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Funny. The atheists I know aren't the one starting holy wars, promoting jihad/crusades, promoting being bigots and oppressing women, mixing in with other people's marriages that are none of their business...
That's the way he writes. This is a bit of a tricky one - rather surprisingly, as I would have thought it was easy to construct a Perfect world that Shewed forth the glory of something other than the operation of natural forces and random factors.
But I found that I was leaving myself open to accusations of postulating what a god would do.
But it has to be tried. No inexplicable natural disasters, Christians getting away with it time after time while the unfaithful get blown away or buried in avalanches, prayers answered up to and including regrowing missing limbs, no lightning strikes or earthquakes hitting churches, nature being a bit less unpleasant than it is and humans being a bit less like animals than we are, angels more visible, God coming across to His spokesmen with pretty astounding knowledge that could only come from Him, if not a few personal appearances to keep us on line, and of course outing a few of the flock who go badly off the rails, just to keep His church pure.
That off the top of my head is a world that we would expect if a God was in charge...oh, yes, of course, the obvious one. Less of the back and forth of warfare. Those on His side would always win. Afghanistan would have been done and dusted by now..hell, it shouldn't have even been necessary. The Pope would have been warned about 9/II and the AQ operatives picked up before they'd finished soloing on the Cessnas.
Well, you see the argument. The world we have makes far more sense if lifeforms are evolved, natural accidents are not 'acts of god' and history is random.
To the OP, from your perspective what kind of world would you find if a creator did exist?
What we see is that our existence is consistent with naturally operating laws. But with a supernatural god hanging around, there's no reason this should be. If he wanted us to survive with our current physiology in an atmosphere that's totally hostile to us, no problem. Just magic it into being reality. We wouldn't be able to explain it, but it would happen because it's what the creator wanted.
There are lots more ways for life to be around in violation of natural laws than there are for them to exist and be consistent with it. So at a first pass we'd expect it to be more likely that if a creator existed we'd end up in an environment hostile to us. One where we can find no natural explanation for our survival rather than one which is well suited to us.
That's assuming there's no reason for a creator to try and trick us into thinking she doesn't exist, of course. But if that's the case, nothing we can do can differentiate it from a universe without a creator so there's no point in worrying about it.
Re: Thomas line about sarcasm: Thom, ewlde chep, understand this: I do for the most part only have those two modes:
1) is to get ticked and go for the facts, of which, in the modern life sciences arena, there's a long and ponderously pedantic list, and then I get to write a blog about 14" long, or,
when I think "Oh what the heck";
2) to be pointedly sarcastic about it, since after all, to me, the Christian adherence to their ponderous rulebook requirements and enchanting little fairy tale unicorn and Arkbarge stories (see? Here I go!) are in themselves quite a funny hoot, and yah just gotta take it lightly, else we'd all go directly to the asylum. I mean, surely, you guys don't actually belie..... oh well, don't get me started. Or it'd be back to Mode 1!
Quote:
Originally Posted by AREQUIPA
That's the way he writes.
This is a bit of a tricky one - rather surprisingly, as I would have thought it was easy to construct a Perfect world that Shewed forth the glory of something other than the operation of natural forces and random factors.
But I found that I was leaving myself open to accusations of postulating what a god would do.
But it has to be tried. No inexplicable natural disasters, Christians getting away with it time after time while the unfaithful get blown away or buried in avalanches, prayers answered up to and including regrowing missing limbs, no lightning strikes or earthquakes hitting churches, nature being a bit less unpleasant than it is and humans being a bit less like animals than we are, angels more visible, God coming across to His spokesmen with pretty astounding knowledge that could only come from Him, if not a few personal appearances to keep us on line, and of course outing a few of the flock who go badly off the rails, just to keep His church pure.
That off the top of my head is a world that we would expect if a God was in charge...oh, yes, of course, the obvious one. Less of the back and forth of warfare. Those on His side would always win. Afghanistan would have been done and dusted by now..hell, it shouldn't have even been necessary. The Pope would have been warned about 9/II and the AQ operatives picked up before they'd finished soloing on the Cessnas.
Well, you see the argument. The world we have makes far more sense if lifeforms are evolved, natural accidents are not 'acts of god' and history is random.
Loved the highlighted list AREQUIPA!
Of course. God in all His glory, having fully Created all of This, and now abounding in our daily lives. But nope. NOT A SINGLE INCIDENT! EVER.
(remembering that word unambiguous of course... otherwise we'd all have to go around acknowledging Godly assistance that our shoes got tied properly this morning.)
btw, the paradox & conundrum for the single mono-God (unless perhaps there's two? Or a whole bunch, like a sort of heavenly chess game with opposing teams and such?) is: which side does He favor in wars?
As you probably know, even the SS robots were fond of praying that their God would let them win, at the exact same moment that the Tommys and Canucks in the rain-soaked hedgrows were praying to that same God for Divine Assistance.
"HHHmmmm.... yawn..... Who to help this morning, if only to keep it interesting to the Holy Observational Corps?"
That's the way he writes. This is a bit of a tricky one - rather surprisingly, as I would have thought it was easy to construct a Perfect world that Shewed forth the glory of something other than the operation of natural forces and random factors.
But I found that I was leaving myself open to accusations of postulating what a god would do.
But it has to be tried. No inexplicable natural disasters, Christians getting away with it time after time while the unfaithful get blown away or buried in avalanches, prayers answered up to and including regrowing missing limbs, no lightning strikes or earthquakes hitting churches, nature being a bit less unpleasant than it is and humans being a bit less like animals than we are, angels more visible, God coming across to His spokesmen with pretty astounding knowledge that could only come from Him, if not a few personal appearances to keep us on line, and of course outing a few of the flock who go badly off the rails, just to keep His church pure.
That off the top of my head is a world that we would expect if a God was in charge...oh, yes, of course, the obvious one. Less of the back and forth of warfare. Those on His side would always win. Afghanistan would have been done and dusted by now..hell, it shouldn't have even been necessary. The Pope would have been warned about 9/II and the AQ operatives picked up before they'd finished soloing on the Cessnas.
Well, you see the argument. The world we have makes far more sense if lifeforms are evolved, natural accidents are not 'acts of god' and history is random.
To the OP, from your perspective what kind of world would you find if a creator did exist?
Depends on whether you're positing a fictional "creator" such as the Biblical god or a more intelligent and rational creator.
Last edited by QuixoticHobbit; 01-18-2012 at 12:56 PM..
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