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Old 12-28-2011, 07:07 AM
 
63 posts, read 43,588 times
Reputation: 19

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
Spiritual . . . lkb0714 does NOT speak for this forum and has NO official role in moderating or determining the appropriateness of topics for the three forums represented here. Tell him/ her to take a hike and post whatever you are interested in of a spiritual or philosophical nature. Spirituality is definitely an appropriate topic.
While that may be true, lkb0714 has more knowledge and experience of this forum than I have, so it would only be fair for me to take what he/she has to say on board. I don't want to tell him/her to take a hike, as that would be rude and disrespectful, and I try to treat everyone kindly and politely.

What I'm more disturbed about is lkb0714 making the comment that I think everyone here is mean. I don't think such a thing at all and nowhere in any of my posts have I stated such a thing or implied it. I don't know how they got that impression, but lkb0714 is mistaken on that front. I do not think that people here are mean and I definitely don't believe that atheists in general are mean or unkind. Perhaps there are some occultists who do think that, but I am not one of them.

There are unkind and unpleasant people in all areas of life, so a few are going to surface amongst atheists, but a few are going to surface amongst people of faith as well. It is very short-sighted, in my view, to judge any one "group" of people as a whole. To say that all atheists are rude and closed-minded or that all Christians are unpleasant and bigoted is an unfair and inaccurate generalisation and is something I would never do.

My apologies once again for my misunderstanding of how this forum worked. It was a genuine misapprehension on my part.
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Old 12-28-2011, 12:02 PM
 
16,646 posts, read 14,098,718 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
Spiritual . . . lkb0714 does NOT speak for this forum and has NO official role in moderating or determining the appropriateness of topics for the three forums represented here. Tell him/ her to take a hike and post whatever you are interested in of a spiritual or philosophical nature. Spirituality is definitely an appropriate topic.
I never said I was a moderator but she has repeatedly stated these threads were because she wanted the atheist opinion on "blank". I am fairly certain that also does not include you.

So, as an atheist, I told her why the vast majority of ATHEISTS who responded to these threads are telling her how it is not relate to ATHEISM.
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Old 12-28-2011, 02:13 PM
 
63 posts, read 43,588 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nozzferrahhtoo View Post
Not entirely sure myself but I have heard the etymology of it being assigned to both Micheal Shermer and James Randi. For all I know either or both could be true. I have certainly heard both using it on many occasions so even if they are not the origin they certainly did a lot to popularize it.
That makes sense. I did see or read somewhere that James Randi supposedly started it off, which wouldn't be surprising, given his own views. I don't particularly like the term or its implication (surprise, surprise! ) but I suppose I'll see and hear it used plenty of times, so I guess I may as well get used to it.

So I guess that makes me a "woo-ist", then? Cool!
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Old 12-29-2011, 01:21 AM
 
7,802 posts, read 5,286,683 times
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Not entirely sure that is something to be proud of, but thankfully not my problem.
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Old 12-29-2011, 06:57 AM
 
63 posts, read 43,588 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nozzferrahhtoo View Post
Not entirely sure that is something to be proud of, but thankfully not my problem.
It's just a matter of different perspectives on the matter. I would say I'm less "proud", more happy to be where I am, have my interests where they are, and have my beliefs as they currently stand. I love it!
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Old 12-29-2011, 07:03 AM
 
63 posts, read 43,588 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lkb0714 View Post
I never said I was a moderator but she has repeatedly stated these threads were because she wanted the atheist opinion on "blank". I am fairly certain that also does not include you.

So, as an atheist, I told her why the vast majority of ATHEISTS who responded to these threads are telling her how it is not relate to ATHEISM.
I'm thankful that you did so, but I wish you hadn't made the comment that I thought people on the forums were mean. As I have stated, I don't think that at all and never said I did.

I am thankful for you taking the time to explain things more concisely to me, but I think it was unfair on your part to state something about me that was incorrect.

I don't like people to have a mistaken impression of me, so I usually take great pains to try to correct that when I feel a misapprehension has occurred. It's things like that which I become upset about and obsess over. I'm a fairly obsessive person, due mostly to Asperger's. Sometimes it's a good thing, in that I throw myself whole-heartedly into things, but at other times it can be quite bothersome, especially when I'm fixating over something unpleasant.

I know we all have our crosses to bear, though...it's just ideally, I'd like to live in a world free of problems, where everyone is happy and gets along...like Sesame Street, I suppose. I still watch old clips of Sesame Street on youtube (mostly 80s and 90s.)
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Old 12-29-2011, 07:47 AM
 
7,802 posts, read 5,286,683 times
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Alas my own beliefs are not about what makes me happy, but more about what there is actual reasons to think are true. At present I am not aware of subscribing to any that are entirely devoid of substantiation.
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Old 12-30-2011, 08:29 AM
 
63 posts, read 43,588 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nozzferrahhtoo View Post
Alas my own beliefs are not about what makes me happy, but more about what there is actual reasons to think are true. At present I am not aware of subscribing to any that are entirely devoid of substantiation.
I didn't mean that in quite the way it seems like you thought I did.

