...
by the way in the foundling fathers objective moral principles which were NOT founded on chrisitanity does slavery become acceptable
they also commited adultery and other *immoral* acts
Quote:
Originally Posted by loose cannon View Post
I would be opposed to an Athiest. It would be great not to have a Christian right wackjob like Perry not around, but a leader should have some sort of spirituality. An open minded person who observes various faiths and even believes in Aliens would get my vote.
Another insulting wack-job determination! I happen to be very spiritual person, just not one who relies entirely on some non-existent and unvailable pseudo-deity. Wow! What an absolutely fabulous basis for an entire society and laws... Myth and fabrications, and insults that anyone else is morally bankrupt or has lesser ethical standards. I object! Strongly!

Quote:
Originally Posted by tilli View Post
Prejudice against atheists is just far too strong, just look at the post above mine. [rflmn notes: she refers to loose cannon's lost-cannon post that I also found so insulting...] "A leader must be spiritual!"

What a crock. There is no religious test for the office of the Presidency and no reason why an atheist could not do it as well as a spiritualist.
A spiritualist? I'm one of those, but don't specifically identify myself as such and so. I'm just proud to have a capable and highly spiritual but atheistic mindset, and the freedom to be capable of using it in my own personal assessments of this life.

Hey: I'd make one hell of a prez! rifleman for POTUS!

So: can I count of your impartial vote?
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Old 11-01-2011, 07:15 AM
 
Location: Tampa, FL
2,637 posts, read 10,980,516 times
Reputation: 3548
Quote:
Originally Posted by rifleman
A spiritualist? I'm one of those, but don't specifically identify myself as such and so. I'm just proud to have a capable and highly spiritual but atheistic mindset, and the freedom to be capable of using it in my own personal assessments of this life.

Hey: I'd make one hell of a prez! rifleman for POTUS!

So: can I count of your impartial vote?
You know, I did give some thought as to which word to use there. I meant to encompass theists and other religionists; believers in dieties and/or magic. I went with spiritualists to tie back to the previous sentence and to try to include everyone I meant. Apparently it went further than I intended and includes people I didn't mean to include, such as people who enjoy the feeling caused by watching a good sunset or gazing up at the stars and consider that spiritual (see Spiritual Athiest). At any rate, I hope the general intent of the statement was evident?

As for Rifleman for Prez, I must say that I am undecided. I'm assuming that was a joke and I was just supposed to go along with it like this ----> in which case, oops! But on the off chance that you might actually have such aspirations, I might vote for you. But I'd have to hear a lot more from you on other subjects; to see what your specific plans are for the various problems and opportunities facing us. Although I would like to see an end to the demonization of atheists and the kow towing to a particular flavor of ancient mythology in the public sphere, there are really more pressing issues for candidates to concentrate on at the moment.
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Old 11-01-2011, 04:13 PM
 
Location: Ohio
20,089 posts, read 14,333,840 times
Reputation: 16255
Quote:
Originally Posted by loose cannon View Post
I would be opposed to an Athiest. It would be great not to have a Christian right wackjob like Perry not around, but a leader should have some sort of spirituality. An open minded person who observes various faiths and even believes in Aliens would get my vote.
Atheists are spiritual. Religion does not have a monopoly on spirituality, which existed long before religion and long before bizarre beliefs in invisible beings began.

Would that include faith in Santa Clause and the Great Pumpkin?
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