I haven't chosen or adopted my beliefs because they make me happy. However, I happen to be happy with them, regardless.

I came to my conclusions for my own reasons. No belief or conclusion was adopted because I thought it would make me happy.

The fact that I am happy with them is simply a bonus that has nothing to do with my reasons for adopting them.

It doesn't just apply to my spiritual beliefs, though. In most areas of my life, I would say I'm pretty much content. (I would like more money, though!)

I don't know if anyone here has experienced depression, but I have, and it really made me value personal contentment and happiness all the more. I think back to that time and remember utter despair and darkness - all you want is for the emotional pain to be over, you literally see no future, you see no way out of what you're experiencing.
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Old 12-30-2011, 11:22 AM
 
Location: Somewhere out there
9,616 posts, read 11,380,837 times
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Wink Enjoying the Thread!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spiritual_Occultist View Post
What I'm more disturbed about is lkb0714 making the comment that I think everyone here is mean. I don't think such a thing at all and nowhere in any of my posts have I stated such a thing or implied it. I don't know how they got that impression, but lkb0714 is mistaken on that front. I do not think that people here are mean and I definitely don't believe that atheists in general are mean or unkind. Perhaps there are some occultists who do think that, but I am not one of them.

There are unkind and unpleasant people in all areas of life, so a few are going to surface amongst atheists, but a few are going to surface amongst people of faith as well. It is very short-sighted, in my view, to judge any one "group" of people as a whole. To say that all atheists are rude and closed-minded or that all Christians are unpleasant and bigoted is an unfair and inaccurate generalisation and is something I would never do.

My apologies once again for my misunderstanding of how this forum worked. It was a genuine misapprehension on my part.
I don't see that you have misunderstood how this forum works. I'd encourage you to continue on your discussions here, and applaud your consistent and polite tone. It's at considerable odds with the tine and demeanor of many Christian and atheist posters, myself included, as some will hotly attest.

But in the spirit of The New Year, I'll also, again, commend you on this thread. "Why not?", as I often like to ask Mystic from time to time (though on other subjects, but it's always a good rejoinder, huh, Mystic?)

So: I'll ask you some of my own questions, those that get into my head whenever I talk with those who are interested in the paranormal:

√ First-off, there must be a desire on your part to either better understand, gain better evidence for, or better substantiate those paranormal occurrences.

(I say this simply because I personally find them all very inconsistent and, in general, so easily explained (or dismissed) by far more rational reasons, so that I tend now to automatically dismiss the majority of them out of hand. Example: I recently lightly investigated the oft-asserted Near Death Experience (NDE) idea, which has, to my mind at any rate, been rather thoroughly debunked, most pointedly by a recent study in some eastern-US hospital surgery clinics using those who "wanted" to participate, in the unlikely situation where they were pronounced temporarily "technically dead". They failed, in 100% of the cases studied, to identify some hidden item...);

√ You may well have had some experience(s) of this type yourself, yes?

(I also see that those people who "appreciate" the paranormal also usually have multiple episodes or experiences, each one being better explained than the last, and often more convincing. Unfortunately, those who are of a more skeptical, and perhaps more scientific bent, usually do not ever experience them. Where do you fit in?)

√ Is there a particular area of branch of the paranormal that you are more interested in? I.e.: ghosts, things moving around on their own, seances, intense personal feelings when around some object, person or place?

√ Are you also somewhat skeptical of these sorts of occurrences in any way, or would you generally "prefer" to believe in them, even if there's perhaps two alternate but 180˚ out-of-reality-synch explanations? Such as:

"Oh, this event I just saw was obviously caused by the ghost of my late brother!"

Or...

"We know there was a minor earthquake in the area this afternoon, and it as that which caused the sofa to lurch across the room".


But, (hypothetically here you understand...) you, perhaps always wanting to somehow get back in touch with your dear departed brother, who you also dream of often, choose to believe the former explanation.

And so on.
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Old 12-30-2011, 06:28 PM
 
Location: Texas
1,303 posts, read 1,856,052 times
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I believe it isn't possible to know (with one-hundred percent certainty) whether there's a god/afterlife or not.

In favor of such a things being real, I've read some quite remarkable stories on such matters that, it true, would sway me to the belief side.

The problem is most, if not all, of these stories are anecdotal. I've read stories of NDE's where people left their bodies and perfectly described the situation around them while out of their bodies. I guess in order for these things to have more creditability, they'd have to be tested in a controlled scientific environment.

Some would argue a bias exist there and such a thing will never happen. Even if someone passed a test, it would have to be "something else" besides one's spiritual self leaving the body and whatnot. There would have to be another explanation or we'd simply resort to not yet knowing on the matter.

This sort of thing gets me back to my original position. We simple don't know and probably never will in our lifetimes.
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